Order Halls = Garrisons

[Lei]

Intereting to read all the comments under that wowhead post. I thought wowhead ppl were more from the "optimistic" side, but even they are not that happy about this

[Unir]

Nah, it's just a hybrid of WoD's Garrison and MoP's Daily Quest Hubs with the better parts of both combined minus the worst bits. Doesn't sound tooo bad.

This is the answer.

Trust me, even seeing that stupid graphic of the mission board makes my stomach churn. Having said that, it will not be like garrisons exactly.

What it will be, and this boggles my mind, is something I will likely have to hold my nose while I do it so that I can enjoy the rest of Legion's content - of which there is a lot it looks like, unlike WoD.

Why would Blizzard include a feature I have to hold my nose to perform? To me that's the odd question. I guess because they didn't want to lose the dev time they had put into that particular feature system, and for the 2.3 people out there who really love the mission table and minions action.

[RigidCannibal]

Haven't we known that Class Halls had missions since Blizzcon? The only new information I see is that followers (not even the champions, only the troops) can die (good, I can replace all the members of the Warlock Hall with Forsaken through intentionally bad objectives) and that they've added some placeholder rewards.

Gotta panic about that placeholder 10 gold in 24 hours!

[Dhrizzle]

Garrisons are terrible in WoD because they are too rewarding and they encourage stacking ludicrous numbers of alts to squeeze the most gold out of them. While managing 1-3 characters isn't that big of a deal, managing 10-50 of them is a nightmare. And you want to keep doing those missions cos they bring so much money. If you skip them you'll fall behind with gold, cos it's losing its value and you need more and more of it.

I think you're doing it wrong. You do content either because you enjoy it or because the reward is great enough that you get a sense of accomplishment that makes up for it. From your unhappiness I get the feeling that the gold wasn't worth the effort you put in, so why did you bother?

nothing has been destroyed

we are simply talking about how it is so much better than the current game.

garrisons destroyed gameplay by automating tasks which involved the character to remain on the same spot... there was 0 gameplay involved... press a button and enjoy the afk experience.

You could always set off your followers then go do something else. If your sat AFK at the mission table all day that's your choice.

You still have reason to connect every 2 hours to do missions otherwise, you can't advance in the game.

Why are you logging in every 2 hours if followers can only do one mission a day?

The problem was that it was implemented at all. Clicking on menus and wait for treat. You might wanna check out the thing called Skinner box. Seriously tho, go and check out Skinner box.

You are the (very happy) pigeon in your Garrison-box.

If you want to view it through that lens the whole WoW experience can be likened to a Skinner box, but you must be really starved of entertainment if you found follower missions to be a compulsive experience worth staying logged in for. I think even pigeons would get bored If they had to wait hours between pressing a button and receiving a minimal reward.

[Deleted]

I'm not particularly opposed to this system, but I don't quite see why it's needed. Don't have alpha access, though.

You keep saying that we, with our chars, will do the missions our followers discover for us after x hours. The question just is..why? If we're just going to do a quest afterwards (which is fine), why do we need followers to discover them? What purpose does this serve gameplay-wise?

[Lei]

If you want to view it through that lens the whole WoW experience can be likened to a Skinner box, but you must be really starved of entertainment if you found follower missions to be a compulsive experience worth staying logged in for. I think even pigeons would get bored If they had to wait hours between pressing a button and receiving a minimal reward.

Skinner box can be alright, when your first thought is NOT "welp, I'm a pigeon pushing buttons in a fu.king box" = follower missions. Engagement, depthness, entertainment. That is what I want from WoW, and I did get those before, without literally clicking a menu and get yums. If you don't see the difference between the two, then I'm really sorry.
Btw, no, if you starve pigeons enough (as Skinner did) pigeons will do it for ages. Because they are STARVED. Now, let us think about how content starved were we in WoD? And what made people do these missions?
Do you think gold missions were an accident in WoD? A shortsight? Interesting if you think this, because who on earth would have done garrison missions if they wouldnt have offered gold? Hm hm mh mhm. Let me guess NOT MANY people? The gold missions were the carrot on the stick, while you were kept content starved, and you happily kept pushing the button to get something. Anything, basically.
Now, moving on to Legion: I'm too pissed about WoD to simply leave my garrison, go to Valhalla (in my case Maelstrom) and start it over again, in any shape or form. And I'm very surprised that someone actually WANTS to do this. In Legion, these missions seem to be only timegates. Inconveniences. Annoyances. Pointless hold-ups. Like can't we get quests without a mission and a 4-5 hour wait attached to it? Hm.

[Deleted]

I wouldn't want to say garrisons are exactly like order halls, but there are definitely similarities in the mission system that worry me. If you read the article you'll find that you can increase mission chance by sending out troops. We also know you may only send out troops once per day. We also know those troops can level up. Here's the kicker: we also know those troops can die. So what we have here is the shipyard 2.0, more than anything. You invest time and resources into troops to level them up, and there's a chance they might just die and all your efforts are wasted.

It also means that since order hall missions are used to unlock content for the player to do, failing a mission, with its subsequent cooldown / timegated element, prevents you, the player, from doing said content, forcing you to wait.

The specifics of this are open to tweaking, and I'm not sure how vital troops are (maybe success chance is decent enough with just the follower..?) so that's hopeful. Maybe you'll never lose troops if the mission success chance is above a certain threshold, or maybe troops are extremely easy to obtain and level up. But that they would implement it this way, to pretty much be like ships in the shipyard, when that is the garrison feature many people disliked the most, is baffling.

[Deleted]

I'm not particularly opposed to this system, but I don't quite see why it's needed. Don't have alpha access, though.

You keep saying that we, with our chars, will do the missions our followers discover for us after x hours. The question just is..why? If we're just going to do a quest afterwards (which is fine), why do we need followers to discover them? What purpose does this serve gameplay-wise?

Exactly this. I would rather just explore the world or walk up to a quest giver by myself, if just fetching things for me to do is the intended purpose. Unless they're once again trying to artificially slow you down in the dullest of ways, but then again they would never do that, right?

[Blayze]

Order Halls: When you're too lazy to create content for the factions, you'd rather stick a load of timers and progress bars in and claim it's emergent gameplay.

[lightofdawn]

they have similar elements, but they're not the same. why dont we wait until they're released to complain? because most of the people who are complaining don't even know what's going on

[IxilaFA]

This is the answer.

Trust me, even seeing that stupid graphic of the mission board makes my stomach churn. Having said that, it will not be like garrisons exactly.

What it will be, and this boggles my mind, is something I will likely have to hold my nose while I do it so that I can enjoy the rest of Legion's content - of which there is a lot it looks like, unlike WoD.

Why would Blizzard include a feature I have to hold my nose to perform? To me that's the odd question. I guess because they didn't want to lose the dev time they had put into that particular feature system, and for the 2.3 people out there who really love the mission table and minions action.

I legitimately enjoyed garrison missions for the first few months the first time around. Will you guys ever accept the fact that some people like things that you don't?

And the main issue with WOD is not garrison missions. Hardly anyone complains about that aspect. It's the fact that missions have to be spammed to be rewarding, and the fact that there's nothing to do besides missions. If missions are in there as a supplementary feature that I manage once a day before moving on to mythic+ or reputation grinds or adventure mode than I'm all for it. If they become the central way to play Legion then it will be disgusting again.

[Marcellus1986]

Yes after waiting for timers...is so much fun. Here is an idea go to the corner of your room and stare at the wall for a bit before you decide to post on the internets.

You're literally the definition of what most people view as a whiny, entitled child and you're trying to project that onto other people. Just lol. Here's a reality check for you: MMOs are grindy. Always have been. If waiting a few hours for a mission to complete is so inconvenient for you, maybe you should try coloring inside the lines. Seems to be more your speed.

[Blayze]

why dont we wait until they're released to complain?

Because that hasn't ever worked the last X number of times someone like you said to "wait and see."

[Onoros]

i'm disgusted, but not shocked

[PragmaticGamer]

It is my understanding (and I could be wrong, since I'm not following that closely...) that the mission system for Legion is going to be scouting reports, and once the follower comes back, they send YOU out on a mission.

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Why are you logging in every 2 hours if followers can only do one mission a day?

I think (at least in the case of the nameless soldiers?) it's three missions per day (the three "hearts" they have, I recall it being mentioned in the wowhead article).

And logging in every 2 hours? Yeah, I can see that. Unless all the missions for the day appear at server reset, you're going to see some missions taking (let's say for the sake of argument) 30 minutes and some taking four hours. So you log in again after a couple hours to see what was the result, and if any new/interesting ones spawned.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm not particularly opposed to this system, but I don't quite see why it's needed. Don't have alpha access, though.

You keep saying that we, with our chars, will do the missions our followers discover for us after x hours. The question just is..why? If we're just going to do a quest afterwards (which is fine), why do we need followers to discover them? What purpose does this serve gameplay-wise?

Okay, that's a good question...

Hadn't thought of that. A bad run of RNG could mean that the Class Order Hall quest hub gives you nothing one day, and on a busy day, you could end up with more quests than you can do.

******
(And cool system this forum has, lumping multiple replies into one post. )

[Aggrophobic]

Oh boy. They never learn. No wonder ppl want to play Vanilla.

http://www.wowhead.com/news=252294/h...campaign-works

It's nothing like the garrison. It's a quest hub where you and other players of the same class get your quests. It has none of the "convenient" features that the garrisons has like maliboxes, AH, profession buildings or anything like that. You do the quests, not your followers.

You'll spend most of your downtime in Dalaran for sure but you will pick up quite a few quests in the order halls.

Not sure what it is you're looking for and when you add no suggestions or are you just complaining for the sole reason of complaining?

[Eazy]

Fixed that for you, you don't speak for everyone. People really need to stop posting as if they do.

No, to be honest I liked Garrisons, but I saw really many negative feedback about it. I tried to speak for the community, but not for myself.

[PragmaticGamer]

It's nothing like the garrison. It's a quest hub where you and other players of the same class get your quests.

That does bring up an interesting topic.

With other quest hubs in previous expansions, it was possible (though I rarely did it--I'm mostly a solo player) to group up into even a dungeon five-man-band (anything from "two characters" to "healer, tank, and three DPS").

Will that be as easy with the class order halls' missions-turn-into-quests?

For instance, if I get Mission A (go kill demons in this area), and my friend gets Mission B (loot resources from this other area), will we (a general "we") be able to group up and share our missions? Or will we be even more solo-play, since we don't have compatible quests? (If it's the latter, that could be interesting, since people embracing the grouping would get a double advantage--easier questing and faster progression through the artifacts.)

Note this is an "I'm not in the Alpha, so I haven't any idea" question, not a "snarky criticism" question.

[Aggrophobic]

That does bring up an interesting topic.

With other quest hubs in previous expansions, it was possible (though I rarely did it--I'm mostly a solo player) to group up into even a dungeon five-man-band (anything from "two characters" to "healer, tank, and three DPS").

Will that be as easy with the class order halls' missions-turn-into-quests?

For instance, if I get Mission A (go kill demons in this area), and my friend gets Mission B (loot resources from this other area), will we (a general "we") be able to group up and share our missions? Or will we be even more solo-play, since we don't have compatible quests? (If it's the latter, that could be interesting, since people embracing the grouping would get a double advantage--easier questing and faster progression through the artifacts.)

Note this is an "I'm not in the Alpha, so I haven't any idea" question, not a "snarky criticism" question.

I haven't tried that as I'm the only one I know thats actually in the alpha. It's a good question though. You can no doubt focus on the same zones but the same quests? Not sure.

[Sencha]

I mean... let's be real, the quest table in the Garrisons was not the issue with them.

Of course it was. I play WoW to play my char, not a mindless drag and drop facebook game that is mandatory to unlock all the artifact sockets.