Offical response from blizzard on legacy servers.

[Kithelle]

Um. Literally everything in your picture is in WoW. I can't even describe the fail here.

Their idea of a what a RPG is all about is micro managing over a dozen stats...

[Deleted]

You mean all that are new things that Blizzard will have to start and develop for legacy realms ?
Because I'm pretty sure all this is already functional for retail WoW, so it's not like it suddendly needs to be done just because there is realm added.

The post you're quoting was an reply to a question "if couple of hobbyists can, why can't Blizzard?". My post was an answer to that question: They're not directly comparable setups.

The question you're asking is interesting, but fundamentally different. You're asking "how much work would it be?" and to be honest, I don't know, because I haven't seen the WoW codebase and I know nothing about their billing/ticketing/financial/backend platforms. I have worked in big enterprise IT before, migrating legacy mainframe applications - and it's not always trivial and sometimes it's very complicated - but to make any sort of guesses what it would take for Blizzard to integrate their new processes/systems to the 12-15 year old architecture would be .. well, just guessing. I don't know what the gap between "old vanilla code" and "new WoD code" is in terms of backend integration, security etc.

Judging by their responses, they don't seem to think is trivial.

[Akka]

The post you're quoting was an reply to a question "if couple of hobbyists can, why can't Blizzard?". My post was an answer to that question: They're not directly comparable setups.

Yes but the thing is : this additionnal work needed for a commercial product, exists already and doesn't need to be developped again. So your answer kinda isn't one, as you list an amount of features that the guys didn't develop, but that Blizzard doesn't need to develop for legacy realms either. So it's back at square one.

The question you're asking is interesting, but fundamentally different. You're asking "how much work would it be?" and to be honest, I don't know, because I haven't seen the WoW codebase and I know nothing about their billing/ticketing/financial/backend platforms. I have worked in big enterprise IT before, migrating legacy mainframe applications - and it's not always trivial and sometimes it's very complicated - but to make any sort of guesses what it would take for Blizzard to integrate their new processes/systems to the 12-15 year old architecture would be .. well, just guessing. I don't know what the gap between "old vanilla code" and "new WoD code" is in terms of backend integration, security etc.

Judging by their responses, they don't seem to think is trivial.

True, but the fact is, Blizzard also made claims they "hadn't the code anymore" (which was both rather not believable, and is now not even mentioned), and are very obviously reluctant about legacy realms (be it because it would be a loss of face or whatever).
So, simply said, many people don't trust them. I don't doubt it's not a "trivial" task, but I highly doubt it's such a colossal one (reading what Blizzard says, you'd think it's nearly as hard as to build WoW from scratch) and I'm pretty certain the roadblocks are more "political" than technical (though, again, I don't doubt there IS some noticeable technical hurdles to deal with).

I'd say the argument "if a bunch of guys can do it from free" is not as much saying "it's trivial" as it's saying "even if it's not trivial, Blizzard has much more resources than these guys, has the actual real code as a starting basis instead of having to develop from scratch, and will be able to gain a lot of money out of it". This is making the claims from Blizzard "it's too hard" very very dubious indeed.

[Echo of Soul]

The post you're quoting was an reply to a question "if couple of hobbyists can, why can't Blizzard?". My post was an answer to that question: They're not directly comparable setups.

The question you're asking is interesting, but fundamentally different. You're asking "how much work would it be?" and to be honest, I don't know, because I haven't seen the WoW codebase and I know nothing about their billing/ticketing/financial/backend platforms. I have worked in big enterprise IT before, migrating legacy mainframe applications - and it's not always trivial and sometimes it's very complicated - but to make any sort of guesses what it would take for Blizzard to integrate their new processes/systems to the 12-15 year old architecture would be .. well, just guessing. I don't know what the gap between "old vanilla code" and "new WoD code" is in terms of backend integration, security etc.

Judging by their responses, they don't seem to think is trivial.

I think Blizzard has gotten it into their heads that Legacy realms HAS to be run on the same architecture as the other realms and it HAS to be integrated to battle.net and they HAVE to make changes to the code and that's why it's not possible. In their minds they can't just use the 10 year old 1.12 client and run it with that, they have to make changes to it, which they can't since they don't have the source code.

[Deleted]

WoW still has exactly the same things it had years ago. It has quests, dungeons, raids, pvp zones, capital cities, open world, it has EVERYTHING old WoW had.

Superficially yes. But the experience you get from those is completely different because the game design is completely different. What got me hooked to WoW back in vanilla were 5-man dungeons. I loved building groups, traveling the world to the epic instances, playing as a team (threat mattered, pulls had to be planned, CC had to be used, pulling threat would get you killed), actually being able to fail. I tried MoP for a month, and the dungeon experience was: click a button, get assigned to a random group of people from different realms, teleport to instance, run behind the over geared guy one-shotting everything, collect some badges/points/gear or whatever they were handing out (because there was no effort, those rewards were completely forgettable in themselves), and teleport back to the city. The experience was utterly dull, boring and pointless -- so I quit and didn't even bother trying WoD (which was the right decision).

[papaz]

These are the times when I am embarrassed that I am part of the WoW community. "I want, I want, gimme, gimme, gimme" is all I hear from these people. It's like listeneing to a bunch of 5 year olds crying over a toy their parents won't buy for them. Seriously why can't these people just either accept the game or move on to something else? If it's not part of Blizzard's agenda then leave it alone. This is not YOUR game. You don't get to make the decisions of what gets added and what gets taken out. Sure you can provide CONSTRUCTIVE feedback, that is always welcome but demands are a different thing entirely. It truly is embarrassing.

Man, the WoW community consists of way too many self entitled people who think they can just get what they want if they cry, complain, and demand loud enough.

Funny. Reading your post it's not obvious if you mean Legacy people are the ones crying for toys or if it is the people that got WoW to the pointn of "World of queue craft" where you without talking to anyone, communicating or investing time can just press a button and get exactly what you want.

[Doomchicken]

Their idea of a what a RPG is all about is micro managing over a dozen stats...

Mate, gotta have them real RPG stats like THAC0, save vs spell, save vs death and so on.

[Deleted]

people brought their arguments. blizzard stated their response and decision.

sad crybabies cant handle a "no".

simple as that

[Deleted]

Mate, gotta have them real RPG stats like THAC0, save vs spell, save vs death and so on.

I love those games that used that stats, i think i must have played nearly all of them, but in none of them Execution was an important part of the game.
You were allowed to pause the game, and you could save in the middle of a boss encounter, as many times as you wanted.
Those games were about issuing orders, but never about execution, so it is a very different beast.

[Deleted]

Oh, interesting. I like the idea of a pristine server. I'd never play on one personally, but I think it would please a lot of people that want LFG, leveling perks, heirlooms etc. to be removed. It would create a real server community again and people seem to miss that, at least some of them. I hope they will implement this, it might even lead the way to more (and different) specialized servers. Maybe one without LFR and/or without flying, so people who want that can play like that and leave us LFR-er and/or flyers alone

Thank goodness someone is not being all negative and raging, but just seeing a good addition to the game and ways to play it. I would definitely play on Pristine server as me and my friends love questing and leveling up, we consider this to be most fun part of the game, but in its current state leveling feels quite dis-balanced and lonely. I see Pristine servers as an amazing solution.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I will definitely resub if they make these "pristine" realms. I really hope they do a few more things with it though.

- Decrease XP gain from all sources
- Increase difficulty of all Mobs
- No flying mounts

Those are the main things I can think of.

I agree with your premise... one huge problem with current WoW is the leveling...

[Deficineiron]

The post you're quoting was an reply to a question "if couple of hobbyists can, why can't Blizzard?". My post was an answer to that question: They're not directly comparable setups.

The question you're asking is interesting, but fundamentally different. You're asking "how much work would it be?" and to be honest, I don't know, because I haven't seen the WoW codebase and I know nothing about their billing/ticketing/financial/backend platforms. I have worked in big enterprise IT before, migrating legacy mainframe applications - and it's not always trivial and sometimes it's very complicated - but to make any sort of guesses what it would take for Blizzard to integrate their new processes/systems to the 12-15 year old architecture would be .. well, just guessing. I don't know what the gap between "old vanilla code" and "new WoD code" is in terms of backend integration, security etc.

Judging by their responses, they don't seem to think is trivial.

would it be *much* simpler just to use a modern engine and a map without the cataclysm damage, then place mobs appropriately along with quests, (raid/intance portals already are there), and go from there? If they don't want to have a feature in the version such as lfr/lfd they can disable it. They would need to integrate the old talent system (if they were going to permit it, my question isn't for a Frankenstein server but an effort to offer classic servers).

[Daffan]

Nostalrius announced they are meeting with Blizzard at their offices on their twitter.

[Pann]

would it be *much* simpler just to use a modern engine and a map without the cataclysm damage, then place mobs appropriately along with quests, (raid/intance portals already are there), and go from there? If they don't want to have a feature in the version such as lfr/lfd they can disable it. They would need to integrate the old talent system (if they were going to permit it, my question isn't for a Frankenstein server but an effort to offer classic servers).

I've suggested something similar but apparently this simply cannot be done and the wheel must be reinvented.

[Deficineiron]

Mate, gotta have them real RPG stats like THAC0, save vs spell, save vs death and so on.

Didn't baldur's gate have that?

At this point the folks who actually remember thac0 are becoming a distinct minority.

[Pann]

Nostalrius announced they are meeting with Blizzard at their offices on their twitter.

Yup, I saw that. Their legal department will meet them at the gates, papers in hand.

[Deficineiron]

I've suggested something similar but apparently this simply cannot be done and the wheel must be reinvented.

Yes, and it would cost years of revenue.

You know my frankenstein scenario but I will repost it in brief -

More seriously, this ties into my whole Frankenstein Server concern, where the fact that the game IS in the modern engine means they modify and include all the qol features that are current, and LFD/LFR requries tuning dungeons to faceroll, with flying, and modern bg system (lol at noobs wanting classic av for all these years) and questlines are 'modernized' to single-zone and linearized, and maybe talents are so important and they put the modern talent system in, etc. and - don't forget the gamestore, with instan60, instantgold, and special account-wide mounts for sale.

The frankenstein would have the face and name of a hero (classic wow), but the guts cobbled together from modern retail wow.

I think the temptation would be very hard to avoid for Activision-Blizzard, no matter what blizzard thinks of it. Additionally, it may be blizzard would be REQUIRED to make any classic server accessible by modern standards and this is part of the great difficulty they would face in offering classic servers.

[cam5778]

Not really, majority doesn't know what exactly pservers are and don't have any clue how to find/connect to one.

This is exactly why I haven't played on a private server yet. I stopped regularly playing after BRF. I now stay subbed with gold, but I might log in once a month for 10-20 minutes only to old friends on bnet. There really is nothing left that was worth playing for. I have 5 characters, in full mythic BRF gear, showered in epics, with all CMs completed on each. Could I have done Mythic HFC? Yes I could have, my guild and every other raiding guild quit and I just have no desire to play the game. I got a refund for my pre-order on Legion because the direction the game has gone is a game I have no interest in playing anymore. If Blizzard did release a classic server, I'd be one of those people who'd play it, but until then, I'll do something else with my time.

[Froggy]

Nostalrius announced they are meeting with Blizzard at their offices on their twitter.

This is awesome.

[Pann]

Yes, and it would cost years of revenue.

You know my frankenstein scenario but I will repost it in brief -

More seriously, this ties into my whole Frankenstein Server concern, where the fact that the game IS in the modern engine means they modify and include all the qol features that are current, and LFD/LFR requries tuning dungeons to faceroll, with flying, and modern bg system (lol at noobs wanting classic av for all these years) and questlines are 'modernized' to single-zone and linearized, and maybe talents are so important and they put the modern talent system in, etc. and - don't forget the gamestore, with instan60, instantgold, and special account-wide mounts for sale.

The frankenstein would have the face and name of a hero (classic wow), but the guts cobbled together from modern retail wow.

I think the temptation would be very hard to avoid for Activision-Blizzard, no matter what blizzard thinks of it. Additionally, it may be blizzard would be REQUIRED to make any classic server accessible by modern standards and this is part of the great difficulty they would face in offering classic servers.

I am not so sure that LFD would necessarily need dungeons to be nerfed as the core audience for a classic server is likely to not only be more skilled than many of the current retail players but more tolerant to failure. Also, I am not sure that LFR would be required as the 40 man format means that lesser skilled players would be bought along to make up the numbers.