Why don't refugees stay and fight

[Azadina]

Why the hell would someone run to a country with nothing? That's obvious that they wouldn't be capable of receiving help that way. It's a shame these refugees are more intelligent than you to understand why you don't run to a poor country if you need assistance.

Yeah, this part isn't really rocket science. If you have nothing on you but your clothes, then obviously you'd try to find a place that might offer some help, instead of well, nothing.

[Damajin]

Why the hell would someone run to a country with nothing? That's obvious that they wouldn't be capable of receiving help that way. It's a shame these refugees are more intelligent than you to understand why you don't run to a poor country if you need assistance.

They passed through plenty of countries with enough resources to provide for basic amenities, especially in tandem with international aid which everyone knows would come. Along the way while going to Germany, Sweden and the sort they took all sorts of supplies from those countries and trashed the areas they went through, so this is all about gimme more gimme more put me up in a nice fancy house with a job and a car and everything paid for, not about survival.

[Slant]

Should I have used my usual description of "space unicorn"?

Hey, call it whatever you like. I'm cool with skywizard. But it's a bit hypocritical to ask for tolerance in the same sentence you're disrespecting their religion.

[Azadina]

Hey, call it whatever you like. I'm cool with skywizard. But it's a bit hypocritical to ask for tolerance in the same sentence you're disrespecting their religion.

Their religion and culture disrespects me first As in women being just property for men.

[TrumpIsPresident]

Why do they not fight to make their own countries better rather than coming to the west and try and turn western countries into the shitholes they come from.

They were fighting and have been.

The common misconception of the "informed and educated" is that these people are all just innocents who got caught up in a war, they aren't.

This is all part of a tribal Islam-based conflict that has been going on forever.

The tribal DNA, if you will, of the Middle East is vast and complex and we do it justice to just lump them all under one label; "Muslims".

These "refugees" are simply the losing side of one specific tribal battle.

[Slant]

Their religion and culture disrespects me first As in women being just property for men.

That's a harsh misrepresentation of their religion and has been debunked countless times already. But even if you firmly believe that, they're hardly affecting you. Or are you running around in a Burqa as the property of your man? If not, wth are you on about?

[Azadina]

That's a harsh misrepresentation of their religion and has been debunked countless times already. But even if you firmly believe that, they're hardly affecting you. Or are you running around in a Burqa as the property of your man? If not, wth are you on about?

No way is it debunked. Women in those countries have no way near the same rights as men do. Pretty sure even their holy book tells a pretty definite story of womans role. So does the bible, but west has moved more from following it to the letter as far as law is concerned. Also, I didn't say it affects me personally, but neither should my skywizard comment affect them

[Slant]

No way is it debunked. Women in those countries have no way near the same rights as men do. Pretty sure even their holy book tells a pretty definite story of womans role. So does the bible, but west has moved more from following it to the letter as far as law is concerned. Also, I didn't say it affects me personally, but neither should my skywizard comment affect them

Did it ever occur to you that those restrictions on women may be attributed to the country's rules rather than the religion? Perhaps it's the gouvernments being behind the times?

No, they probably won't care about a random stranger posting on an internet forum. But if you want to make a point, being hypocritical isn't exactly the smartest way to do it. And don't count on any of them taking you seriously with that attitude.

[Joathen]

No way is it debunked. Women in those countries have no way near the same rights as men do. Pretty sure even their holy book tells a pretty definite story of womans role. So does the bible, but west has moved more from following it to the letter as far as law is concerned. Also, I didn't say it affects me personally, but neither should my skywizard comment affect them

Sadly this is true today, hasn't always been the case though- Iran in the 70's looked quite secular and moderate compared to what they have now. :/

[Slant]

If I went to Syria, I would refrain from making fun of their culture ( I want to keep my head between my shoulders).
But here in the west, where making fun of the church (like life of brian etc) actually got us out of these dogmatic cults.
Im not gonna stop doing it to people who want to bring that kind of culture back here.

The refugees are entitled to safety, but not for me to "respect" their superstition, that superstition is one of the reasons they are fleeing, and it was like that for us europeans when the church was at its highest.

Tolerance, my friend. It means you accept them being who they are and believing in what they believe in despite you knowing better. There's no reason for you to insult their religion. It's not necessary for anything. It's just a personally driven insult to slight them. That's kinda like the opposite of tolerance.

[Theinquisition]

Why do they not fight to make their own countries better rather than coming to the west and try and turn western countries into the shitholes they come from.

A lot of blood was given to make the west great as it is today. These people and countries need to go through the same process instead of moving their problem onto peaceful countries.

2 reasons the way I see it.

1. They are cowards who are unwilling to defend their homes and families.

2. They are migrating to get welfare benefits from wealthy European countries.

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Did it ever occur to you that those restrictions on women may be attributed to the country's rules rather than the religion? Perhaps it's the gouvernments being behind the times?

No, they probably won't care about a random stranger posting on an internet forum. But if you want to make a point, being hypocritical isn't exactly the smartest way to do it. And don't count on any of them taking you seriously with that attitude.

ME governments and religious beliefs are intertwined.

[Azadina]

And don't count on any of them taking you seriously with that attitude.

There's a flipside to that coin. Should I take someone seriously who believes lord of the rings trilogy has been real life events?

[Slant]

ME governments and religious beliefs are intertwined.

Yet, Saudi Arabia and Dubai differ wildly in their application. See, once you have a religion as malleable as Islam, it's not really about the big rulebook, it's about the gouvernment and what they want.

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There's a flipside to that coin. Should I take someone seriously who believes lord of the rings trilogy has been real life events?

Meh, you're not comparing religions that existed for well over 1000 years to a fictional book that has never made the claim to reflect actual real world events? I mean, that's just pathetic...

Also, LotR drew heavily on actual historic happenings. There was a lot of inspiration from various events happening in human history, that's undisputed. But inspiration != belief.

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I never claimed to be tolerant, and I am not =)

I have no tolerance for brainwashing cults, that end up hurting people. I see your point, and it would probably apply, if i wanted to tolerate it.

But I dont =)

I would have called it beeing lax and complaceant about other peoples struggle, when I see how many woman and children suffer from this.

I call it their problem, not ours. *shrug*

Normal process of evolution. They'll either kill each other off, more space for us. Or they'll figure out what we did a long time ago and join us in a civilised global community.

[Azadina]

Meh, you're not comparing religions that existed for well over 1000 years to a fictional book that has never made the claim to reflect actual real world events? I mean, that's just pathetic...

Also, LotR drew heavily on actual historic happenings. There was a lot of inspiration from various events happening in human history, that's undisputed. But inspiration != belief.

And why would those books be of any more wrong to believe in? Only because they don't claim to be something they are not?

[l33t]

Well, I have two opinions, anti-infraction one and real one. Choose whatever fits you.

Anti-infraction one is they are weak, poor tortured souls who desperately seek help from their western human brothers.

The real one is they just don't give a fuck about their country and instead want to have fun living on easy welfare money eating drugs, drinking alcohol and raping european women. If it was my decision, no refugee men could be allowed, only women and children aged less than 12 years old. Let me tell you a real story. A random refugee in Italy receives more money in welfare than an Italian citizen - who worked all his life for Italy and payed taxes for his whole life - receives in pension. Do you think that is fair, good or morally right? I think that is idiotic. Why would anyone want to be a citizen of such country, a country which values random dipshit over a working, patriotic citizen? Why would anyone want to pay taxes for such country?

[Slant]

And why would those books be of any more wrong to believe in? Only because they don't claim to be something they are not?

I can believe my cookbook is a story based on true events. But it's really just a cookbook. You're basically saying everyone believing in god is an actual, certified nutjob and belongs in an asylum. While I personally don't see a fault in that logic chain, society has accepted them as a tolerable level of crazy. Unlike me beliving in my cookbook telling the true story of the creation of Earth. Just as an example.

[Azadina]

I can believe my cookbook is a story based on true events. But it's really just a cookbook. You're basically saying everyone believing in god is an actual, certified nutjob and belongs in an asylum. While I personally don't see a fault in that logic chain, society has accepted them as a tolerable level of crazy. Unlike me beliving in my cookbook telling the true story of the creation of Earth. Just as an example.

Well, we place people claiming to be napoleon in asylums and so on. Anyway, like I said, people can believe in whatever they want, aslong as it isn't harming others. As far as proof and facts go however, bible, quran, your cookbook and lotr books have all just about as much or as little to do with provable reality as the next

I'll go believe in good nights sleep for now

[Slant]

Well, we place people claiming to be napoleon in asylums and so on. Anyway, like I said, people can believe in whatever they want, aslong as it isn't harming others. As far as proof and facts go however, bible, quran, your cookbook and lotr books have all just about as much or as little to do with provable reality as the next

Bow down to the Holy Potato and its disciples the Holy Fries!

[May90]

Did it ever occur to you that those restrictions on women may be attributed to the country's rules rather than the religion? Perhaps it's the gouvernments being behind the times?

It is difficult to say. While Islam teachings, indeed, are pretty discriminatory towards women, throughout the history, until the recent 100 years or so, women in most countries in the region in most historical periods enjoyed relative freedoms, and even such things as belly dancing thrived there sometimes, signifying women being the same focus of sexual culture as they are in modern Western societies. It might be that, like any religion, Islam interpreted differently by different societies, and the people in charge play a great role in determining that interpretation. Khomeini was a very orthodox Muslim, he took what was written in Quran almost literally and put it all to practice. While, say, Pahlavi was much more liberal in his interpretation of the book and allowed people, for the most part, to take as much out of Quran as they wanted. Hence such a strong difference between position of women in Iran in 60-s and, say, 80-s.

[Slant]

It is difficult to say. While Islam teachings, indeed, are pretty discriminatory towards women, throughout the history, until the recent 100 years or so, women in most countries in the region in most historical periods enjoyed relative freedoms, and even such things as belly dancing thrived there sometimes, signifying women being the same focus of sexual culture as they are in modern Western societies. It might be that, like any religion, Islam interpreted differently by different societies, and the people in charge play a great role in determining that interpretation. Khomeini was a very orthodox Muslim, he took what was written in Quran almost literally and put it all to practice. While, say, Pahlavi was much more liberal in his interpretation of the book and allowed people, for the most part, to take as much out of Quran as they wanted. Hence such a strong difference between position of women in Iran in 60-s and, say, 80-s.

Yep, that's what I meant. I try to write less walls of texts, since people tend to assume I'm being all emotional and shit.