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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfheart9 View Post
    If you think removing 0s or strength stats from a mage made the game harder for you or require more effort.. I think WoW may not be the game for you. Such a single change causing such discomfort leans more towards you needing something more basic.
    Really, really not. It's not just this change but a number of changes they've done since late Cataclysm, I totally understand that Blizzard (Activision) wants the game to be simple to pick up and understand at a reasonable level. However I totally disagree with the way they've stripped the "ceiling" of how much the dedicated players can get out of it, while this change doesn't really do anything for me it's just another step in the direction of making the game simple (like I said).
    What I mean is that changes like this shows where Blizzard has their priority, which is to get the Casual gamer more interested in WoW. Which I don't disagree on but at the same time they don't do anything to make the game interesting for the dedicated gamers.
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  2. #202
    I prefer the old screen. ilvl is cool and all, but ilvl with the wrong secondaries means the player is still going to do bad damage. Although this might be Blizz's way of hinting to the community there will no longer be right and wrong secondaries.

    I actually don't like this aesthetically either. Something just seems very... IDK cheap. It looks like a change an add-on might make to your char screen. I get it's first pass, it really needs some cleaning up.

  3. #203
    I'd like to see screens of what it looks like in each role. Are healers not going to be able to see their mana regen? Can tanks not see their dodge, block, and parry? Also overall it just looks ugly, like it's from a phone game or something.

  4. #204
    I think people saying its "oversimplified" don't actually know whats going on in this game.
    Look at the stats on Live. Seriously, take a look.
    Its the most useless stuff I've ever seen.
    Idk when it became this way, but things like "attack speed" when there is literally only one attack speed for each weapon type is such nonsense.

    What you are actually seeing is how simplified the stats have become in this game.
    That's just how it is now.
    The stats on the gear are all that matters now, so trying to pretend things like Defense or attack speed matter to anyone and them not being shown properly is something to care about proves just how sad this community has become.

    I do agree that there SHOULD be an "extended stat view" selectable in the interface, but for the most part literally the ONLY stats that matter are the ones they are showing here, so who cares?
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  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by NoobistTV-Metro View Post
    I think people saying its "oversimplified" don't actually know whats going on in this game.
    Look at the stats on Live. Seriously, take a look.
    Its the most useless stuff I've ever seen.
    Idk when it became this way, but things like "attack speed" when there is literally only one attack speed for each weapon type is such nonsense.

    What you are actually seeing is how simplified the stats have become in this game.
    That's just how it is now.
    The stats on the gear are all that matters now, so trying to pretend things like Defense or attack speed matter to anyone and them not being shown properly is something to care about proves just how sad this community has become.

    I do agree that there SHOULD be an "extended stat view" selectable in the interface, but for the most part literally the ONLY stats that matter are the ones they are showing here, so who cares?
    IMHO, people like/want the illusion of complexity...
    Last edited by ls-; 2016-04-23 at 04:09 AM. Reason: autocorrector, ffs...

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrif View Post
    This is from another thread that got closed, but I wanted to answer to it anyway.

    And I'm being honest, I'm looking at my movement speed quite frequently. As a worgen druid I've 4 innate speed boosting CDs, more with talents, and several speed altering forms, as well as speed enchantment. All of these interact with each other in different ways, and I want to know how. Will popping a second CD make me faster or is it just a waste? In certain situations this is pretty important to know.

    Just because you take the game at face value and isn't interested in how mechanics interact doesn't mean other people aren't.
    If those people cannot Read the CD's and figure it out, that is on them. most cd's clearly state if there is a conflict somewhere, somehow. Second, at What point do you Possibly need to pop Two movement boosting cd's? The classes I play have 1 at the most. They have a rare use.

    Movement speed is a non issue and the vast majority really don't care. It has zero impact in raids except when you need a movement boost, like a rawr. At which case, seeing the exact speed is still irrelevant since the only thing that matters at that point is if you avoid the ability.
    Quote Originally Posted by scorpious1109 View Post
    Why the hell would you wait till after you did this to confirm the mortality rate of such action?

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    If those people cannot Read the CD's and figure it out, that is on them.
    Well, why dont you explain, without looking anything up, how fast I'd run if I have a runspeed enchant (10), activate catform (30) through displacer beast (50) and then pop darkflight (40) or dash (70)? I've given you the same info, since they all say "increase movement speed by (x%)" as you'd get by reading the tooltips (And yes, it's definitely a scenario that does occur).

    Some movement boosting abilities stack additively, some stack multiplicatively, and some doesn't stack at all. And the tooltips doesn't offer any information about that at all. Saying that you can read CD's and figure it out is just factually wrong, and saying that it's "on them" if others cant is just asinine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    most cd's clearly state if there is a conflict somewhere, somehow.
    It's not about being a conflict. It's about how they interact.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    Second, at What point do you Possibly need to pop Two movement boosting cd's?
    Such as displacer beast and dash? Quite often. (In which case you'll also have the move speed enchant and cat form to take into consideration).

    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    The classes I play have 1 at the most. They have a rare use.
    Well, surely you're aware that there are classes and races that has more. I've even already given you an example. Or should we skip showing STR and INT too, since you only play a rogue, and they don't show these stats?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    Movement speed is a non issue and the vast majority really don't care. It has zero impact in raids except when you need a movement boost, like a rawr. At which case, seeing the exact speed is still irrelevant since the only thing that matters at that point is if you avoid the ability.
    Yeah, because raids is the only thing that exists in this game?

    I mean, yes, you make a very good case for how it doesn't matter to you whether you see the movement speed. But you're completely oblivious that not everyone plays the same style, or even race and class as you. To me it mattered, both because I want to know how to optimize my run speed over a longer time duration, and because I like to know how the mechanics work and interact.

    And come legion I'll have to rely on add-ons for that information. Now, it isn't the biggest deal in the world, but it feels really unecessary and pointless, and is just another nail in the coffin about Blizzards continually dumbing down of the game.
    Last edited by Thrif; 2016-04-23 at 07:09 AM.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by dopefishz View Post
    people losing their shit about something so unimportant like a character sheet. good job guys. imo you just hate for the sake of it. leave wow if you hate everything about it, please !

    OT: i like it. i dont need to see how much int my warrior has, + it looks waaay better.

    You must be kidding me "something so unimportant like a character sheet" it is almost the most important thing in the game, atleast for me. You are the Next-Gen-WoW-Player for sure.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Krassz1096 View Post
    It's not bad, but I would like it to show movement speed at least.
    Code:
    /run tinsert(PAPERDOLL_STATCATEGORIES[2].stats, { stat = "MOVESPEED" });

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by clinophobia View Post
    You must be kidding me "something so unimportant like a character sheet" it is almost the most important thing in the game, atleast for me. You are the Next-Gen-WoW-Player for sure.
    Yeah that is the corner stone of a RPG. Without it...it might as well be another MOBA.

  11. #211
    I don't think so.. Really what is point of showing the details on stats you have 0% of? There is no point to show it if you don't have it.

  12. #212
    Bloodsail Admiral Mullet Man's Avatar
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    On a similar note...

    In October, Adobe released patch 6.2 for their very popular Lightroom photography application.
    Lightroom is used by Professional and Enthusiast photographers to import, catalog, modify, export, and present large quantities of photos.

    In patch 6.2 they completely replaced the "import photo" dialog with a simplified version.
    The previous import dialog was a very powerful tool, with many options.
    For Pros importing thousand of photos per day and cataloging them, those options were a godsend.

    With 6.2 they removed "very low usage features". The import dialog was a shell of its previous self.
    The Lightroom community erupted with complaints.

    Adobe stated they had done research and "new" people were confused by all the options, so they removed them.
    They basically dumbed down the product to market it at the Pinterest and Instagram photography crowd.

    But, Lightroom isn't for the Pinterest and Instagram photography crowd.
    Lightroom photographers needed those options and had come to rely on them.

    Petitions were created.
    The forums were flooded with complaints.
    Popular Lightroom personalities blogged about the situations.
    Etc....

    Finally, Adobe apologised.
    They relented.
    In 6.3 of Lightroom the old dialog was coming back, with an option to enable the new dialog.

    Adobe learned a lesson.
    Don't take away options and details just because new users find them initially confusing.
    Don't fix something that isn't broken.
    Don't mess with your product at the expense of your established user base.
    Don't try and make Lightroom a product for everyone.

    Seems like Blizzard needs to take note.


    References:
    http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjour...ml?PID=6149335
    http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjour...rt-update.html
    http://www.macworld.com/article/3005...ew-update.html
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  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by DeleteMyAccountMMOCSUX View Post
    On a similar note...

    In October, Adobe released patch 6.2 for their very popular Lightroom photography application.
    Lightroom is used by Professional and Enthusiast photographers to import, catalog, modify, export, and present large quantities of photos.

    In patch 6.2 they completely replaced the "import photo" dialog with a simplified version.
    The previous import dialog was a very powerful tool, with many options.
    For Pros importing thousand of photos per day and cataloging them, those options were a godsend.

    With 6.2 they removed "very low usage features". The import dialog was a shell of its previous self.
    The Lightroom community erupted with complaints.

    Adobe stated they had done research and "new" people were confused by all the options, so they removed them.
    They basically dumbed down the product to market it at the Pinterest and Instagram photography crowd.

    But, Lightroom isn't for the Pinterest and Instagram photography crowd.
    Lightroom photographers needed those options and had come to rely on them.

    Petitions were created.
    The forums were flooded with complaints.
    Popular Lightroom personalities blogged about the situations.
    Etc....

    Finally, Adobe apologised.
    They relented.
    In 6.3 of Lightroom the old dialog was coming back, with an option to enable the new dialog.

    Adobe learned a lesson.
    Don't take away options and details just because new users find them initially confusing.
    Don't fix something that isn't broken.
    Don't mess with your product at the expense of your established user base.
    Don't try and make Lightroom a product for everyone.

    Seems like Blizzard needs to take note.


    References:
    http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjour...ml?PID=6149335
    http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjour...rt-update.html
    http://www.macworld.com/article/3005...ew-update.html
    You seem to be confusing 'removal of features' with 'Removal of redundant data'.

    If the character sheet removed everything but iLevel, you may have an argument here, but to actually be an accurate comparison, the 'Import Dialog' option showed you the current amount of dolphins that were airborn above your house. This information was, and most likely always will be, 0. In a patch, they removed it, as it was unused information.

  14. #214
    It'd be nice if Blizzard posted the stat priorities for your spec/build...

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by PragmaticGamer View Post
    It'd be nice if Blizzard posted the stat priorities for your spec/build...
    Considering they want people to try different stat setups, the 'priority' only exists for players, as WoW's community has evolved into 'If option B is 0.01% worse than option A, then option A is the only viable option, and all others suck'

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfheart9 View Post
    Considering they want people to try different stat setups, the 'priority' only exists for players, as WoW's community has evolved into 'If option B is 0.01% worse than option A, then option A is the only viable option, and all others suck'
    And the difference is huge between stat priorities in a vacuum (blizzards) and stat priorities in practice (the players) and stat priorities you come up with yourself through learning how to use tools the community provides (simcraft etc) wouldn't ever trust blizzard stat prios

  17. #217
    No, it's not oversimplified. There's people who will say that it's oversimplified, because they HAVE to, because their bullshit whine chip on their shoulder commands them to do it, no matter how much or little sense it makes. They will be annoying and obnoxious on everyone else's time until they finally master the vital art of getting over themselves.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Manju View Post
    If you want the old stats pane back - you can get an addon for it. I'm sure most people will prefer to move forward with the new streamlined design.
    I don't want to get an addon for the cornerstone of any RPG game.

    This is a dumb move by Blizz.

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by Mafic View Post
    I don't want to get an addon for the cornerstone of any RPG game.

    This is a dumb move by Blizz.
    Your stat page still exists. You're not losing it. They're not taking it away from you. They're removing unimportant, pointless information. If you want unimportant, pointless information, there will no doubt be an addon to give you that. You're blowing it way out of proportion.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by lightspark View Post
    IMHO, people like/want the illusion of complexity...
    No, they want complexity. Interesting complexity.
    Blizzard removed that first. The interface is just reflecting what they've removed now.
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