Legion - Artifact Trait and Respec Costs, Kirin Tor Ring, Tweets, Blood DK Preview

[chaud]

And what about hybrids which are played as such? My priests are heal/dps, my paladins are either tank/heal or heal/dps or tank/dps, etc. I don't trust them making healing specs viable for questing. So I would need to play 3 characters if I want to experience the gameplay of the different specs? What are we getting triple-spec then for?

The respec cost is for changing the existing tree, you can change specs and equip your other specs artifact at no cost (in terms of artifact power).

[Okacz]

But again, there is no incentive to do that in such short time. Chances are the majority of players will still be levelling while the people who dinged 110 after a few days are waiting around bored for their heroic dungeon queue to pop.
Delaying the mythic dungeons and raids just gives the not so hardcore players time to catch up.

Catch up to what? People who rushed 110 to quickly zerg arid content in a Hardcore Raid Race? Maybe their guild friends, okay. But if they didn't have time to play during the leveling period, chances are they won't have it during the time their guild will be doing raids and Mythic+. So now a guild that didn't progress with them because of their gear will now be unable to progress with them due to the fast that they can't play a lot?

Again, it's all up to player. If he chooses to level as fast as possible, he should be allowed to, there is nothing wrong with his playstyle. This kind of timegating is quite unhealthy to the game, essentially cutting it into pieces to release at a schedule. As seen with Burning Crusade (a very well received expansion), players don't need this kind of babysitting. If you give them vast amount of content upfront, each of them will find something to do, and likeminded people to do it with them.

[Deleted]

Oh god I love it! Finally you pick a spec and stick with it. No more spec jumping between fights because it does %5 more damage. Hopefully this will force some sense to the elitists. Let them die in agony.

Um, why exactly wouldn't spec jumping work anymore?

[ornichi]

Um, why exactly wouldn't spec jumping work anymore?

cuz farming one artifact tree alrdy seems really time-consuming. So imagine, how long would it take for a druid to max out all 4 specs.

[Deleted]

cuz farming one artifact tree alrdy seems really time-consuming. So imagine, how long would it take for a druid to max out all 4 specs.

AFAIK you can farm AP for a different spec than the current one, also there is a mechanic that increases the AP gains, so other specs should take roughly 3-4 times faster. It's in the blue posts 1-2 pages behind I think, so I don't really see much problem in changing specs. It probably won't be any more of a struggle than now and if it is it will be brought back, because killing offspecs would definitely mean the end for this game.

[Wolfie of Medivh]

cuz farming one artifact tree alrdy seems really time-consuming. So imagine, how long would it take for a druid to max out all 4 specs.

They will have catchup mechanisms in place to help people who have maxed one to fill others more quickly. I will say at the beginning of the expansion there could be a bit more specialization - but by the time we get to the second or third tiers that should not be an issue. First tier it should be okay - just bring in some more people. Extendible size raids allow for that.

They're not gonna screw up the new spec setup with not getting the weapons you need.

[Fenis]

cuz farming one artifact tree alrdy seems really time-consuming. So imagine, how long would it take for a druid to max out all 4 specs.

Not going to 4 spec, but even just 2 will be a problem. Either you will be far behind in one spec and it will be crap in dungeon/raid or behind in both. Result will be the same, kick from raid or dungeon. It force you to focus on one only until you have enough gear to offset the weapon "lag".

They also mentioned some kind of catch-up for additional spec, to not grind as long as for the first. Anyone got some info on that ?

[Deleted]

They will have catchup mechanisms in place to help people who have maxed one to fill others more quickly. I will say at the beginning of the expansion there could be a bit more specialization - but by the time we get to the second or third tiers that should not be an issue. First tier it should be okay - just bring in some more people. Extendible size raids allow for that.

They're not gonna screw up the new spec setup with not getting the weapons you need.

You currently need around 1 million artifact power to max out one artifact weapon (some spec need a bit less, some more). If one activity were to give you 100 artifact power, you'd need to complete 10 000 activity to max out one weapon. If you completed 10 activity per day, you'd need 1000 day to complete one artifact weapon.

Even if you were to earn artifact power 3 times faster for your off spec, you ll still need 333 days to complete an offspec weapon.

I don't really know how fast you get artifact power in legion, but it seems to me to be the worst grind I've ever seen in a video game.

[Phatte]

You currently need around 1 million artifact power to max out one artifact weapon (some spec need a bit less, some more). If one activity were to give you 100 artifact power, you'd need to complete 10 000 activity to max out one weapon. If you completed 10 activity per day, you'd need 1000 day to complete one artifact weapon.

Even if you were to earn artifact power 3 times faster for your off spec, you ll still need 333 days to complete an offspec weapon.

I don't really know how fast you get artifact power in legion, but it seems to me the worst grind I've ever seen in a video game.

No one is forcing anyone to grind anything, it will come with time. If you force yourself to grind artifact power you're gunna have a bad time. Just do whatever is fun to you and it will accumulate faster than you realize, literally everything you do on the Broken Isles gives AP

- - - Updated - - -

Still more reasons to never touch WOW again. Grind, grind, grind, grind.

And why are you on a WoW forum again?

[Deleted]

No one is forcing anyone to grind anything, it will come with time. If you force yourself to grind artifact power you're gunna have a bad time. Just do whatever is fun to you and it will accumulate faster than you realize, literally everything you do on the Broken Isles gives AP

Actually I'm pretty sure we ll see artifact weapon requirements for guilds / raid groups in legion, knowing wow community. So you're saying nobody is forcing me, well I actually disagree. We re not talking about a mount or an achievement here, we're talking about improvements to the class core abilities or statistics.

Also I know very well I'm not forced to buy and play legion, and what I'm seeing doesn't really entice me to do so. I don't really understand why there is still the option to change spec if you're being funneled into one spec, unless you grind a content you already have completed countless time with another spec. It's poorly FFXIV style designed time sink in my opinion.

[Fenis]

You currently need around 1 million artifact power to max out one artifact weapon (some spec need a bit less, some more). If one activity were to give you 100 artifact power, you'd need to complete 10 000 activity to max out one weapon. If you completed 10 activity per day, you'd need 1000 day to complete one artifact weapon.

Even if you were to earn artifact power 3 times faster for your off spec, you ll still need 333 days to complete an offspec weapon.

I don't really know how fast you get artifact power in legion, but it seems to me to be the worst grind I've ever seen in a video game.

Sarcasm On:
I hope they will not introduce cash shop..... First step, make them pay for the artifact/weapon. Next step, free to play...

[Rioo]

Just as on live today, players must form groups for Legion Mythics

I really wish they would reconsider this, what's the problem having LFG for this, people that don't like LFG can still form there own group or do guild runs like today, this way everybody wins.

Sorry but I don't miss the old days spamming trade looking for group, or premade group finder groups asking for overgeared people

On live currently mythics are a joke, but they won't be in Legion if they're tuned about the same since we won't be overgearing them. You do not want "difficult" content in the LFG queue system. We've seen in the past that it doesn't work.

[Shudder]

And yet people are baying for Legacy servers. Back when the game was nothing but a grindfest.

The majority aren't. Only a whiny vocal minority.

[Deleted]

Just as on live today, players must form groups for Legion Mythics

I really wish they would reconsider this, what's the problem having LFG for this, people that don't like LFG can still form there own group or do guild runs like today, this way everybody wins.

Sorry but I don't miss the old days spamming trade looking for group, or premade group finder groups asking for overgeared people

You have been playing this fake WoW for too long. The point of an MMORPG is to find and play with people you like. I hope afking in the lobby (garrison, main city) and getting into causal nonsense difficulty content with a push of a (lfg) button is over. Find friends, find a guild or make one. #fucklfrlfg

[Moggie]

Somehow it wasn't an issue in BC and WotLK. BC released a crapton of raids and dungeons all at once, all modes unlocked, and throughout the whole expansion people didn't complain about content droughts.

Timegating is a bad sign for me. It's a way to artificially prolong the content because you know there isn't a lot of it. Worrying about players "burning through content too fast, so we have to restrict them" is like serving the meal in small portions so you can enjoy it for longer.

Even in BC, there was artificial gating. Whether in the form of Attunements (SSC, TK, Hyjal(?)), keys (required for those heroic 5mans in BC), or even long quests to gain access to Karazhan/BT, which only required one person and/or rogue to get you in (dunno about inside door) but still, you did it.

Far as releasing everything all at once. Sure, doesn't mean anybody realistically skipped Karazhan, Gruul, Magtheridon and jumped right into SSC/TK (were these even in from the get go? I don't remember that far back). SWP was the first true raid gating they implemented after the first three bosses as everybody knows. I'm sure we'll all survive difficulties being gated a little bit as usual.

People complained left and right about everything in BC from PvP to PvE to pretty much anything. They did then, they do today and they will still complain tomorrow. And yes, they complained about any perceived droughts all the time as well as the flip side complaining about needing to do said content. Saying otherwise is silly talk.

[Deleted]

Even in BC, there was artificial gating. Whether in the form of Attunements (SSC, TK, Hyjal(?)), keys (required for those heroic 5mans in BC), or even long quests to gain access to Karazhan/BT, which only required one person and/or rogue to get you in (dunno about inside door) but still, you did it.

In BC and vanilla, gating wasn't artificial, as gaining access to the raids and dungeons was tied to meaningful questlines (some of them are part of my best memories from BC and vanilla), which were pieces of content. While you re right some dungeons were gated via reputation (which still exist nowaday), the gating was different from nowadays, because time gating isn't content.

Aside from reputations, you could complete any vanilla or BC attunements in one day, provided you had the group for it. The point of attunements in BC/vanilla wasn't to delay your progress, it was to make sure you completed the content (which is something totally different). Typically, for the dungeon reputation of BC, you merely had to complete some quests in the area of the dungeon (which you would typically do while leveling) and run a few time the dungeons in normal mode (you couldn't jump right away in heroic modes dungeons anyway, as they were quite hard at the beginning of TBC).

[Deleted]

They need to be really careful with offspecs and AP, this thing can flop really bad.

[Segus1992]

Lets hope not. It would be bad if you can get the weapon in just a few days. With a Number that high, it will be assured that we can have fun for a long time.

You mean nobody will ever get them and it won't be fun ever once you get to the silly high numbers?

[guardian_titan]

383k to get the final point? That's insane. How much artifact power are we getting per world quest? Per each rare? Per random dungeon/LFR? We might be lucky to get 50-250. To get 383k for the final point would be suicide. That can't be right. If Blizzard wants to murder off specs, that's a good way to do it. Alts will be just as bad. But hey, guess we have to rely on that artifact power increase acquisition item thingy that will increase artifact power gain by like 7x at the max. So instead of 50-250 artifact power, we'll get 350-1,750. That's still like 219 of the 250 artifact power quests/items to get the final artifact point. That's THOUSANDS of quests, rares, dungeons, and raids. Blizzard's really shooting themselves in the foot. That's insane.

Supposedly we should take a few months to upgrade our artifact to max level, but how long is a few? Two months? Three? Six? Some world quests are once a week, some only a few hours. Raids reset once a week. Same with mythics. Heroics are once a day. Some rares are one time only while others are daily. Treasures are one time only. Many artifact quests are one time only. Say it takes 12 weeks to max an artifact, we'd have to (on average) get 138,298.75 artifact power a WEEK just to max out in 12 weeks. It's 103,724.0625 a week over 16 weeks if it'll take 4 months instead. At 16 weeks, that's 14,818 a day which is 60 of the 250 artifact power rewards. At 12 weeks, that's 19,757 a day which is 80 of the 250 artifact power rewards. That's insane and incredibly punishing. That's daunting and feels impossible. If it feels out of reach from the get go, many won't even bother trying.

Here's hoping Blizzard reduces the amount needed to level artifacts because that's suicidal.

And hopefully Blizzard is considering updating old rares like TLPD and even Aeonaxx, etc to use the new scaling open tap system so more people have a shot at the damn mounts. If we're spending hour upon hour in old content farming for an old item, Blizzard is failing because we should be in new content, not old. There's no reason for something in old content to be frustrating to get and forcing us to remain in that old content for longer just to get it. Faster we get out of old content, the better.

[shadowsong43]

383k to get the final point? That's insane. How much artifact power are we getting per world quest? Per each rare? Per random dungeon/LFR? We might be lucky to get 50-250. To get 383k for the final point would be suicide. That can't be right. If Blizzard wants to murder off specs, that's a good way to do it. Alts will be just as bad. But hey, guess we have to rely on that artifact power increase acquisition item thingy that will increase artifact power gain by like 7x at the max. So instead of 50-250 artifact power, we'll get 350-1,750. That's still like 219 of the 250 artifact power quests/items to get the final artifact point. That's THOUSANDS of quests, rares, dungeons, and raids. Blizzard's really shooting themselves in the foot. That's insane.

Supposedly we should take a few months to upgrade our artifact to max level, but how long is a few? Two months? Three? Six? Some world quests are once a week, some only a few hours. Raids reset once a week. Same with mythics. Heroics are once a day. Some rares are one time only while others are daily. Treasures are one time only. Many artifact quests are one time only. Say it takes 12 weeks to max an artifact, we'd have to (on average) get 138,298.75 artifact power a WEEK just to max out in 12 weeks. It's 103,724.0625 a week over 16 weeks if it'll take 4 months instead. At 16 weeks, that's 14,818 a day which is 60 of the 250 artifact power rewards. At 12 weeks, that's 19,757 a day which is 80 of the 250 artifact power rewards. That's insane and incredibly punishing. That's daunting and feels impossible. If it feels out of reach from the get go, many won't even bother trying.

Here's hoping Blizzard reduces the amount needed to level artifacts because that's suicidal.

And hopefully Blizzard is considering updating old rares like TLPD and even Aeonaxx, etc to use the new scaling open tap system so more people have a shot at the damn mounts. If we're spending hour upon hour in old content farming for an old item, Blizzard is failing because we should be in new content, not old. There's no reason for something in old content to be frustrating to get and forcing us to remain in that old content for longer just to get it. Faster we get out of old content, the better.

Currently in alpha from my experience, you get a token that grants 50 per completed heroic or 25 per normal dungeon. Each boss can drop a tome for another 25-50 IF your lucky. There are several quest chains that end with 100 power. Rares and chests can drop items that grant between 25-50 power. I cleared three zones and got about 3200 power with the odd dungeon here and there so the grind is real. In the older version of the alpha every boss had a chance to drop a tome for 100 power per boss so on a very lucky run you could come out with 400-600 power per run. But that has been nerfed to shit. I'm sure they will add a ton of stuff coming up especially in raids, world quests and elite quests.