Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Tome]

Why do I need to use logic? It's pretty obvious to anyone with a brain that if you are playing a game in vanilla state that you have serious mental issues/autism anyway. Not worth anyone's time especially my own.



You can have your community of people that live in the past pretending that everything is okay when it's not. Similar to some retarded cult. Rest of the world moves on and looks down on you folks and it's glorious.



Good. Stay there and stay the hell away from those of us that actually understand what moving on in the passing of time actually means.



I mean, stating facts is a pretty adult thing to do is it not? Sorry that it rustled your feathers dude. Move on it's over.



Sheesh, same as the previous response not even worth responding to.

My point in simpliest form just so even the autists can understand:

By enabling yourself and others to indulge to play a lesser version of a game simply because of nostalgia factor you are essentially showcasing to the world that you are immature, and unable to move on because of social memories. It shows that you value said social memories far more than you place value in building new bridges and moving forward and it's pretty pitiful.

There's literally no argument you people can say other than social community yadda yadda nonsense for why you play that crap version of this game. You wanna know something funny? I played Vanilla, I raided AQ40 where having to farm Nature resistance was the norm. I was at the Gates. I know, I get it. But you don't get me or my point. And that is why it's funny to me. Carry on.

This.

This is pretty much the reason why I don't want to be part of current World of Warcraft's community. It's cancerous beyond belief.

[Deleted]

You can keep these 2 things completely seperated tho.

If they charge an additional sub/fee for a legacy pass, sure. Spending resources of every player's sub that could go into the current, relevant game on it would not be the right way.

[americandavey]

They've discussed and considered it internally many times. Once reality sets in where these legacy realms would have to adhere to both modern and their own industry standards it's a fuck ton more than "lol just 500$ a month"
But I'm not seeing anyone try to discuss the technical or logistical matters on how these legacy realms would work in practice, with the Bnet launcher, with the network infrastructure in general, account data, the proposed server jumping between different expansions (how do you jump from one expansion to another while making sure everything stays the way it should? where are the systems to make sure this is feasible?), should these servers have GM support? bug fixing?
Current day systems that simply wouldn't work on legacy realms, well time to develop those for backward compitability.

It's painfully obvious that people who seem to think this would be a small undertaking to work just because Nost made it work as a separate entity, have given this near zero thought. I almost wish Blizzard would release a giant statement on how much work legacy realm would ACTUALLY mean in practice, just to shut down the smug cloud of naiveness that poisons this topic, but that would kinda give too much credibility.
Or do they genuinely think Blizzard would open a little corner room, put 5 servers in there, launch a server client for 1.12, 2.4 etc, put a Blizzard Seal of Approval sticker on them, and rake in the money?

And what a promising demographic: The people who wants to re-live their first MMO experience from a decade ago and then most leave shortly after. What was the Nost retention rate again? On a FREE server?

I can't see any way for legacy realms to be profitable. Well, at least not if they are to have any support whatsoever.

tl;dr official legacy realms are a shit ton more expensive and need of development time to work today than people want to admit.

Blizzard come out with a long list of things they would have to do to get a legacy server technical work, even a list of how many programmers and support staff with their base salary. It would not matter to people at all. "they are a billion dollar company, they can afford it!"

[bluspacecow]

Looking at the mangos project license it looks like you'll never be able to use the work Nost did.

As the license requires any derivite work based on it to be under the same license it is under.

Which has a clause requiring you to distribute the source code if required under special conditions.

There's no way blizzard will ever distribute their source code.

http://docs.getmangos.com/en/latest/...e/license.html

[Aggrophobic]

They've discussed and considered it internally many times. Once reality sets in where these legacy realms would have to adhere to both modern and their own industry standards it's a fuck ton more than "lol just 500$ a month"
But I'm not seeing anyone try to discuss the technical or logistical matters on how these legacy realms would work in practice, with the Bnet launcher, with the network infrastructure in general, account data, the proposed server jumping between different expansions (how do you jump from one expansion to another while making sure everything stays the way it should? where are the systems to make sure this is feasible?), should these servers have GM support? bug fixing?
Current day systems that simply wouldn't work on legacy realms, well time to develop those for backward compitability.

It's painfully obvious that people who seem to think this would be a small undertaking to work just because Nost made it work as a separate entity, have given this near zero thought. I almost wish Blizzard would release a giant statement on how much work legacy realm would ACTUALLY mean in practice, just to shut down the smug cloud of naiveness that poisons this topic, but that would kinda give too much credibility.
Or do they genuinely think Blizzard would open a little corner room, put 5 servers in there, launch a server client for 1.12, 2.4 etc, put a Blizzard Seal of Approval sticker on them, and rake in the money?

And what a promising demographic: The people who wants to re-live their first MMO experience from a decade ago and then most leave shortly after. What was the Nost retention rate again? On a FREE server?

I can't see any way for legacy realms to be profitable. Well, at least not if they are to have any support whatsoever.

tl;dr official legacy realms are a shit ton more expensive and need of development time to work today than people want to admit.

While you make sense, the people that want legacy servers won't listen to any of this. Most probably don't want legacy servers at all but it's just "cool" to bash anything Blizzard does.

[zmp]

They follow their own plan instead of listening to the overly load minority that base all of their judgement on nostalgia and simple thinking

Im glad you believe Garrison wasn't simple thinking. I think there is a wide array of complainers who believe otherwise.

- - - Updated - - -

I think it's kind of silly that they say they should "spend more resources on the current game" when there is literally no content. K blizz

B..b..but if they spend more resources on the current game, it will cost a raid tier..

[Deleted]

They've discussed and considered it internally many times. Once reality sets in where these legacy realms would have to adhere to both modern and their own industry standards it's a fuck ton more than "lol just 500$ a month"
But I'm not seeing anyone try to discuss the technical or logistical matters on how these legacy realms would work in practice, with the Bnet launcher, with the network infrastructure in general, account data, the proposed server jumping between different expansions (how do you jump from one expansion to another while making sure everything stays the way it should? where are the systems to make sure this is feasible?), should these servers have GM support? bug fixing?
Current day systems that simply wouldn't work on legacy realms, well time to develop those for backward compitability.

It's painfully obvious that people who seem to think this would be a small undertaking to work just because Nost made it work as a separate entity, have given this near zero thought. I almost wish Blizzard would release a giant statement on how much work legacy realm would ACTUALLY mean in practice, just to shut down the smug cloud of naiveness that poisons this topic, but that would kinda give too much credibility.
Or do they genuinely think Blizzard would open a little corner room, put 5 servers in there, launch a server client for 1.12, 2.4 etc, put a Blizzard Seal of Approval sticker on them, and rake in the money?

And what a promising demographic: The people who wants to re-live their first MMO experience from a decade ago and then most leave shortly after. What was the Nost retention rate again? On a FREE server?

I can't see any way for legacy realms to be profitable. Well, at least not if they are to have any support whatsoever.

tl;dr official legacy realms are a shit ton more expensive and need of development time to work today than people want to admit.

]


Can you discuss the technical implications of making legacy servers work with b.net launchers? Do you know the logistical matters?

Nost retention rate was actually pretty good especially FOR a free server. Do you have any MMOs with higher retention rates? Any games?

If not, please stop acting like a smartass. You keep bringing up cost, that it wouldn't be viable, without showing ANY evidence at all, except that blizzard has apparently considered it some time ago, and said no. Bllizard can't be wrong, right? Yes, of course, the success of warlords of draenor clearly shows that blizzard knows exactly what the community wants.

I don't want to leave shortly after experiencing vanilla WoW like you said, considering that i NEVER played vanilla WoW in the first place. I played on nost because vanilla WoW was a better game than retail WoW. It's not about nostalgia. At all. For some people it is, but not for me. And what is wrong with nostalgia? Why can't people feel nostalgic about things and play things they loved in the past? Is that some kind of crime?


Do you have any proof that people played on nostalrius that played there just because it was free. Find one. If there are these people, they are in the minority.

Oh and got any ideas how to convince blizzard to make legacy servers? You seem to be crusading againts that idea, why? This is the entire point of this thread , and the petition.

[Bakis]

To me its pretty daft to bring up it being free as a main reason why people played on Nost or any other legacy for that matter.
Some might but I feel pretty confident to say that a fee such as live is not part of the equation.

NA, EU got no problem with the fee overall, I doubt the Chinese struggle with the setup BLZ use in China as well, on the contrary I think they would gladly play the original WOW given the censorship and completely different WoW they are forced to play under their regime.

[americandavey]

]


Can you discuss the technical implications of making legacy servers work with b.net launchers? Do you know the logistical matters?

Nost retention rate was actually pretty good especially FOR a free server. Do you have any MMOs with higher retention rates? Any games?

If not, please stop acting like a smartass. You keep bringing up cost, that it wouldn't be viable, without showing ANY evidence at all, except that blizzard has apparently considered it some time ago, and said no. Bllizard can't be wrong, right? Yes, of course, the success of warlords of draenor clearly shows that blizzard knows exactly what the community wants.

I don't want to leave shortly after experiencing vanilla WoW like you said, considering that i NEVER played vanilla WoW in the first place. I played on nost because vanilla WoW was a better game than retail WoW. It's not about nostalgia. At all. For some people it is, but not for me. And what is wrong with nostalgia? Why can't people feel nostalgic about things and play things they loved in the past? Is that some kind of crime?


Do you have any proof that people played on nostalrius that played there just because it was free. Find one. If there are these people, they are in the minority.

Oh and got any ideas how to convince blizzard to make legacy servers? You seem to be crusading againts that idea, why? This is the entire point of this thread , and the petition.

Nost brags about 800k registered accounts, yet 150k were active and yet barely over 100k signed the petition (which a person can do multiple times) I am sure people on other private servers know about the petition. That is evidence enough to prove that there is not Major interest in a Classic World of Warcraft server being runned by Blizzard.

Technical issues is why Blizzard and some of us is trying to tell you. If they did legacy servers, Blizzard will not have two clients. With the file format changes that occur at 6.0, A LOT of code will have to be redone. Old Code converted to NEW code isn't like playing with legos. You want to ignore the aspect of technical issues to fit your narrative. It doesn't work that way. Nost used an emulator, something Blizzard will never use or touch in a million years.

[zmp]

Nost brags about 800k registered accounts, yet 150k were active and yet barely over 100k signed the petition (which a person can do multiple times) I am sure people on other private servers know about the petition. That is evidence enough to prove that there is not Major interest in a Classic World of Warcraft server being runned by Blizzard.

Perhaps a large portion realize that petitions doesn't solve anything (They may already realize that Blizzard never listen anyway). Replace keywords "evidence" and "proof" with "opinions".

With the file format changes that occur at 6.0, A LOT of code will have to be redone.

So code that has been redone once, cant be redone twice? Doesn't sound like good development practises.

Technical issues

Try overcomplicating things for the sake of overcomplicating. It could be as simple as take whatever Nostralius had and keep it like that for the time being. Hell just keep it ONE realm to test waters.

Do you have any proof that people played on nostalrius that played there just because it was free. Find one. If there are these people, they are in the minority.

I want to see this "evidence" and "proof" also.

[Amerissis]

Why do I need to use logic? It's pretty obvious to anyone with a brain that if you are playing a game in vanilla state that you have serious mental issues/autism anyway. Not worth anyone's time especially my own.

You can have your community of people that live in the past pretending that everything is okay when it's not. Similar to some retarded cult. Rest of the world moves on and looks down on you folks and it's glorious.

Good. Stay there and stay the hell away from those of us that actually understand what moving on in the passing of time actually means.

I mean, stating facts is a pretty adult thing to do is it not? Sorry that it rustled your feathers dude. Move on it's over.

Sheesh, same as the previous response not even worth responding to.

My point in simpliest form just so even the autists can understand:

By enabling yourself and others to indulge to play a lesser version of a game simply because of nostalgia factor you are essentially showcasing to the world that you are immature, and unable to move on because of social memories. It shows that you value said social memories far more than you place value in building new bridges and moving forward and it's pretty pitiful.

There's literally no argument you people can say other than social community yadda yadda nonsense for why you play that crap version of this game. You wanna know something funny? I played Vanilla, I raided AQ40 where having to farm Nature resistance was the norm. I was at the Gates. I know, I get it. But you don't get me or my point. And that is why it's funny to me. Carry on.

Wow. I'm opposed to Classic realms and think it's nostalgia instead of true fun (yes, I played since a week after launch), but this toxic pile of shits makes me want to run away from the current game and community, just so I won't be in the same 'camp' as you.

[Deleted]

Nost brags about 800k registered accounts, yet 150k were active and yet barely over 100k signed the petition (which a person can do multiple times) I am sure people on other private servers know about the petition. That is evidence enough to prove that there is not Major interest in a Classic World of Warcraft server being runned by Blizzard.

Huh? That is conclusive evidence that there is an insane amount of interest in legacy servers. The vast majority of potential customers for Blizzard run legacy servers are not playing on private servers or signing any petitions; they're busy playing other games. I'd bet money on official legacy servers attracting a million subscribers easily.

[americandavey]

Perhaps a large portion realize that petitions doesn't solve anything (They may already realize that Blizzard never listen anyway). Replace keywords "evidence" and "proof" with "opinions".



So code that has been redone once, cant be redone twice? Doesn't sound like good development practises.



Try overcomplicating things for the sake of overcomplicating. It could be as simple as take whatever Nostralius had and keep it like that for the time being. Hell just keep it ONE realm to test waters.



I want to see this "evidence" and "proof" also.

That is not what people on Pro-Legacy servers are claiming. They claim that 100k petition is PROOF that there are people want to pay for Legacy servers. They claim because Nost had this many people that OMG there is MILLIONS like them that will pay a sub for Legacy server. Either get the talking point right or drop it.

Again you pulling resources from other projects to redo code once again. No one is over complicating anything. Spending TIME and MONEY for 12 year old code to work with new systems, anyone with a brain could see the headaches it will cause.

How hard is it to understand that Nost used a emulator. A Emulator that was created by stolen code from 12 years ago. Yep Blizzard wants to put that mess on their network.

[Marakesh]

Legally speaking George Lucas was in the right too when he crapped all over his original masterpiece and refused to sell his most passionate fans an unaltered version. Sure you can levy your scorn against the fans that now download the despecialized edition. But in the legal right or not, it's pretty obvious who the real douche is.

I had just gotten around to seeing The People Vs George Lucas a few months ago. I've heard the Blizzard comparison a few times, and there are a lot of parallels. In fact, the recent garrisons in Legion uproar immediately reminded me of that Jar Jar Binks scene where he turns to face the camera and says "Jar Jar's not going anywhere," or something to that effect. The Blizzard defense that its only 3% of content seemed so tone deaf. Why on earth put it in at all, if its such a small part of the new expansion!? Its exactly like the relationship between Lucas and Star Wars fans. He's not producing films they love anymore, and maybe he just can't. He's tired of hearing them complain and then gets stubborn and combative with that Jar Jar scene.

I really don't have any faith in modern Blizz, if I did I'd still be asking for improvement in the live version of the game. A year ago, I'd have said go back to the point when mmo's were growing and build off of those features to make new and compelling content. If you fall into a rut of linear, super-easy casual pve then figure out the principles behind the success of early mmo's and work from there.

Seeing what's coming out about Legion, it appears they have chosen to double down on the principles of MoP and WoD. Maybe the dungeons could be worth it, but that assumes enough people would be willing to do all the other stuff and they don't effectively make them raider only with gear req's. That is, its hard to isolate something like that from the rest of the game. Everything else looks like a lot of simple, connect the dots, follow the one path questing. Quest to get class abilities, professions are questing, and random daily quests at the end. I'd be surprised if its anything more than follow "the yellow exclamation point road" with stuff that's so easy you could fall asleep doing it and interaction with other people isn't just optional, but more of an impediment. /old mmo man rant off

[Qnubi]

I have started on a private vanilla server, I am not gonna mention it's name as I am not sure if that is okay mentioning here. But I am having the best WoW time since Wotlk atm, I convinced a friend of mine to come with me, he didn't want to at first as he was playing Dark Souls 3 but after 1 day he called me that he wants to keep going, like right now. We play as warrior and priest (he tanks, I heal), and we are dependent on eachother, he dies to 2 regular mobs if I am not around. And I am, let's not talk about it, I can maybe kill 1 mob on my own level. The leveling is a lot slower, but everything around it matters, I picked up Alchemy and whenever I can get a better version of them we are so happy as it GREATLY enhances our gameplay. In Dungeons my friend is so happy when we have a rogue or mage so we get to CC them. Even the low level dungeons are no joke. You have to heal efficiently as the mana regeneration only starts after 5 seconds after casting a spell. That means you heal in bulks and then stop for a long time and let the group/tank drop, it's so much more intense and the mana goes away so fast. I shout out 45, 35, 25, (representing % mana) to my friend and he asks "if I have any potions and I am like nope, chuck in your own for now while I regain some mana". Outdoor leveling we encounter same level mobs, we pull 1, maybe 2 if we feel confident, but when it goes up to 3 or 4, me and him are like, run run run! While I put some hot and shield on us. It's so much better to have enemies that can actually hurt you. Comparing to live wow where you can just faceroll EVERYTHING while leveling.

To me, this version is a lot more fun.

But of course "I think I do, but I don't".

[MasterHamster]

Can you discuss the technical implications of making legacy servers work with b.net launchers? Do you know the logistical matters?

No, which is the point. Outside of Blizzard we have not a single inkling of how much work official legacy realms would require to implement and integrate with their other network/server structure, their launcher, etc etc etc. But people aren't interested in hearing how legacy realms isn't as easy for a AAA company to run as it if for people using an emulator and writing scripts.

Nost retention rate was actually pretty good especially FOR a free server. Do you have any MMOs with higher retention rates? Any games?

I'm simply not impressed by 100-150k semi-active subs when there's zero cost to start playing. But the only thing we have otherwise is people claiming they'd pay full sub cost for a stagnant version of the game which will never update. Words are cheap.

If not, please stop acting like a smartass. You keep bringing up cost, that it wouldn't be viable, without showing ANY evidence at all, except that blizzard has apparently considered it some time ago, and said no. Bllizard can't be wrong, right? Yes, of course, the success of warlords of draenor clearly shows that blizzard knows exactly what the community wants.

And how am I supposed to show evidence that official legacy realms would be an expensive venture far beyond the scope of Nost "development" and hosting costs, when not even Blizzards input on the matter is good enough for you? So instead I'm pointing out how much in theory that would have to be changed or implemented in order to make it work up to the standard we expect. Fully implemented Bnet Services from all legacy realms, how will the accounts data need to be changed to work with entirely different eras in the game. Bnet client implementation... separate game clients for each type of realm?

You don't need to be a Senior Technician director at Blizzard to know it'd take a ton of manhours.

I don't want to leave shortly after experiencing vanilla WoW like you said, considering that i NEVER played vanilla WoW in the first place. I played on nost because vanilla WoW was a better game than retail WoW. It's not about nostalgia. At all. For some people it is, but not for me. And what is wrong with nostalgia? Why can't people feel nostalgic about things and play things they loved in the past? Is that some kind of crime?

Nothing wrong with nostalgia, it's just a very poor demographic when taking risks.

Do you have any proof that people played on nostalrius that played there just because it was free. Find one. If there are these people, they are in the minority.

And can you prove they are a minority?
Free of charge, so of course more people are inclined to try it out? How is this even a question?

Oh and got any ideas how to convince blizzard to make legacy servers? You seem to be crusading againts that idea, why? This is the entire point of this thread , and the petition.

I'd love fully supported official legacy realms. I'm just not so naive as to think it'd be nearly as easy or cheap, nor as profitable once all factors are counted, as Nost supporters claims.

[Deleted]

This.

This is pretty much the reason why I don't want to be part of current World of Warcraft's community. It's cancerous beyond belief.

He's so unlike Rintarou as well. I wish he'd change his avatar.

Unfortunately we have to deal with people like this. They are relentless in their criticism and always forget they are vastly outnumbered.

[Santoryu]

I have started on a private vanilla server, I am not gonna mention it's name as I am not sure if that is okay mentioning here. But I am having the best WoW time since Wotlk atm, I convinced a friend of mine to come with me, he didn't want to at first as he was playing Dark Souls 3 but after 1 day he called me that he wants to keep going, like right now. We play as warrior and priest (he tanks, I heal), and we are dependent on eachother, he dies to 2 regular mobs if I am not around. And I am, let's not talk about it, I can maybe kill 1 mob on my own level. The leveling is a lot slower, but everything around it matters, I picked up Alchemy and whenever I can get a better version of them we are so happy as it GREATLY enhances our gameplay. In Dungeons my friend is so happy when we have a rogue or mage so we get to CC them. Even the low level dungeons are no joke. You have to heal efficiently as the mana regeneration only starts after 5 seconds after casting a spell. That means you heal in bulks and then stop for a long time and let the group/tank drop, it's so much more intense and the mana goes away so fast. I shout out 45, 35, 25, (representing % mana) to my friend and he asks "if I have any potions and I am like nope, chuck in your own for now while I regain some mana". Outdoor leveling we encounter same level mobs, we pull 1, maybe 2 if we feel confident, but when it goes up to 3 or 4, me and him are like, run run run! While I put some hot and shield on us. It's so much better to have enemies that can actually hurt you. Comparing to live wow where you can just faceroll EVERYTHING while leveling.

To me, this version is a lot more fun.

But of course "I think I do, but I don't".

Same here. Nost was my first Vanilla experience as well and it just blows the current game out of the water.

[Deleted]

I have started on a private vanilla server, I am not gonna mention it's name as I am not sure if that is okay mentioning here. But I am having the best WoW time since Wotlk atm

Just give it 2 years and you will be bored out of your mind.
I did Vanilla and if TBC never would had come then i had quit this game years ago like all other games out there that dont evolve like an MMO.

[Deleted]

Same here. Nost was my first Vanilla experience as well and it just blows the current game out of the water.

Yeah i rember when i was leveling my dwarf hunter and i invited this 2 guys mage and priest what i meet during level to do together Q to kill elite yeti. So we went there pull him and we got rekt. Like what? So we went back again and try to kite him. Mage slow him down and took agrro then when he got far away i taunt him with pet and kite to me slowed then we killed him and everybody was like ,,gg thank guys nice work,,. Like how can you think experience on retail? Oh wait you cant.

1y after relese and you still met new people in everyzone. Like every few sec you saw some player doing Q and leveling. How amazing is that.