Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[urasim]

They're providing a service that Blizzard does not.

It's still illegal, but Blizzard should really reconsider their stance.

They have. Every time this shit pops up on their forum. They run the numbers and they can't make a profit off it. Do you really think they'd turn down money?

[Aehl]

The reason Nostalrius and many other private servers exist is because the playerbase actually wants something, and Blizzard refuses to give it

..and that justifies stealing?

LMAO NO. Talk about entitled.

Instead we get what? Features that don't make the game anymore enjoyable? Selfie cam anyone? How about twitter integration, I

Then GO PLAY SOMETHING ELSE. How hard is that?

This mentality "They should give me what I want" is fucking hysterical.

[Doomchicken]

You assume developer's aren't going to be bias? Why is that?

They are biased. Biased towards making money and making their shareholders happy. If a classic servers potential profits outweighed the constant costs associated with said classic servers you'd be damned sure they would be biased towards making one.

[Aehl]

Whoa, you sound like the brother of a girl whose ex-boyfriend has been stalking her. Pretty sure Blizzard is a company that welcomes feedback on it's own websites.

Feedback yes theft no.

[zorkuus]

Pretty sure Blizzard is a company that welcomes feedback on it's own websites.

I'm also pretty sure they don't welcome spam threads on the same beaten to death topic.

[PenguinChan]

They have. Every time this shit pops up on their forum. They run the numbers and they can't make a profit off it. Do you really think they'd turn down money?

To some extent every business turns down money in more greedy avenues that would probably net them even more money over time. At least, game companies.

[Jazalak]

~ * Garbage * ~

I'm not seeing any points being made.

[americandavey]

They're providing a service that Blizzard does not.

It's still illegal, but Blizzard should really reconsider their stance.

Well those people should start a gofundme campaign to get blizzard to modified old code to the new filing system, make sure everything works right. modifying 1.12.1 to work with the latest client because cant have 2 different World of Warcraft clients, assigned support staff(which will come from staff making new content), make sure everythings works with Battle.net to get legacy servers. The cost of resources outweigh the benefits of such project.

[Kolvarg]

I don't even really care about whether or not Private servers exist but I can understand Blizzard's point of view and I can't fault them for stopping something that cuts into their bottom line.

Don't think anyone reasonable from either side of the discussion doesn't undesrstand Blizzard's action. There's just a lot of confusion and anger that leads to (extra) silly / senseless comments.

(some of the) People are just upset they aren't able to play the game they love through legit means, and now (one of the) only means they found to be able to do it relatively harmlessly is gone. Add to that hours lost invested in characters, and friendships made unreachable, and it's not hard to at least empathize a bit with them, despite Blizzard being completly in the right and even need of shutting it down to protect their IP.

It's not just a private server and access to Vanilla being shutdown. It's also friendships, guilds and a whole community losing what united them. Yes what united them was illegal / wrong, but that doesn't make it any less "tragic" for them, I'm sure

[RickJamesLich]

This is of course assuming A) someone takes on their code and B) doesn't grow too large to require donations to operate and be shut down again.

Servers are going to be in Russia, where it will be a lot more difficult for blizzard to shut them down.

[zorkuus]

it's not hard to at least empathize a bit with them

It should be, because they should've seen it coming.

[PenguinChan]

It should be, because they should've seen it coming.

It's not hard to empathize, it's just hard to constantly have strong feeling towards them. I think that is the same thing as you said though.

I'm not seeing any points being made.

You don't respond or give them the light of day then, not point out things and try and insult them. It's childish and makes what you post harder to come across as even worth reading or taken seriously.

[Ghier]

Feedback yes theft no.

I haven't ever said Blizzard doesn't have the right to shutdown private servers. Of course they do. We have the right to let them know that we want legacy servers though.

[Actarius]

ok, it seems my poll isn't valid due to bias? why? because a popular classic server actually had appeared? You can use that claim to invalidate any future poll from here to eternity. I am not sure your basis for rejecting the poll I did is actually valid unless you are just saying any poll with a bad result can be claimed invlaid because of forum invaders or something. I do NOT think you would reject my poll if 95% said NO.

I literally said "If you come back in like 10 days with a fresh poll broken down in an orderly, non-leading fashion, that accounts for several use cases, you will sway my mind with numbers." Please don't suggest I read your posts when you cannot give me the same level of respect. I never suggested throwing out polls from here on, I suggested "you need to let the emotions, anger, and steam settle before any reliable data can be collected". That takes a few days. I also never said a poll with a bad result is invalid, which is oxymoronic since polls literally cannot have bad results, only biases data/poor sample sizes. You, personally may feel that the poll is bad, but that doesn't make the poll bad. Bad data and biased sampling does. If you did a poll today and it said 95% no I would also reject it due to high emotions. I'm personally 100% indifferent on the matter, I'm just not a huge fan of people misrepresenting data and statistics for personal benefit.

To elaborate on the issues with your poll, is you asked people who would try a legacy server, not who would willing pay for one. Blizzard isn't interested in a minority of players trying a product, they need it to be profitable. That's a major issue with the poll, it suggests about 49% of players would try a legacy server, I can't imagine all of those people willing to pay for one, but we'd need another poll to figure out who'd want to pay for one.

If you can find polls to the contrary, feel free, and I'd happy accept it and revise my statements. But until then, trending data suggests that people do not want legacy servers. If you can refute that with data, great! If not, please don't reject it because it doesn't help you. Also, the line " it seems my poll isn't valid due to bias? why? because a popular classic server actually had appeared?" is completely true. Any unbiased statistician will agree that your poll has bias in it. I'd be happy to ask some colleagues for confirmation if you want.

How is this -

suggest a poll design. I clearly state in my early comments that I didn't break down by version just to get a general idea on that game-state, with the possibility of further polls in more detail later. DId you read that??

I didn't quote any earlier comments, so it's very easy to draw that I did not read your earlier comments in a 300+ page thread. Especially since I never replied to you, you initiated the conversation, so its up to you to provide information supporting your position, not me to dig through your 4100+ posts to discern your stance. All I read was

"This is fairly straightforward - would you play on an official blizzard server hosting a pre-4.0 realm? (this question ignores how modified such realms might be from the original). Answer is segregated also by whether you are subbed at present.

for my oddball guess, I will guess that 75% will choose the first option."

lets work out agreeable basic questions and format, and a frequency it can be put up, say once every 3 months or whatever? over the next year or two, average them all. no east-anglia-style throwing out the polls you don't like. this isn't climate science.

Your idea of polling over 1-2 years has already been done, which I linked several polls. I can go dig up more without an issue if you want. But I haven't seen a poll, ever, that a majority of people wanted legacy servers. Even the one you posted yourself, 51% of players didn't want a legacy server. I discussed the bias in that poll, but if we want to include it for arguments sake, it still shows that a majority of players do not want a legacy server. (The current numbers are 361 against and 347 for, which could change, but as of posting this reply, a majority was not interested).
In regards to unbiased, well-formulated questions for the polls you're interested in conducting, you'd need to have a discussion with people from both sides until they both can agree to them being unbiased. I'm in the middle, I'm indifferent about the whole private server thing, so I can present some in a few hours if you'd like me to.

you ahve a poll asking if blizzard will or won't. not opinion if people would play. Did you actually read thisone?

a poll from 2010 and 2011, and finally one for classic only from 2014. i am not sure why 2010/11 are even relevant anymore.

Polls are absolutely relevant over time, especially when stances have not changed. Blizzard said no a long time ago, and their stance has been unwavering.

Do you reject climate data over 2-3 years old? Old data (not even old, several polls over several years), doesn't expire just because it doesn't support your conclusions.

And of course I read them, I wrote the line "85% of users feel Blizzard will not create legacy servers", so of course I knew the content of the poll I was linking... Did you even read my post? Please read and digest it before replying. I attempted to cover every point you made, and I would like the respect returned in order for us to achieve an intellectual discussion. I don't want to upset or disrespect you, so please let me know if I have.

[Ghier]

I'm also pretty sure they don't welcome spam threads on the same beaten to death topic.

Yea, they have one thread for the topic just like this site does. That makes sense.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Blizzard: "Okay we'll give you nostalgia servers... just shut up!"
Crowd: "Yay, thank you Blizzard!"

4 months later
Crowd: "Hey Blizzard, what about giving us some new things to do on the nostalgia servers?"
Blizzard: "okay... go play TBC?"
Crowd: "No, not good enough- we're paying for this and we deserve new content!"
Blizzard: "But TBC is ne...."
Crowd: "NO WE WANT VANILLA WITH NEW THINGS!"
Blizzard: "We already made new content- years ago, go play that."
Crowd: "You're just a lazy bunch of money milking bastards!"


^
That's the scenario that would unfold, one hundred percent agree with Blizzard on this stance. Even though I wish I could turn back time and get more experience in Vanilla I'm glad with the road WoW has taken in general, not so much after WotLK/Cata but you know- still the best online co-op game / mmo there is.

[zorkuus]

I haven't ever said Blizzard doesn't have the right to shutdown private servers. Of course they do. We have the right to let them know that we want legacy servers though.

They have the right to not listen and shut down the threads. Win/win (well not for you).

[Actarius]

That's the best part about public polls. You can just pick the ones that support your own opinion!

Feel free to find contrary data. The only poll I found with more people for legacy servers had four replies, which I would argue is not a large enough sample size to suggest anything meaningful.

[Kolvarg]

It should be, because they should've seen it coming.

Every one of us knows we will die someday, doesn't mean it's not justifiable to be upset when you find out you will die.

Knowing it would end someday doesn't make it any different that they were able to do something they enjoy then but not anymore, imo.

But agree to disagree otherwise

[Marakesh]

well also when things get that count they ussauly count all the players that have logged on in a week including

bots
hackers
multiboxers
alt accounts
people who try for 2 days then quit

Which is different from retail WoW how? Also, they were using a 10 day period for their 150k figure while WoW counts anyone subbed during the month. You're right its pointless though. I didn't sign it when it asked for my name and address. Guess I could've made something up, but why bother.

Denying it was a popular server though is pretty crazy. The fallout from this will resonate for a while. You all are kidding yourselves. Its not just the numbers, its the people playing were further into the hardcore base. The anger and negativity here and what I've seen on bnet from the remnants of WoW ... that's also not helping your game. But I guess if it was any good you all wouldn't be camped out on a forum. On the other hand, we have some free time opened up until finding the next thing - Black Desert is intriguing, maybe a revived Nostralius will come to the forefront.