I'm so sorry monks

[sololux]

I don't play a monk. Don't even have a monk as an alt. But to see blizzard having to write full on guides to explain this ridiculous brewmaster build they have come up with just really is astonishing. You have the best raiders in the game in alpha and you have to do this? Lmfao just wait til this shit hits live. I'm so sorry monks.

[Ultramad]

See I'm one of those guys that didn't think WoD launch brewmasters were that bad and tanked heroics just fine w/them using intelligent pulling and personal CC. This? This is going to be a flipping disaster for players who don't heavily invest in researching and practicing their class.

[Super Kami Dende]

You are sorry that people couldn't figure out a class so much so that a Dev had to point out they were doing it wrong?

I mean sure, I feel sorry for stupid people as well I guess.

[hulkgor]

Can anyone link\specify what exactly you are talking about?

This is probably the vaguest discussion i ever read.

[sololux]

There's been like 6 blue posts in the last few hours having to describe in detail what and how they(blizz) wants you to play your brewmaster. Go read it, it's hilarious.

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You are sorry that people couldn't figure out a class so much so that a Dev had to point out they were doing it wrong?

I mean sure, I feel sorry for stupid people as well I guess.

These "people" are supposedly the top echelon of players. Hence why they where invited to alpha.

[Ultramad]

You are sorry that people couldn't figure out a class so much so that a Dev had to point out they were doing it wrong?

I mean sure, I feel sorry for stupid people as well I guess.

aaaahahahahahahahahahahahahah.

Alright.

[Ampere]

You are sorry that people couldn't figure out a class so much so that a Dev had to point out they were doing it wrong?

I mean sure, I feel sorry for stupid people as well I guess.

The Gift of the Ox (self heal) calculation formula is literally a trap if you don't know how the calculation works. It's also very buggy in the latest build!

But yea, it's totally the dumb players' fault! All those idiots who played Brewmaster for 4 years. Those guys suck

[Evolved]

You are sorry that people couldn't figure out a class so much so that a Dev had to point out they were doing it wrong?

I mean sure, I feel sorry for stupid people as well I guess.

Yeah. It's weird how a tank playing to minimize spike damage was actually wrong. You should want to sit at 40%-60% health.

[Rilas13]

Link to Celestion's post of how to play. When he started explaining that the testers were doing it wrong I admittedly laughed as well. Its a ballsy thing to say to your testers lol. And I understand why they had to explain it. It is a counter intuitive way to play, no other tank has to sit somewhere under max health to play effectively.

I am mostly surprised that they hadn't said anything sooner as the community has been complaining about the spec for a month without a response until today. Maybe they were hoping the testers would figure it out? Lols.

I mean I can't say anything, I certainly didn't consider that option either.

[Retsef]

Best of luck getting your healers to NOT keep you topped up.

[Jaybee9084]

At least the Blues actually talk with you about your bullshit. They don't give a fuck about Warriors.

[trm90]

I'm just happy Celestalon is so involved in the thread, even if he's bizarrely posting "guides" and staunchly defending a lot of mechanics which need mechanical improvements. The main thing is that we have some kind of discussion going, and Blizzard have listened and changed glaring problems in other classes in the recent months (Blood DKs and SPriests spring to mind).

Really the main thing is for everyone to keep their heads' cool. If you look at the thread, people like Totallite are an excellent example of how to provide feedback. Conversely, there's a ton of Brews in the thread who post overly dramatic shit like "I literally almost cried" and "I can't believe I have to main a new class" etc, which never gets responded to BTW, and it's not gonna get us anywhere.

[thesmall001]

It's the cost of being a high skill cap class. It's a sad fact that some classes are more face-roll than others. Give Paladins or Warrior an "I win" button they can spam and they become very easy to tune. Give Druids and DKs some reactive buttons to pair with their "I win" buttons and they're slightly more complex to tune. Give Monks 4 functional resources, an "I lose" mechanic and tons of CDs and you have either the most powerful or garbage Tank ever made.

[Raiju]

It's the cost of being a high skill cap class. It's a sad fact that some classes are more face-roll than others. Give Paladins or Warrior an "I win" button they can spam and they become very easy to tune. Give Druids and DKs some reactive buttons to pair with their "I win" buttons and they're slightly more complex to tune. Give Monks 4 functional resources, an "I lose" mechanic and tons of CDs and you have either the most powerful or garbage Tank ever made.

None of the other tanks want to be dumbed down and here you are complaining your class has a high skill cap for what top guilds are looking at potentially being the best tank when managed right.

[nathrizarri]

Link to Celestion's post of how to play. When he started explaining that the testers were doing it wrong I admittedly laughed as well. Its a ballsy thing to say to your testers lol. And I understand why they had to explain it. It is a counter intuitive way to play, no other tank has to sit somewhere under max health to play effectively.

I am mostly surprised that they hadn't said anything sooner as the community has been complaining about the spec for a month without a response until today. Maybe they were hoping the testers would figure it out? Lols.

I mean I can't say anything, I certainly didn't consider that option either.

Blood DK sends regards. I am happy that they are increasing the number of the classes that requires less than %100 hp to be effective. This will teach filthy healers how to heal.

[Deleted]

I don't play a monk. Don't even have a monk as an alt. But to see blizzard having to write full on guides to explain this ridiculous brewmaster build they have come up with just really is astonishing. You have the best raiders in the game in alpha and you have to do this? Lmfao just wait til this shit hits live. I'm so sorry monks.

You do realize though not everyone on the alpha is a raider? Why is it so bad that they're providing an explanation?

[Shamanberry]

You do realize though not everyone on the alpha is a raider? Why is it so bad that they're providing an explanation?

It's not bad that they're providing one. It's bad that a team of dozens of top raiders couldn't figure out the spec without it.

That implies that the method proposed - presuming it works, which I'm not convinced of yet - is very counter-intuitive, and probably not something that a person just picking up the class would be able to devise for themselves.

Reading through abilities and attempting to deduce how things work, it feels like you should be spamming ISB, since it feels like the closest thing to other tank's "push this button to take less damage". Once you figure out that doesn't work, you read PB and realize that you should be hitting that too - so you do. That also doesn't work.

Then you find out, the intended design is that you manage your health pool, smooth out your damage only when it's spiking with ISB to shift more damage into your stagger pool, and then manage stagger as a "resource" that you want to get rid of in the most efficient way possible. Basically, you want to conserve brew charges rather than aggressively use them, push as much damage back as you can, hope you don't get simply outright killed in the process, and then when you're low on health, shift more damage to that pool that you can then purify. Meanwhile, you generate more and more orbs on the ground that you can dance to pick up and heal yourself so you don't outright die when you fall too low o health due to not doing anything to prevent it, since you're waiting to build up your "stagger resource" for purify. Then you go back into conserve mode again.

The problem is, mobs still do spike damage. If you're purposely letting your healers know to not panic and let you stay low so you can spawn additional orbs, the boss' big ability hits you and you die. A single orb only heals for about 7-9% of your health, so you need a stack of them to be meaningful... so you can't just hang out at max HP and hope for the best, since as soon as you run out of the tools you're using to stay there, you spike and die.

His ideas are neat in a theoretical sense. Conceptually, that's a really cool idea. In practice, it just can't work in a world where spike damage exists - his claim to the contrary notwithstanding.

[Futhark]

It's not bad that they're providing one. It's bad that a team of dozens of top raiders couldn't figure out the spec without it.

That's not what he claims:

EDIT 2: Further example: We're finding skilled Brewmasters are virtually unkillable right now, significantly overpowered.

[thesmall001]

None of the other tanks want to be dumbed down and here you are complaining your class has a high skill cap for what top guilds are looking at potentially being the best tank when managed right.

Where did you get the impression I'm complaining? Practicalities aside, I think it's awesome! I feel sorry FOR other classes, especially Warriors and Paladins who got the short end of the stick, and I think all Tanks deserve a hard and easy mode accessible through talent choices. Those CC tiers probably don't need to exist and could be filled with game changing depth options.

[Breccia]

At least the Blues actually talk with you about your bullshit. They don't give a fuck about Warriors.

Grass is always greener. Which is worse?
A) "We listened to your feedback and discounted every single word of it."
B) (dead silence)

I share the OP's view. Warriors have it bad, but Brewmasters? That's demoralizing, even by our standards.

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Where did you get the impression I'm complaining? Practicalities aside, I think it's awesome! I feel sorry FOR other classes, especially Warriors and Paladins who got the short end of the stick, and I think all Tanks deserve a hard and easy mode accessible through talent choices. Those CC tiers probably don't need to exist and could be filled with game changing depth options.

Um...after maybe 5 minutes browsing the Alpha BM forum, the almost universally accepted truth is their "easy mode" is that you get destroyed nearly instantly, because the spec is designed that way.