Anyone else ever had the thought we aren't the smartest beings on earth?

[Gib Lover]

No truly top of the food chain was a bad representation of what i was trying to get across. Only reason that slipped out is because of how deeply tied that is to being "smart" and it even affected me in this case.

I am more looking at a philosophical approach here. I feel humans simply overcomplicate things, lets leave animals out of this entirely for a second. Who lived a better life, a couple who enjoyed each others company for many years (including indulging in what the planet has to offer, food being the main one) or someone who made a mint off the stock market but in the process pushed him family away in the process. Animals have this stuff figured out at the onset of life, they wont die with regret because they dont even have that in their vocabulary.

They don't have it figured out because they are too stupid to realize it exists in the first place. If the crux of your argument is that a mountain lion lives a better life because it never drove away it's family in pursuit of being a Wall Street stockbroker then you really don't have a good argument.

[Egregious]

If you honestly think most people wouldn't last a single day in the wild you are delusional. You could literally sit in a single place for an entire 24 hour cycle and be fine, if anything just a bit hungry.
Humans would also instinctively, and intelligently, band together.
The exact situation you are putting humans in already happened, it's called literally all the time before civilization.

Yeah, but you could argue certain groups of people wouldn't make it, which is true for certain.

I also think the hypothetical here was just take Joe Schmoe out of the office and plop him in the jungle sans tribe. Will he survive? I'd say 50/50 for the average person of 2016. To be honest, probably less because the untamed wild cannot support the population of people we have today.

[Fascinate]

I wish i didn't have to post this but:

The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing. Socrates
Read more at: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...tes101212.html

What this means in laymans terms is never stop learning. Dont get caught in that trap, keep thinking because there is always something (or some being) smarter than you. Push our species forward, even if you believe we are at the top.

[talwynn]

Humans are the smartest beings on the planet. Just look at how you are communicating now. Through a series of silicon chips arranged in a manner to allow you to type a simple text phase in a language understood by a gigantic population of your species that is then sent to possibly millions of other people across the globe. Sure some animals have complex societies and social structures. And they can sometimes build marvelous things. But what other species has harnessed the power of the atom? What other creature has developed mechanical flight?

Sure you can train a dog to open a refrigerator to get you a drink, but it doesn't not have the intelligence to conceptualize, design, and then build that refrigerator. The Infinite Monkey Theorem dictates that if you put 100 chimps in a room with 100 typewriters and enough time, you will almost surely get Hamlet, but in all honesty, all you will get is a room full of shit.

[Egregious]

I wish i didn't have to post this but:

The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing. Socrates
Read more at: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...tes101212.html

What this means in laymans terms is never stop learning. Dont get caught in that trap, keep thinking because there is always something (or some being) smarter than you. Push our species forward, even if you believe we arent at the top.

There is thinking progressively and thinking regressively and thinking sophomorically. Identify which you are doing.

[Gib Lover]

Yeah, but you could argue certain groups of people wouldn't make it, which is true for certain.

I also think the hypothetical here was just take Joe Schmoe out of the office and plop him in the jungle sans tribe. Will he survive? I'd say 50/50 for the average person of 2016. To be honest, probably less because the untamed wild cannot support the population of people we have today.

Oh for sure, 2016 man has nothing on the survival skills of 10,000 BC man, but I still think we at a primal level have it hardwired in our heads how to survive. 50/50 is probably appropriate odds, though.

[Gilgemesh]

An actual interesting question might be if we wouldn't have more of it (instinct) if we allowed for natural selection to function more freely.

Now that is a valid idea. It does seem that humans that live in remote, difficult to survive in areas form VASTLY different social structures. When educated, it seems they retain this sort of survival-decision making. The same thing happens to war torn and deserted/shipwrecked people who have survived tough situations. It's like the brain remembers how to survive and once this is activated, it sticks around for quite some time.

[Fascinate]

Humans are the smartest beings on the planet. Just look at how you are communicating now. Through a series of silicon chips arranged in a manner to allow you to type a simple text phase in a language understood by a gigantic population of your species that is then sent to possibly millions of other people across the globe. Sure some animals have complex societies and social structures. And they can sometimes build marvelous things. But what other species has harnessed the power of the atom? What other creature has developed mechanical flight?

Sure you can train a dog to open a refrigerator to get you a drink, but it doesn't not have the intelligence to conceptualize, design, and then build that refrigerator. The Infinite Monkey Theorem dictates that if you put 100 chimps in a room with 100 typewriters and enough time, you will almost surely get Hamlet, but in all honesty, all you will get is a room full of shit.

Again another person that does not get it lol. This only lends creedence to my original hypothesis.

[Gib Lover]

Humans are the smartest beings on the planet. Just look at how you are communicating now. Through a series of silicon chips arranged in a manner to allow you to type a simple text phase in a language understood by a gigantic population of your species that is then sent to possibly millions of other people across the globe. Sure some animals have complex societies and social structures. And they can sometimes build marvelous things. But what other species has harnessed the power of the atom? What other creature has developed mechanical flight?

Sure you can train a dog to open a refrigerator to get you a drink, but it doesn't not have the intelligence to conceptualize, design, and then build that refrigerator. The Infinite Monkey Theorem dictates that if you put 100 chimps in a room with 100 typewriters and enough time, you will almost surely get Hamlet, but in all honesty, all you will get is a room full of shit.

OP already said it's off limits to actually talk about how smart we are when talking about intelligence. I know, it's about as dumb as it sounds.

[Simulacrum]

Animals have this stuff figured out at the onset of life, they wont die with regret because they dont even have that in their vocabulary.

Animals don't have anything "figured out"; they're slaves to their instincts and are instantly destroyed by even tiny changes to their environment.

They don't have "regret" in their vocabulary because they don't have a vocabulary; they aren't intelligent enough to.

If you really somehow think that being too stupid to understand the world around you is a good thing, put your money where your mouth is and lobotomize yourself to enjoy the bliss, leaving the rest of us to suffer from the horrible curse of being smarter than you. At least with your ability to communicate gone, those of us whose minds still retain the ability to entertain abstract concepts like this won't have to endure the suffering of being exposed to your brilliant ideas. Clearly, it's win-win. Do it. Do it now.

[Deleted]

One human is intelligent. Masses aren't.

[Fascinate]

There is thinking progressively and thinking regressively and thinking sophomorically. Identify which you are doing.

I dont subscribe to that manner of thinking. You are abandoning socrates by speaking in those terms, my thread is at the root of what he was talking about. Lets not massage our egos here, lets think about what is TRULY important in life and decide if we are actually the most "intelligent" beings residing on this planet.

[Egregious]

Seriously, just stop replying to the guy, he's just going to intentionally keep leading you in circles.

Maybe he'll ever reply to me. What do you think?

*Edit: Speaking of, he did!

[Simulacrum]

One human is intelligent. Masses aren't.

Incidentally, our civilization stands as irrefutable proof of such idiotic platitudes.

[WernerCD]

Intelligence is completely subjective as we all know. Extrapolate that to the extreme, are we smarter than animals because we can build skyscrapers or map our DNA? Or is it possible animals are smarter because they know burdening yourself with such things is an exercise in futility.

I have always heard people say we are at the top of the food chain because we are the only species that posses the ability to express empathy, but maybe its the complete opposite.

I just get really sick of people patting themselves on the back lol. We arent that smart, sure we have accomplished some things but we also have debilitating flaws that no other species in the animal kingdom has.

We aren't that smart... look at all the people voting for Hillary or Bern... or all the college kids that now need "safe spaces" when something irritates their precious delicacies... We've obviously started the precipitous slide towards Idiocracy.

Hopefully the smarter animals - like cows and dolphins - can survive the coming wave of stupidity...

[Deleted]

I am more looking at a philosophical approach here. I feel humans simply overcomplicate things, lets leave animals out of this entirely for a second. Who lived a better life, a couple who enjoyed each others company for many years (including indulging in what the planet has to offer, food being the main one) or someone who made a mint off the stock market but in the process pushed him family away in the process. Animals have this stuff figured out at the onset of life, they wont die with regret because they dont even have that in their vocabulary.

This is not a question of intelligence though, but rather what it means to "have a good life", which is completely subjective.

Also humans aren't overcomplicating everything, their lives are just inherently more complex, both due to our society and our higher intelligence.

I wish i didn't have to post this but:

The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing. Socrates
Read more at: -snip-

What this means in laymans terms is never stop learning. Dont get caught in that trap, keep thinking because there is always something (or some being) smarter than you. Push our species forward, even if you believe we are at the top.

That is not what that quote means AT ALL, have you actually read any Socrates?

[Fascinate]

I think that other people have created some interesting discussion on this topic, but Fascinate himself is just here to mess with people.

I don't think that is fair. I am alone here and need to fend off a lot of people just to get my point across. I have said many times in this thread but i guess i need to say it again, this isnt about the human definition of intelligence its about thinking outside the box and coming up with a new definition that does not massage our egos.

[Egregious]

I dont subscribe to that manner of thinking. You are abandoning socrates by speaking in those terms, my thread is at the root of what he was talking about. Lets not massage our egos here, lets think about what is TRULY important in life and decide if we are actually the most "intelligent" beings residing on this planet.

I've stated some of my beliefs in this thread already. Appreciation is a derivative of our ability to conceptualize and compare. I don't know of any other animal that can do that so I would argue that no other animal enjoys their life at all, not in the same way as any of us may. Can they be content? Yes. So can you. Can they live in serenity and bliss as I think you're postulating? No.

Also, Socrates was being hyperbolic to encourage discourse. Think a little.

Nietzsche concludes nothing in our universe has any meaning (your importance). Ergo anything you want to have importance has importance. The ability to assign importance (aka meaning) allows you to choose your own happiness. Only we can do this. Do you really think the sheep feels they lead a good life? Really, really, really think about that for a moment, I entreat you.

[Xar226]

Intelligence is completely subjective as we all know.

I don't agree with the premise. There are certainly different kinds of intelligence but I wouldn't say intelligence itself is subjective.

Second, any time you have to preface a question with something like "extrapolate that to the extreme," you know you aren't going anywhere good. Extrapolation is already error-prone and when you recognize in advance that it's not even enough and you have to go "extreme" on it to get to the premise, and you're basically just saying "let's talk about this thing that isn't actually a thing."

Taking the question at face value, no, we're still smarter. Why would skyscrapers be an exercise in futility? If they aren't needed we don't have to build them, but having the knowledge to do so has definite value. Meanwhile look at a place like Tokyo, Japan, where they are virtually necessary. Mapping DNA being futile doesn't even deserve a comment; so much good has already come from our knowledge of the genome that I can't even fathom why you would suggest it. With just about every possible measure of intelligence, humans would come out on top. And the reason we're on the top of the food chain is very simple: We have the knowledge and ability to create tools. The smartest animals on Earth share this concept, but at an undeniably more primitive level. ("Smash thing with other thing" is an extremely high level of functioning in the animal kingdom, but humans got past that level a couple thousand years ago.)

That's not to say we are superior in every way. Animals are usually stronger than we are (on a size/weight basis), and they either have stronger instincts or are just built to listen to their instincts more, which is often helpful. We may be hurting our species from a "survival of the fittest" standpoint with all the things our intelligence has allowed us to do. We definitely suffer emotional/psychological issues more frequently than animals. Many if not most animals have at least one sense that is vastly superior to our own. But raw intelligence? Sorry man. Whatever your distaste for "patting [ourselves] on the back," we're on top on that one.

[Kalador]

I find that when someone needs to preface their comments with, "Have an open mind", the thing they're going to tell me next is generally bullshit.

Remember to not have a mind that's so open that just anything can wander into it.

Yeah true it's so much better to camp on one position. especially when we are talking about a subjet that science is far from understanding... And that we are far from expert in that domain.

People learn and improve there knowledge by reading and exposing yourself to other idea even if you don't agree with it... not by blatantly dismissing other point of view.