Anime Thigh Thread II

[Hellravager]

This is reminding me of shimoneta...

That would be a shitty time for males and maybe females too

[Neichus]

I can honestly see that happening in the future.

I...highly doubt it.

I do, however, think we're coming to an appreciation that unrestricted access to sexual content has resulted in negative consequences and that mass consumption of pornography may constitute a public health concern. While I personally suspect that fictional depictions of such things also results in similar effects, given how humans work, I am not aware of any research that explicitly establishes the connection.

[Artorius]

I am not aware of any research that explicitly establishes the connection.

It would also be very hard to conclude anything with a research because you can't really isolate the variable and compare results. That's why most of those psychology related studies end up creating more theories, which in fact are merely different opinions.

[Hellravager]

I...highly doubt it.

I do, however, think we're coming to an appreciation that unrestricted access to sexual content has resulted in negative consequences and that mass consumption of pornography may constitute a public health concern. While I personally suspect that fictional depictions of such things also results in similar effects, given how humans work, I am not aware of any research that explicitly establishes the connection.

If you actually restricted sexual content on the internet, things would probably be far worse. Unless you can install something on someone that alerts the nearby authorities whenever someone gets a demented thought

[Neichus]

It would also be very hard to conclude anything with a research because you can't really isolate the variable and compare results. That's why most of those psychology related studies end up creating more theories, which in fact are merely different opinions.

Throwing up hands and saying, "it is difficult to isolate variables" isn't really the answer. Psychology has a bad reputation as a soft science, which is slowly changing as it is usurped by neuropsychology. The days of acting as though we don't know what is going on inside a human's head are coming to a close.

If you actually restricted sexual content on the internet, things would probably be far worse.

I'm interested in how you back that statement up. Availability is half the battle. It's like saying that surrounding a dieter with food should have no impact, since they could get food anyway. It's simply not an accurate portrayal of human behavior.

[Hellravager]

I'm interested in how you back that statement up. Availability is half the battle. It's like saying that surrounding a dieter with food should have no impact, since they could get food anyway. It's simply not an accurate portrayal of human behavior.

Your probably one of those people that think its okay to block everything and will think that everything afterwards is going to be perfectly fine, >.> it definitely wont be.

[Artorius]

Throwing up hands and saying, "it is difficult to isolate variables" isn't really the answer. Psychology has a bad reputation as a soft science, which is slowly changing as it is usurped by neuropsychology. The days of acting as though we don't know what is going on inside a human's head are coming to a close.

We still can't understand most of the human brain, but I guess I'm being severe with it since I'm from an area that things need to be way more concrete to be even considered as a theory.

But in this case in particular I really can't see how you could even test it, there's no way to do a valid experiment without way too many exterior influences or random variables affecting the results.

There's no way to pull a Skinner for example:

[Neichus]

Your probably one of those people that think its okay to block everything and will think that everything afterwards is going to be perfectly fine, >.> it definitely wont be.

You know, I had a distinct thought to myself right before I hit post: "I should put a spoiler at the bottom here. I should predict how the first response will be to assume I have an ideological or moral basis for my position. Then, after I clarify that I do not, the next inevitable argument will be one concerning personal freedoms and being allowed to do what you want with yourself."

But back to your post: While I am seeking to block certain things, such as child pornography, I do not believe it would be feasible to block all pornography. Merely make it less convenient to acquire.

[Artorius]

Your probably one of those people that think its okay to block everything and will think that everything afterwards is going to be perfectly fine, >.> it definitely wont be.

Actually he just wants you to elaborate on your arguments rather than just saying what you think about it.

[Neichus]

There's no way to pull a Skinner for example:

Well, that is the glorious thing. We are having to rely less and less on external cues and are able to directly access how the brain responds to situations. I'm not saying that we know everything, but we are coming closer to the point that we don't have to rely on statistical correlation and speculation for understanding what happens on the inside.

Skinner would also turn over in his grave if he saw his name above the paragraph I put above.

[Epuration]

But back to your post: While I am seeking to block certain things, such as child pornography, I do not believe it would be feasible to block all pornography. Merely make it less convenient to acquire.

So you want everyone to do what briton did and make people need to call in to have porn activated?

[Hellravager]

Actually he just wants you to elaborate on your arguments rather than just saying what you think about it.

Well okay

1. Most teens have problems with controlling their hormones and the outlet besides for sex is straight up easy access porn, now take that away what happens?
2. Most guys in general even if they're married look at porn as an outlet for some of their fantasies that they cant do in RL because of the fact thats its too depraved or that their wife wont do it, take that away and what happens? For both its stress and mildly starting to lose the chains on their rationality due to no outlet.

[Artorius]

Well, that is the glorious thing. We are having to rely less and less on external cues and are able to directly access how the brain responds to situations. I'm not saying that we know everything, but we are coming closer to the point that we don't have to rely on statistical correlation and speculation for understanding what happens on the inside.

But that just decreases the credibility of the "research" and you'll end up as I said before, with a new theory.

Skinner would also turn over in his grave if he saw his name above the paragraph I put above.

Of course he would. You can be sure of that.

[Neichus]

So you want everyone to do what briton did and make people need to call in to have porn activated?

Maybe. Do you have a source for me to read up on that? I did some brief scanning, but I'll admit my Google skills for "British pornography law" didn't turn up much.

Well okay

1. Most teens have problems with controlling their hormones and the outlet besides for sex is straight up easy access porn, now take that away what happens?
2. Most guys in general even if they're married look at porn as an outlet for some of their fantasies that they cant do in RL because of the fact thats its too depraved or that their wife wont do it, take that away and what happens? For both its stress and mildly starting to lose the chains on their rationality due to no outlet.

So, let me be clear on your argument: "Normally functioning males have sexual demands that exceed their circumstances to be met. Pornography allows them to meet those demands without causing trouble to anybody else." If I am wrong in my interpretation, feel free to clarify.

If this accurate, my first comment is that sexual demands are not fixed. Easy supply creates demand. The original impulse isn't at fault; it's the fact that it is so easy to meet it that is cause for concern. The basic problem is that instant gratification short-circuits our reward system. And because it's so easy to meet, it creates a demand for more rather than satiating a set appetite.

- - - Updated - - -

But that just decreases the credibility of the "research" and you'll end up as I said before, with a new theory.

I...don't understand your answer. The reason psychology has the wishy-washy reputation that it does is because when all is said and done, we don't have access to the actual mental states of a person. All we could do was analyze what we saw from the outside and limit ourselves to self-reports from people.

Neuroscience completely avoids this. If a part of the brain lights up under a scan, it is in use. If you know what that part does, you are given insight into what the brain is doing at that time. Working on the assumption that brain states relate to mental states (an assumption that is very safe), this means that it is possible to know how something is being processed and experienced by the person.

[Epuration]

Maybe. Do you have a source for me to read up on that? I did some brief scanning, but I'll admit my Google skills for "British pornography law" didn't turn up much.

In 2013, Prime Minister David Cameron announced plans which would cause internet pornography to be filtered by default in the UK. These plans mean that by the end of 2014, the access of internet porn will be blocked unless subscribers specifically 'opt out' by contacting their ISP. These plans were put forward in efforts to reduce the number of children having access to pornography on the Internet. They were criticised as likely to sweep up non-pornographic content, disclose intimate information to the government, and as unwarranted censorship.[24] In December 2014, the jurisdiction of the BBFC was extended to include pornography available over video on demand and streaming platforms, effectively aligning internet pornography laws with the Video Recordings Act 1984. This brought a renewed controversy over the banning of depiction of certain sex acts including depictions "physical or verbal abuse", "roleplay as non-adults", urolagnia, and female ejaculation, among others.

[Neichus]

@Epuration Thank you, although unfortunately that doesn't comment on the efficacy (or lack thereof) of the efforts. I'm trying to find something on that.

On an unrelated note, my favorite YouTube comment of the day:
"Clementine's VA is amazing; somebody should give her a big hug."

[Epuration]

@Epuration Thank you, although unfortunately that doesn't comment on the efficacy (or lack thereof) of the efforts. I'm trying to find something on that.

Yeah, it never affected me so I never really followed up on it. I just remembered when it was announced.

[Hellravager]

So, let me be clear on your argument: "Normally functioning males have sexual demands that exceed their circumstances to be met. Pornography allows them to meet those demands without causing trouble to anybody else." If I am wrong in my interpretation, feel free to clarify.

If this accurate, my first comment is that sexual demands are not fixed. Easy supply creates demand. The original impulse isn't at fault; it's the fact that it is so easy to meet it that is cause for concern. The basic problem is that instant gratification short-circuits our reward system. And because it's so easy to meet, it creates a demand for more rather than satiating a set appetite.

So what your saying is, that if anyone has a sexual need that the circumstances around them doesnt allow they're by your logic not normal? Also so what if its easy to meet? Still brings up the point that if you take that away from people, your policing them and taking away their free rights to do whatever that they want to do within the rights of the laws. If it wasnt so easy anymore then that'd still be cause for concern since humanity in general is a big pile of shit. Cant control what everyone does, the US is trying and so far it isnt working for us.

[Artorius]

I...don't understand your answer. The reason psychology has the wishy-washy reputation that it does is because when all is said and done, we don't have access to the actual mental states of a person. All we could do was analyze what we saw from the outside and limit ourselves to self-reports from people.

And we still don't. We barely know what's going on to actually use it as arguments. Humans aren't math equations and even if we could entirely understand our brains we still wouldn't be able to prove any of those theories because you can't eliminate external influences and humans also have free will.

It's not like with pigeons where you have incentive > behavior at classical behaviorism or incentive > reinforcement > behavior like Skinner.

Humans actually think and can display different behaviors for the same circunstances so those studies won't really ever be able to prove anything. They just create different ways of explaining certain observable behaviors.

Neuroscience completely avoids this. If a part of the brain lights up under a scan, it is in use. If you know what that part does, you are given insight into what the brain is doing at that time. Working on the assumption that brain states relate to mental states (an assumption that is very safe), this means that it is possible to know how something is being processed and experienced by the person.

"lights up" barely tells you anything about what's happening. That's an outside observation that can only analyse inputs and outputs (in fact it doesn't even do that entirely, you don't get the actual output you just know that there is an output).

That's the same as typing mmo-champion.com at your browser and seeing the Web page loaded after a second, you can see the output but asymptotically speaking you have no idea about what's really going on inside the "black box".

[Neichus]

So what your saying is, that if anyone has a sexual need that the circumstances around them doesnt allow they're by your logic not normal?

No. My argument focused on your claim that pornography fill a static need. I am saying that enhances that need, not fulfills it.

That said, here is a key question: what is a sexual need? It's not like food where you don't get it and you die. But at the same time, we've come to appreciate the importance of healthy sexuality for people. This is where I suspect people misinterpret impulses for needs, in the same way that one might misinterpret habitually eating what tastes good for property dietary habits. Having every single want instantly fulfilled is not synonymous with being healthy, physically or mentally.