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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkeon View Post
    Remember when it was TBC and WotLK and there was flying and you actually saw people in the world? Damn those were the days!
    ya on isle of qd and wintergrasp...something unique about those zones...

  2. #162
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    If it has been taken away how come I could still fly in Pandaria, Kalimdor, Eastern Kingdoms, Northrend, Outlands, and Deepholm prior to 6.2? You don't get it back at the end of the expansion in WoD you earn it at the end. In order to get something back you have to be able to have that something in the first.
    I actually was able to fly in endgame in MoP. I was not able to fly in endgame in WoD anymore. So, flying was taken away. Up to the point it was given back, gated by the most dull content blizzard ever created. To have at least those players playing it that would like to have flying as a reward.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    If exploring everything is bad and playing some dull grind quests are bad then what exactly do you need flying for?
    Convenience. Sure, flying wasnt able to save WoD. As it wasnt its removal, but that doesnt change my idea Legion could become fun again. Yes, even after all those disappointments with the attitude of the devs and their output, i still really hope they actually manage to create legion better than WoD.

    Even if i dont really should expect much. After their complete failure in WoD. Which includes removing flying as a simple content expander. Which just did not work.

    Probably they just should learn that their arrogance to remove something that people loved for eight years just didnt work out. And just implement it back from the start. But i dont expect anything here. As blizzard just isnt able to learn from their mistakes most times.
    Last edited by mmoc903ad35b4b; 2016-04-28 at 09:30 PM.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormspellz View Post
    ya on isle of qd and wintergrasp...something unique about those zones...
    Yeah, all the other areas were clearly deserted

    And about the QD, I'd be totally okay with the expansion's "Island" not having flying. Assuming they are as in depth as the previous expansion's Islands were (I'm staring at you Timeless Island and, to some extent, Tanaan Jungle.... not you two..)

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Krazzorx View Post
    Drama isn't there this time as we have tangible evidence it's coming. WoD was "will they or won't they?" What patch exactly it's coming we don't know, but shouldn't be any concern about the possibility of it Coming
    Anyone who really cares about flying quit when Blizzard told us it wouldn't be in 7.0, and most of those left the forums too. That's the main reason why you won't see much drama on this.

    Additionally, and maybe just as importantly, WoD really wasn't about "will they or won't they". That didn't cause the drama. The drama came when they said "No flying EVER." That polarized nearly everybody. They learned their lesson. They absolutely will allow players to fly, but they will delay it until after the last patch of each expansion, when nobody cares any more. And they won't tell anyone when it's coming, so players who do care about flying but aren't informed, duped into thinking they will be allowed to fly a month or two into the expansion, or perhaps in patch 7.1, will buy Legion and continue to subscribe.

  5. #165
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    It is taken away from every start of a new expac up to the point when every single content was played and seen. Which makes it defakto irrelevant for its initial sake. To have a convenient way to travel.
    You answered to yourself. It was always a reward every single xpac for the new zone, it wasn't taken from anyway. You can flying in the rest of the world if you were reward already.

    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    Additionally, and maybe just as importantly, WoD really wasn't about "will they or won't they". That didn't cause the drama. The drama came when they said "No flying EVER." That polarized nearly everybody. They learned their lesson. They absolutely will allow players to fly, but they will delay it until after the last patch of each expansion, when nobody cares any more.
    Exactly this.

  6. #166
    Assuming nothing changes between now and release, you get most of your reputation from completing the initial quest lines in every zone, then doing world quests. Each one gives a handy 250 rep, there's usually around 4-8 per zone, per day. It's basically daily quests with a different shine on them.

  7. #167
    if only you couldnt raid before getting this acheivement like in tbc.

  8. #168
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    You responded to my previous post, so I know you read it. You know I won't play until they allow me to fly. Are you deliberately misconstruing that to mean I find the Pathfinder achievement unacceptable, which is something I never said? Please post in good faith.
    If the Pathfinder achievement isn't unacceptable then how is it poisoned content? You stated you don't want to do poisoned content. But you are willing to do it so it can't be bad content in the first place.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkeon View Post
    Yeah, all the other areas were clearly deserted

    And about the QD, I'd be totally okay with the expansion's "Island" not having flying. Assuming they are as in depth as the previous expansion's Islands were (I'm staring at you Timeless Island and, to some extent, Tanaan Jungle.... not you two..)
    ya people flew to what heroic daily it was, and outside of the random person farming elemental essences, or the quest npc for certain daily hubs ya, it was deserted.

  10. #170
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkeon View Post
    Yeah, it isn't. Because a big part of the issue was that it was released at the end of the expansion - after drama for an year of no clear words - surprise, same is happening now!
    I am pretty sure blue posts, and an alpha stating the intent is clear words. It was already known that Flying would be gated behind a Pathfinder achievement for Legion. Nothing said that achievement would come in patch 7.0.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by mumufu View Post
    If someone can explain me, but i don't understand the whole flying thing at all.

    Second, flying should be LATER endgame content not early endgame content, because it breaks much.
    It only breaks things because they're designed to ignore the existence of flight. What if that wasn't the case? I'm not saying every nuance of the game needs to have flying, but if at least some of the game was built FOR flight instead of ignoring it, then we probably wouldn't be having these arguments at all. And no, putting flight at the end of the expansion, locked behind completing everything else doesn't really qualify as building flight for part of the game. I'm talking about real inclusion in the design, not slapped at the end as an afterthought.

    Quote Originally Posted by mumufu View Post
    Maybe a good solution would be to unlook 60% flying with the first step and than the 280% flying with the second and 310% with a third?
    I've suggested something like this before. I think most people would be happy with it, as well. Although I think we could take that idea a step further, and give it more stages and options for improvement. What if there was a dual progression tree for mounts, just like there is for the garrison hall, or like permanent buffs in Starcraft 2? Each time you complete a stage of the achievement, you choose between a buff for your ground or air mount. That way it's not just a choice between the "path of least resistance" by going with flight, but a real decision, with real benefits for ground AND air mounts.

    What would people think about that?

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    If the Pathfinder achievement isn't unacceptable then how is it poisoned content? You stated you don't want to do poisoned content. But you are willing to do it so it can't be bad content in the first place.
    I won't enjoy it until I can fly at the end. I'll be sitting there the entire time, pissed off about it. This is my point of view, which is obviously subjective.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    I am pretty sure blue posts, and an alpha stating the intent is clear words. It was already known that Flying would be gated behind a Pathfinder achievement for Legion. Nothing said that achievement would come in patch 7.0.
    Oh ya? When will flying be released?

  14. #174
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Tauror View Post
    You answered to yourself. It was always a reward every single xpac for the new zone, it wasn't taken from anyway. You can flying in the rest of the world if you were reward already.
    I was rewarded with the flying skill in TBC already. I see no gain in the idea to regain the same unchanged ability over and over. It infact is only a gain for the devs, as they could gate this powerful intrinsic reward by their weakest content. I dont know yet what it will be in Legion, but i dont really expect it to be gated by, lets say, the greatest gameplay Blizzard ever implemented.

  15. #175
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    Do you want to tell me you had to play for gaining the cataclysm zone flying skill seperately? You are comparing apples to oranges. You act, as if blizzards grand new intrnsic reward for doing their most dull content is even remotely comparable to buying a licence for old content..
    How could you have gained it without playing? The cataclysm way was giving you the ability to fly in certain zones when you learned the required ability. It is the same as WoD and Legion. The cost is just different.

    Flying is the only intrinsic reward ingame that is being reused unchanged over and over.
    Leveling is an intrinsic reward by your own words and it is reused unchanged over and over. And if you have already saw everything in WoD by the time flying was added then it is no longer an intrinsic reward.

    It is taken away from every start of a new expac up to the point when every single content was played and seen. Which makes it defakto irrelevant for its initial sake. To have a convenient way to travel.
    It has never been taken away up to the point when every single content was played and seen. Again being dishonest.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  16. #176
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    I was rewarded with the flying skill in TBC already. I see no gain in the idea to regain the same unchanged ability over and over. It infact is only a gain for the devs, as they could gate this powerful intrinsic reward by their weakest content. I dont know yet what it will be in Legion, but i dont really expect it to be gated by, lets say, the greatest gameplay Blizzard ever implemented.
    You were rewarded with flying skill in TBC to flying in Outland, not for the entire game and future xpac content. Again, lets not use dishonesty for argument's sake.

  17. #177
    Brewmaster SteveRocks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    That's perfectly fine. We know the MMO-C community is split roughly 50/50 on this from a poll earlier this week.

    What's really offensive is when people assume people that care about flying are lying trolls, because they lack the empathy to understand that some people actually do legitimately disagree with them.
    Yeah I respect their opinions. I think this is a nice compromise though. The people who really love the aspect of flying now have something to work towards and those that don't won't feel like they are falling behind or at a disadvantage for not using flying mounts. I don't know how the community feels as a whole becaue MMO-C is a very small sample, but to me it feels like a good solution.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by rym View Post
    I dont know yet what it will be in Legion, but i dont really expect it to be gated by, lets say, the greatest gameplay Blizzard ever implemented.
    We already know what gates flight; Pathfinder. Quests, reputations, treasures, world quests.

    When they add open-world zones to Legion in each major patch, each one will be accompanied by a Pathfinder achievement granting faster mount speed in that zone. When they add the last one (probably Thal'Dranath) in 7.2, and you finish Pathfinder: Thaldranath, completing all of the 7.2 open-world content, you will complete the meta for Pathfinder: Broken Isles and get to fly. That is what will happen.

    Now what I want to happen, and what would get me to purchase Legion immediately, is for Pathfinder: Broken Isles to be completable and flight allowed in patch 7.0. Then when they add Thal'Dranath in 7.2, don't let me fly there until I finish Pathfinder: Thal'Dranath. When I fly into Thal'Dranath without its pathfinder, give me a 10s countdown then dismount me with a parachute. Simple fix.

    @Steve: I'm OK with the Pathfinder achievement, I just want it to be completable in 7.0. That's my beef, personally.
    Last edited by Schizoide; 2016-04-28 at 09:42 PM.

  19. #179
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    How could you have gained it without playing? The cataclysm way was giving you the ability to fly in certain zones when you learned the required ability. It is the same as WoD and Legion. The cost is just different.
    Oh please.. if you actually want to keep some creditability, just dont try to act as if a small amount of gold is comparable to a month long gate full of gameplay most people would not do without the reward..

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Leveling is an intrinsic reward by your own words and it is reused unchanged over and over.
    Beside your very special idea what kind of reward levelling is (it would offer an instrinsic reward if it told a story, for example), leveling both allows you to progress your character to a new leveling cap and offers a lot of different stories told while surely being a traditional gamestyle in itself. In WoD, for example, leveling was really intrinsically rewarding, as it told interesting stories. Flying actually is just an unchanged intrinsic reward (freedom in the open world) you gain for gameplay which, itself, isnt intrinsically rewarding. It is just playing for a completely disconnected reward, content you rather wouldnt play if it would not offer that reward.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    It has never been taken away up to the point when every single content was played and seen. Again being dishonest.
    It was taken away. As people were able to fly in fresh endgame in every other expac before. In WoD, people werent able to do so. That fact wont become wrong, no matter, how much you try twisting words around until they fit into your wording.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tauror View Post
    You were rewarded with flying skill in TBC to flying in Outland, not for the entire game and future xpac content. Again, lets not use dishonesty for argument's sake.
    There is no dishonesty, as there was to gate to flying until WoD except leveling up and some gold. Which is not even remotely comparable to the gating mechanism for flying since WoD. For me, its is actually hypocrisy to compare these both.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Schizoide View Post
    Now what I want to happen, and what would get me to purchase Legion immediately, is for Pathfinder: Broken Isles to be completable and flight allowed in patch 7.0. Then when they add Thal'Dranath in 7.2, don't let me fly there until I finish Pathfinder: Thal'Dranath. When I fly into Thal'Dranath without its pathfinder, give me a 10s countdown then dismount me with a parachute. Simple fix.
    That would be a compromise i could accept as well. Unfortunately, i dont see that happening. No matter how much we both would like it

  20. #180
    Its fine for me. People are just overreacting... I like it this way, so you have to do something to get it. Whats wrong with that? People want legacy servers on one side, where you had to grind your ass off and on the other side they complain over such a simple achivment...

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