pvp gear tied to rating (and mythic ilevel)

[Deleted]

I wonder if Ashran is going to drop anythign else than Honor. And those old WoD quest items.

[Grandork]

And you have no proof there will be a limit. The ilvl will still add to the new tables.

Indeed, no one has proof of anything, because it's still in alpha, so why do you whine so much? Did your daddy not love you enough? Geez, grow a pair and complain once it's released. If you want to send feedback, there is a forum there for that, here in MMO Champ, I can guarantee you, you are only whining for the sake of doing so.

[Deleted]

Indeed, no one has proof of anything, because it's still in alpha, so why do you whine so much? Did your daddy not love you enough? Geez, grow a pair and complain once it's released. If you want to send feedback, there is a forum there for that, here in MMO Champ, I can guarantee you, you are only whining for the sake of doing so.

Thanks for your opinion sir. Now lets continue on the topic.

[Tacotuesday]

Thanks for your opinion sir. Now lets continue on the topic.

Way to be a hypocrite. How about you address his comments instead of trying to run away like an entitled pussy?

You know what else? How about you post your armoury? For the luls I'm assuming you're a 1500-1700 lfr hero, I'd just like to confirm.

[Grandork]

Way to be a hypocrite. How about you address his comments instead of trying to run away like an entitled pussy?

That's standard Pro Quo for basement dwellers.

[mostvp71]

Spoken like a true noob "Boohoo, I can't make it to the top 0.5%, but I'm SURE I could if only I had the gear, let me buy this Mythic Raid Boost".

It's kinda funny seeing this actually, I've seen a lot of it in League of Legends, where people who were Silver and Gold said they were in EloHell, and couldn't get farther, not because they sucked, but because they were being dragged down by bad players. I always laugh my ass off when one of them buys an EloBoost to get to Diamond, only to go back to silver in a couple of months (dragging his team down also).

Suck it up kid, if you aren't good enough to get the best gear, don't worry, you will never be facing those people in rated anyway.

Yep. They should have really done the opposite. Remove the rating requirement on virtually everything.

Lol it amazes me that when Blizzard decides to add something like this that to Legion, people like this guy whine about it. Dude if you want gear its simple, get better and play the game. Removing rating on everything is just stupid, people like incentive elite sets, tabards etc are things to work towards so no, lets not remove rating on everything. Stop whining about not being handed free gear/stuff and just PLAY THE GAME TO GET BETTER.

If you dont have time to, or dont like doing - raiding or rated pvp...you'll be stuck with blue gear. Maybe a little higher with lfr or world questing. Basically dungeon heroic level gear, for the whole expansion. Would you stay subbed in past expansions being stuck with dungeon gear? Doubt it.

People with full gear can and will go to random bgs when they are bored, as well as be in low rated games. There will be people purposely tanking rating in order to carry. I consider "only 5%" to be pure bs, it will make a huge difference. You probably should not blindly accept it because there is no reason for it to exist. Health pools are ~ 1.5 million but there's also inflated primary and secondary stats. And buffs that buff your stats on a percentage. Throw in the multipliers to calculate damage and cooldowns used and it gets crazy complicated.

Sure, the people that can get the gear want to have the advantage and will be for the system. But people that like pvping but dont like "rated" or raiding have no progression path. They might as well not even bother buying the game if that's going to be the case. Why pay money to be stuck at a permanent disadvantage?

Its an MMORPG, part of the game is to work for your gear... people tend to forget that. If you dont have time for that, you shouldnt be playing MMORPGs really.

[xhisors]

My question is why not make gear useless in pvp? Nobody wants mythic PvE players doing more damage just because they have the best gear in the game. We all want equal footing and a fair playing field. This stat bs that blizz is doing is just idiotic.

Standardize gear in PvP instances (bgs, arena, zones like ashran). Leave owpvp to be gear based, I've been asking for this forever. But it will never happen.

People don't pvp just to get gear. You can have character progression without "gearing" your character.

[mostvp71]

My question is why not make gear useless in pvp? Nobody wants mythic PvE players doing more damage just because they have the best gear in the game. We all want equal footing and a fair playing field. This stat bs that blizz is doing is just idiotic.

Standardize gear in PvP instances (bgs, arena, zones like ashran). Leave owpvp to be gear based, I've been asking for this forever. But it will never happen.

People don't pvp just to get gear. You can have character progression without "gearing" your character.

This was the way it was in MoP to the point where PvP gear in WPvP wasnt even close to Heroic level PvE gear, youd get shit on. Gear in Legion isnt a huge thing thats what people arent understanding, it doesnt give you a huge advantage. If you look at how WoTLK was, the Legion system is pretty similar to that and it worked perfectly well. People are just too lazy and want to be spoonfed everything in video games now rather than practice and get better, its stupid.

[Grandork]

This was the way it was in MoP to the point where PvP gear in WPvP wasnt even close to Heroic level PvE gear, youd get shit on. Gear in Legion isnt a huge thing thats what people arent understanding, it doesnt give you a huge advantage. If you look at how WoTLK was, the Legion system is pretty similar to that and it worked perfectly well. People are just too lazy and want to be spoonfed everything in video games now rather than practice and get better, its stupid.

Dude, please don't spout nonsense, while in Arena and BG gear won't mean shit, in WPvP gear is everything, it was in MoP, it was in WoD, it will be in Legion. Also, as a rule of thumb, the best PvE gear will severely beat out the best PvP gear in WPvP, simply because of trinkets and legendary items.

[Tharkkun]

Right now the difference is 0%. You get your conquest, you are done. 0%.

Not so in Legion. (And your 5% is an imaginary number which doesn't even coincide with what's in the alpha - and we haven't seen the second raid tier yet, and we won't see it in the alpha either, and it will add tons of new power.)

Really? So when I queue for a random BG everyone has 740 ilevel like me? Not a chance in hell. Half the team is sitting with less than 200k health between 620 and 690 ilevel. They get stunned and drop in 2 seconds. Even 700 to 740 gets you rolled. Due to class scaling you can alter the stats you want to further skew your power. See survival hunters...

In Legion your stats all start at whatever Blizzard decides they will be. It won't matter if you stack mastery on all your gear it will be normalized to a template. Then as your gears ilevel goes up your base stats will slowly improve up to 5% for a 50 ilevel swing.

Each season they can alter the template to boost everyone's minimum back to normal so the curve never exceeds 5%. Even if they did no change a 150 ilevel swing would be what, 15%? That's nothing compared to how far it swings right now.

[Taeldorian]

Before Legion:

Gearing is a pain in the ass, but after a week or two you're on near equal footing as everyone else. And with some work you can get the best PvP gear and be on equal footing. PvE has absolutely no place.

Legion:

Gearing can be equally done in PvE or PvP. Those who start early will have better gear than everyone else. Getting the best PvP gear will get harder with time as the earlier you start the more gear you randomly amass/your rating is easier to defend due to higher ilvl. That or just raid and get the best gear with that method. PvE may very well be the most reliable method to gear.

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its currently a bigger gap in legion than on live.

I feel like you're weakening your comparison between WoD and Legion pvp gearing. In WoD, just like in Legion, if you don't start early, people will be leagues ahead of you, practically 1 shotting you (hello chimera shots) in pvp. It's not how you say it is, nor is it a pain in the ass. PVP gearing in WoD currently is the easiest thing I've ever done, was fully geared in a week without even trying.

Not saying it's better in Legion, but the current way of gearing isn't as good as you seem to make it. Also @ the part I bolded, that's the exact same way it is now.

[Toppy]

This was the way it was in MoP to the point where PvP gear in WPvP wasnt even close to Heroic level PvE gear, youd get shit on. Gear in Legion isnt a huge thing thats what people arent understanding, it doesnt give you a huge advantage. If you look at how WoTLK was, the Legion system is pretty similar to that and it worked perfectly well. People are just too lazy and want to be spoonfed everything in video games now rather than practice and get better, its stupid.

There will be a bigger gap between players in pvp in legion, than in WoD.

How is this hard to understand?

We're going from no gap, to there being a gap if you've high rating or do mythic raiding.

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I feel like you're weakening your comparison between WoD and Legion pvp gearing. In WoD, just like in Legion, if you don't start early, people will be leagues ahead of you, practically 1 shotting you (hello chimera shots) in pvp. It's not how you say it is, nor is it a pain in the ass. PVP gearing in WoD currently is the easiest thing I've ever done, was fully geared in a week without even trying.

Not saying it's better in Legion, but the current way of gearing isn't as good as you seem to make it. Also @ the part I bolded, that's the exact same way it is now.

That isnt how it is now. You're being time gated in Legion. In WoD, you're cap increases based on how long its been since you've got conquest. So while it will take some time to gear up, its still something you can do within the week. I know. I've done it three times now. Full conquest doesnt take much time. Whereas with how its being set up currently, in legion, it will.

[Mafic]

Yeah there is no "catch up" mechanic in Legion gearing for returning players unless they put in a catch up mechanic in PVE ala Tanaan Jungle with epics gear dropping everywhere. Also you have to farm artifact power to gain artifact talents and grind out the PVP talents. This is going to be harder for casual players not easier.

[Taeldorian]

There will be a bigger gap between players in pvp in legion, than in WoD.

How is this hard to understand?

We're going from no gap, to there being a gap if you've high rating or do mythic raiding.

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That isnt how it is now. You're being time gated in Legion. In WoD, you're cap increases based on how long its been since you've got conquest. So while it will take some time to gear up, its still something you can do within the week. I know. I've done it three times now. Full conquest doesnt take much time. Whereas with how its being set up currently, in legion, it will.

Oh so you're saying that the people who get a headstart and pvp for longer will be at an advantage? I may have misunderstood you before, but it's really just the honor system, once you get to 50 it's over unless you want to prestige, so all you really have to do is get to 50 (If you farm it, might take 3-4 days). Now, people who pvp more often will be rewarded more, which would be okay if that's how this worked, which is okay. People who play for longer will be rewarded faster, which I disagree with, which I believe was your point, and I agree with it. My bad

[Starscream101]

The gear from boxes DID NOT WORK IN SWTOR and they changed it. They did it and it failed. The gear from the boxes will FAIL in Legion. LEARN FROM WHAT OTHER MMO'S HAVE DONE!!!!!
It was a pain in the Ass after weeks and weeks of not getting the pieces you need and getting the same pieces over and over and over again.

Real PvP starts for rated when ALL are on a equal playing field. Then it comes down to Skill and not Gear.

A simple fix to PvP is Rating gives you Transmog and mounts.

Your toon is LvL 110 and you do PvP in Bgs Arena or in the World All ILvL goes up to a set ILvL past mythic. Even if your in Greens, Your stats go to a set ILvL based on your class and spec. That way say if your BM and is not doing to good in PvP they can tune the Set ILvL to have say more mastery. Or Warriors are hitting to hard we can tone them down then. That way the PvPers do not have to raid and the PvErs do not have to PvP for gear we all are on the same playing field no matter where you are at.

As a example.
Everyone in PvP is set to 820 ILvL. You get no extra stats from Your gear.
All warrios have 100 Str 200 Crit 100 Mastery and 200,000 health. Now Blizz can from there if warriors are doing bad increase the stats of mastery or str now 150 Str and 120 Mastery.

BM Hunters Hitting to strong we reduce the Mastery so the pet does less damage. All done on their end Super Easy to fix. Mage's have to much health at the ILvL the we will lower it.

Its so fucking simple to FiX PvP But they will not do it.

[Toppy]

Oh so you're saying that the people who get a headstart and pvp for longer will be at an advantage? I may have misunderstood you before, but it's really just the honor system, once you get to 50 it's over unless you want to prestige, so all you really have to do is get to 50 (If you farm it, might take 3-4 days). Now, people who pvp more often will be rewarded more, which would be okay if that's how this worked, which is okay. People who play for longer will be rewarded faster, which I disagree with, which I believe was your point, and I agree with it. My bad

Its not just the honor system is the thing.

Now, in WoD you start at a low point and can get on equal footing with the absolute best PvPers gear wise.

In Legion, those best at PvP will have higher ilvl and thus higher stats. It will be harder to get to their level with time as they fill more and more of their gear. It will be more difficult to start late and gain rank since you NEED the rank to get the gear that those with the rank already have.


It'd be like in WoD, if the elite pvp gear had 10 ilvls over the conquest gear. It just makes it all the harder to get ahead.

Likewise, you could just PvE. PvE may very well lead to even better gear than PvP due to warforged.

[Cebel]

Lol, did OP actually say this current system is the best? Really?

It is an RPG you know.... good players should get rewarded. I doubt by "gladiator" ratings they mean the top 0.1% that gladiator is, they simply mean in the upper echelon of rating, and that's achievable by any class.

God forbid people actually earn stuff. Meanwhile in WoD the least popular expansion of all time both pvp and pve wise, you can fully gear up in ~2-3 hours.

[Mafic]

The gear from boxes DID NOT WORK IN SWTOR and they changed it. They did it and it failed. The gear from the boxes will FAIL in Legion. LEARN FROM WHAT OTHER MMO'S HAVE DONE!!!!!
It was a pain in the Ass after weeks and weeks of not getting the pieces you need and getting the same pieces over and over and over again.

Real PvP starts for rated when ALL are on a equal playing field. Then it comes down to Skill and not Gear.

A simple fix to PvP is Rating gives you Transmog and mounts.

Your toon is LvL 110 and you do PvP in Bgs Arena or in the World All ILvL goes up to a set ILvL past mythic. Even if your in Greens, Your stats go to a set ILvL based on your class and spec. That way say if your BM and is not doing to good in PvP they can tune the Set ILvL to have say more mastery. Or Warriors are hitting to hard we can tone them down then. That way the PvPers do not have to raid and the PvErs do not have to PvP for gear we all are on the same playing field no matter where you are at.

As a example.
Everyone in PvP is set to 820 ILvL. You get no extra stats from Your gear.
All warrios have 100 Str 200 Crit 100 Mastery and 200,000 health. Now Blizz can from there if warriors are doing bad increase the stats of mastery or str now 150 Str and 120 Mastery.

BM Hunters Hitting to strong we reduce the Mastery so the pet does less damage. All done on their end Super Easy to fix. Mage's have to much health at the ILvL the we will lower it.

Its so fucking simple to FiX PvP But they will not do it.

It failed in WoD and they have to revert it with RNG boxes for versatility gear. I guess they want to push this through regardless of the consequences.

[Starscream101]

It failed in WoD and they have to revert it with RNG boxes for versatility gear. I guess they want to push this through regardless of the consequences.

Can add in Versatility to the ILvL if needed if do it my way.

[Drosul]

The concern from my end isn't rating req = ilvl


Rather, it's whether or not MMR is actually fixed in Legion..... 1800 in RBGs now is what 2200 was in Cata-MoP..... If Blizz doesn't actually handle the damn MMR deflation, pvp gearing will essentially be completely dead, save for 3v3s... of which I've never been a huge fan.

Beyond that, the secondary concern is human nature, and the path of least resistance..... If pugging raids gets me better gear, faster gear, or easier gear then spamming 3s then I'll probably just raid for my pvp gear and do casual BGs... Frankly, I've progression raided before, and the only difficult part is weeding out failures who can't learn mechanics at a reasonable pace.... It's mostly just tedious.

Finally, the third concern is the power factor, and how it relates into point 1 and point 2..... If gear upgrades aren't rewarding enough, then PvPers will just do LFR, and eat the insignificant power loss. On the other hand if they are too rewarding, then you are going to effectively gate people right the hell out of actually being able to compete vs the very hardcore.

This new system has the potential to fix much of, if not almost all of, the problems in the current pvp system.... However doing so will require a very delicate touch, and careful balancing between the extremes of gear being powerful, and keeping people competitive (both in gear acquisition, and in power levels of people in different gear tiers)..... I'd be lying if I said I had much faith that Blizzard is capable of such delicate balancing at this point..... This is a company that couldn't even figure out EMFH was a problem until 96% of the PvP ladder was Alliance/Human a year later.