Pathfinder achievement looking pretty steep to unlock a core ability

[kamuimac]

The way this is set up? We probably wont be getting flight for over a YEAR. The patches will be dragged out and delayed again and again., with that carrot dangled in front of us.

and blizzard probably wont be geting milions of subs during that year either.

[Aehl]

Not exactly. Legion world content is actually relevant, WoD open world offered pretty much no upgrades to anyone who did heroic dungeons or higher. I defended flying very strongly in WoD because of two reasons:

And gated behind patches with no date on them. So yes we could be doing this crap for a year and STILL be grounded.

1. The open world was pretty much entirely "optional" - It offered no character power, so it was only something to do "for fun", for a lack of a better word. Open world in Legion gives you a lot of cool stuff, and doing it should feel rewarding for a long time whether you fly or not. WoD content didn't feel rewarding at all, and was barely tolerable even WITH flying.

A meta with no date for the reward is wasting my time. Either tell me when we get the reward or change it.

2. They are (seemingly) more aware of what to do with flying this time around, instead of trying to remove flying entirely. It'll probably take 6-12 months before we can fly after release, but the content available should make you want to do it with or without flying, unlike WoD.

So I do part one.

How long for part two? Three? Four?

How many months of doing this before we fly?

WHEN do we get the reward for this long, drawn out, time gated to death meta?

Whats stopping Blizzard from delaying patches for longer periods? How long do we sit and wait for their timetable that is changeable at a whim?

Their refusal to tell us means that yes we will be grounded and then allowed to fly when it suits THEM.

Not us.

[Woop Woop]

yeah WOD was very fun without flying

/s

Oh, I'm sorry, didn't know you had a blast in WoD just because you could fly. Certainly didn't fix any of WoDs problems for me.

[TS26]

Oh, I'm sorry, didn't know you had a blast in WoD just because you could fly. Certainly didn't fix any of WoDs problems for me.

well now you know. some people find flying, gasp, fun!

[Barkloud]

flying is convenience, not a core ability. Blizzard design their new zones to be played, explored and traveled in by foot, so that they can make you experience the content the way they want you to play it.

By enabling flying, you take players, and place them up in the sky, so now the ground becomes empty and thus the world becomes empty. People hop between mobs to grab quest items, avoiding combat where possible, including pvp, and this cheats how the game is meant to be experienced.

People who want flying immediately do not understand game design or what is healthy for the game.

As the designers have said, play the game, and when you have done the expansions world content, you get the convenience. it is NOT required.

WoD largely was the first expansion to not have flying and it is also the emptiest of all expansions. your argument is not valid.

[Woop Woop]

well now you know. some people find flying, gasp, fun!

Pft, you think you want flying, but you don't.

[Barkloud]

It's not a core ability/ If it were you would not need to have to train for it, buy it, or complete an achievement every expansion just to use it. It is a luxury and convenience item.

by percentage, the majority of all travel in wow has been done by flying. either on a flight master or self controlled.

saying flying is a luxury is like saying talents are a luxury. it is like saying earned skills are a luxury. it is like saying armor is a luxury.

[MoanaLisa]

So that's just autoattack. Ok.

I thought you might be wanting to have a serious conversation. My mistake. Sorry to bother you.

I'll still stand on my opinion that flying is not a core ability. It's a nice reward.

[OneSent]

Anyone who complains about the lack of flying in an expansion that hasn't even released yet, or complains about the steps required to unlock flying, you are 100% everything that is wrong with the community today, and 100% to blame for the game being in the state it is now.

The expansion's not even out yet, and the only thing you guys can think about is how soon you'll be able to conveniently zip and fly over all the of continent.

You're probably the same people who bitched and moaned about the flightpaths in WoD being too long, until Blizzard bent over backwards to create several-dozen new, unnecessary paths so that you wouldn't have to wait longer than 30 seconds to reach your destination.

Seeing threads like this makes me sick, and I am not surprised at the vocal outcry for Legacy servers. Your demands for more and more convenience in a game that already spoon-feeds and hand-holds has me questioning whether you actually care about the game, or if its just something you want to get out of the way as quickly as possible so that you can get on with the rest of your day.

[Schizoide]

Do Pathfinder achieves
Wait for next patch
Do next section
Wait for next patch
Do next section
Wait for next patch
Get flight less than a few months before the expac ends.

The way this is set up? We probably wont be getting flight for over a YEAR. The patches will be dragged out and delayed again and again., with that carrot dangled in front of us.

This is the WOD debacle. Again.

Not exactly. The WoD debacle was the devs promising flight in patch 6.1 then changing their minds to no flight EVER. That's what enraged everybody.

But your description above is absolutely correct. That is how flight will work in Legion. If you are upset by it, too bad. They are doing this. They are well aware that many customers are pissed off about it, but they very strongly feel flight does not belong in WoW. So they're doing it anyway.

[Deleted]

They wanted to remove flying entirely. They compromised due to high community outcry. But you are not even happy about that you keep screaming.

I am not screaming. I just see the fact they utterly failed with their idea, and just made the community even more toxic. The only choice to repair the damage they dealt to the community splitting them into "fliers" and "flying haters" is to reimplement it completely to the state it had before. It is actually the fliers that keep this discussion alive. And if some anti flier would open a thread about "why flying sucks", there easily could be given a reference to WoD why removing flying sucked even more, as the removal itself was just a scapegoat for missing content durability.. while its removal changed nothing on that.

- - - Updated - - -

You are the one that made the comparison and now suddenly says you can't compare them. Rank 6 flying, Draenor, grants different things then rank 5 flying, Pandaria. You can still use rank 5 flying but you can't use it in Draenor because it doesn't grant flying in Draenor. That is why Flying is nothing like different ranks of Frostbolt any more then Frostbolt and frost nova are the same spell.

It was you who compared it to spell ranks. I just debunked your myth. Thanks for agreeing.

Tell that to the people that had to grind and gear for AQ40 spell books.

And it was no fun at all. And blizzard wants to repeat that "fun".

[Aleksej89]

Flying is not a CORE ability.
Flying is just a faster method of traveling, just like teleportation or hearthstone - you can always walk.
Core ability would be looting or equipping items, without which the game could literally not be played to it's major extent.

I agree with blizzard's approach of "see all the outdoor content on foot once, then fly over it".
Exploring all the zones, doing all the quests and all the outdoor events like rares and treasures should be mandatory before flying.

[Schizoide]

Exploring all the zones, doing all the quests and all the outdoor events like rares and treasures should be mandatory before flying.

I accepted the Pathfinder compromise too. But I won't wait until after the last patch of the expansion, when nobody cares any more, to fly. That's my personal deal-breaker.

[rhorle]

It was you who compared it to spell ranks. I just debunked your myth. Thanks for agreeing.

If you are going to lie then you shouldn't do so when people can easily look up what you've posted. Or at least edit it. You said :

If the game still had spell ranks, these would be the ones for the frostbolt. Except in classic, you got all frostbolt ranks just by leveling up. And the one missing dropped in Ahn Qiraj 20.

You are the first one to compare the different abilities that enable flying to the old spell rank system. This is what I said prior to your above quote:

Something new like being able to use it in a new location? http://www.wowhead.com/npc=60166/cloudrunner-leng teaches six different flying abilities.

[Deleted]

You are the first one to compare the different abilities that enable flying to the old spell rank system. This is what I said prior to your above quote:

You are right. That changes nothing about the argumentation itself, tho. Your detail-love ignores the idea that i actually talk about adding back flying as it was before WoD was introduced.

I argumented that with the fact that removing flying in WoD did actually not solve any problem about content durability. That its removal (or whatever you love to call it.. dispense? temporary disabling? not yet introducing? Whatever your most pr-compatible wording may be..) was a complete desaster for the community. You just tried to play the semantic game about "that it wasnt removed" up to that point the discussion became completely irrelevant to the question itself.

So, if you have actually arguments why flying should not be added back to the start of the expac, just lets discuss about it.

[Linri]

I have no interest in flying anymore, it's cool but offers very little gameplay to me personally.

[WhiteEagle888]

Rep grinding is the worst part of all - they should remove that component entirely and let us fly straight away after completing this achievement which is now called "part I".
There should never ever even be a "part II" - enough bullshit already that we have to complete a cheevo instead of only one cool-ass quest, which should be similar to artifact quests.
Or simialr to that quest in Vash'jir where you learn to handle an underwater Seahorse mount - in Legion it would be better if there was a quest to learn flying in dangerous conditions like felfire spitting in your face and so on. After that, you should straight be able to fly.

[Deleted]

I think reputations should be moved back to dungeons. As repeatable as it was in Cataclysm.

[Barkloud]

Flying is not a CORE ability.
Flying is just a faster method of traveling, just like teleportation or hearthstone - you can always walk.
Core ability would be looting or equipping items, without which the game could literally not be played to it's major extent.

I agree with blizzard's approach of "see all the outdoor content on foot once, then fly over it".
Exploring all the zones, doing all the quests and all the outdoor events like rares and treasures should be mandatory before flying.

doesn't equipping stronger items help you consume content faster? isn't it a reward the same as flight is?

[Daffan]

I think reputations should be moved back to dungeons. As repeatable as it was in Cataclysm.

That is as boring, worse even. Why do they even exist if they were in dungeons