Vol'jin or Sylvanas : Who do you find more capable as the Warchief?

[Al Gorefiend]

What did he actually do here? Where is Vol'jin...? The alliance were the primary factor in beating the iron horde given how weak the horde military was, and all he did was say "go help". I don't remember him doing anything like say Thrall did. Heck, thrall did TONS.

He's in the Horde Garrison giving the PC commander orders to build a shipyard and invade Tanaan. For the Alliance it is either Yrel or Varian taking his place can't remember. He also set up the Horde advance into Ashran and assigned Volmar the general.

Just because he isn't in the front lines swinging a hammer doesn't mean he isn't leading. He's a more diplomatic behind the scenes Warchief.

Also, the dudes been Warchief for like... 1 year game time. Cut him some slack.

[Raiju]

He's in the Horde Garrison giving the PC commander orders to build a shipyard and invade Tanaan. For the Alliance it is either Yrel or Varian taking his place can't remember. He also set up the Horde advance into Ashran and assigned Volmar the general.

Just because he isn't in the front lines swinging a hammer doesn't mean he isn't leading. He's a more diplomatic behind the scenes Warchief.

Also, the dudes been Warchief for like... 1 year game time. Cut him some slack.

Well the comparison is garrosh and garrosh got a lot of shit done in a year.

[Zulkhan]

That's exactly where I'm standing. And why I personally side with lor'themar; While he is indeed biased, I find him to be the best suitable Commander-in-chief (especially in times of conflict). Sylvanas being a close second. The rest massively best fit for advisers to the warchief, all with their strengths.

But I, too, don't think there is an obvious candidate that one could say "yeah, he was born to lead the Horde!".

Lor'themar has too much intolerance for politics. Leading his own people alone feels quite the burden for him.

In the end no one is fit to be Warchief until they become one and prove what they can do with such power in hand. All the guess-working is quite hollow, on the end of the day.

Just because he isn't in the front lines swinging a hammer doesn't mean he isn't leading. He's a more diplomatic behind the scenes Warchief.

Actually, that's what the Warchief does by standard from the moment the Horde grew into more than a mere bunch of orcs searching a place to call home. Thrall acted in the same exact manner. Garrosh was the exception and mostly because he had quite an addiction for the "glory" of battle while sucking at almost every other aspect of leadership, which is why he fitted quite well as field commander while being atrocious as Warchief.

Well the comparison is garrosh and garrosh got a lot of shit done in a year.

Maybe it could have to do with the fact that he escalated a faction war that in WoD is not a thing anymore. I mean, just maybe.

[Raiju]

Maybe it could have to do with the fact that he escalated a faction war that in WoD is not a thing anymore. I mean, just maybe.

Implying faction war is a bad thing here.

[Combatbutler]

Implying faction war is a bad thing here.

Considering every year a world shattering threat arises, yeah waging war against each other seems rather suicidal from an observers perspective.

[Raiju]

Considering every year a world shattering threat arises, yeah waging war against each other seems rather suicidal from an observers perspective.

From our conclusive evidence of about 10 years, ignoring the thousands before where things very rarely happened.

[Combatbutler]

From our conclusive evidence of about 10 years, ignoring the thousands before where things very rarely happened.

After living through all that shit, the average person would want as much peace as possible, wouldn't you agree?

[Raiju]

After living through all that shit, the average person would want as much peace as possible, wouldn't you agree?

Depends if you considering the constant skirmishes and risk of invasion 'peace'. One could argue it's better to deal with the lesser threat (to the world ending ones) and get it out the way.

[Combatbutler]

Depends if you considering the constant skirmishes and risk of invasion 'peace'. One could argue it's better to deal with the lesser threat (to the world ending ones) and get it out the way.

Well both factions are somewhat comparable in power so an all out conflict wouldn't necessarily be the best option.

[ItachiZaku]

Vol'Jin is more of a supporting character, Sylvanas is a leader.

[Al Gorefiend]

Vol'Jin is more of a supporting character, Sylvanas is a leader.

Varian was a supporting character too once upon a time.

[Melsiren]

Implying faction war is a bad thing here.

Considering it's borderline forced these days for the sake of justifying pvp's existence.

Yeah it's a bad thing because the story suffers from it.

Don't even get me started on Trashcan/Wod faction conflict.

Sylvi vs Grey at least makes some sense, however at this point faction war is a crock of shit.

[Trassk]

Sylvanas has always been a greater strategist, commander and overall ruler. She might be insane in a lot of ways, but she's had more success in what she's aimed for then any other leader.

[RedGamer030]

Vol'jin has the morality and wisdom to lead the Horde, whereas Sylvanas has the might and army. If those positive aspects were combined into a single character then the Horde would see a Warchief comparable to Thrall himself. Apart, neither is capable. Vol'jin lacks military strength while Sylvanas lacks respect for others.

If I had to choose between the two, I would choose Vol'jin so long as Eitrigg or Saurfang was his general and right-hand Orc.

[anaxie]

All you goons crying about the scourge and sylvanas testing her plague on the living. HINT the cult of the dambed and backbone of the scourge were not undead nor were vrykul.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

I'd prefer Johnny cash over that shit. There is a time and a place for asking Alexandra and that is the 6th grade

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Oh my god there is headcanon that still blames sylvanas for wrathgate?

I'm not saying we can KNOW she was in on Wrathgate, but given other thoughts and aspirations she is known to have, she has proven herself to be an "end-justifies-the-means" kind of leader. A world where everyone is dead/undead and worships her would be simpler, no? Even her own sister!

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Vol'jin has the morality and wisdom to lead the Horde, whereas Sylvanas has the might and army. If those positive aspects were combined into a single character then the Horde would see a Warchief comparable to Thrall himself. Apart, neither is capable. Vol'jin lacks military strength while Sylvanas lacks respect for others.

If I had to choose between the two, I would choose Vol'jin so long as Eitrigg or Saurfang was his general and right-hand Orc.

Where are you getting that Vol'jin is not a capable military commander? Certainly not from the novels, where it is stated explicitly that he is known for being a brilliant strategist. Certainly not from game history, where Thrall valued him as a military advisor.

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After Garrosh's defeatVol'jin:
The Horde needs its true Warchief now, more than ever.

Thrall looks back over his shoulder.
Thrall: Yes, but it was you that held the Horde together during this madness.
Thrall turns around fully to speak to Vol'jin.
Thrall: It was you that protected our honor.
Thrall: From this day forward, Vol'jin - If you lead, (Kneeling) I will follow.
To Vol'jin's stunned surprise, Thrall takes to one knee before him with his head bowed and the Doomhammer set on the floor at his side.

Vol'jin: I am not worthy...
Vol'jin sounds unsure, but when he looks to the others, Lor'themar and Baine bow to him.
Jastor removes his hat and bows, while Sylvanas simply nods. With this show of support, Vol'jin's acceptance grows firm.
Vol'jin: But I will give my all.
Vol'jin: (Bowing) For the Horde.
Vol'jin bows to his companions, becoming the first non-orc Warchief of the Horde.

Varian approaches the Horde contingent; all he can see at the moment are the backs of the gathered orc soldiers.
Varian Wrynn: I will speak to your Warchief!
The orc soldiers step aside to reveal Vol'jin in the center, with Thrall off and behind his surrogate brother's left shoulder. Varian looks surprised.
Vol'jin: I speak for the Horde

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Wondering how many of you have even read much about Vol'jin?

Here's a quick primer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-k09_NN-3ZA

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And the long version:
https://youtu.be/XDSkNg-Ewks

[Zulkhan]

Depends if you considering the constant skirmishes and risk of invasion 'peace'. One could argue it's better to deal with the lesser threat (to the world ending ones) and get it out the way.

Yeah, looks fine on paper. Then you have to face reality.

Garrosh achieved nothing but failures from his campaign against the Alliance, excatly because he tried hard to conquer the blue side.

Sylvanas has always been a greater strategist, commander and overall ruler.

Not quite, as political leader Sylvanas hasn't been exactly successful. She had betrayers acting under her nose and failed to keep her people in check multiple times.

[Raiju]

Yeah, looks fine on paper. Then you have to face reality.

Garrosh achieved nothing but failures from his campaign against the Alliance, excatly because he tried hard to conquer the blue side.

The constant alliance hate for horde gaining zones seems to suggest otherwise

[Combatbutler]

The constant alliance hate for horde gaining zones seems to suggest otherwise

The horde didn't keep those zones though, they were pushed out most of the time, the only territories that the horde did keep were in the eastern Kingdoms. Garrosh's Kalimdor offensive ended in utter failure.

[Arrashi]

The horde didn't keep those zones though, they were pushed out most of the time, the only territories that the horde did keep were in the eastern Kingdoms. Garrosh's Kalimdor offensive ended in utter failure.

That's probably to overwhelming support and trust he received.