North Carolina, U.S., square off over transgender rights

[Enthusiastic Steward]

You can't be arrested for refusing to show your papers. The USA isn't a fascist police state.

I've got people working on this.

In other news, anyone caught spying on someone or inappropriate touching or doing anything untoward in a public restroom is already a criminal regardless of their gender or whatever bathroom they are in. Everyone knows this. The policy makers know this. The people pushing this agenda know this. The fact that the people promoting this legislation know that the acts they claim to be concerned about are already illegal makes this a pointless exercise in attention-grabbing or simple base agitation for no purpose other than to whip up a hostile frenzy who they hope will vote for them. This is empty noise over a non-issue and everyone knows it.

If I put on a wig, say I identify as a woman, and go into a public restroom and peek at young girls, I'm already committing a crime without this law. If I go through gender re-assignment therapy and surgery to become a woman and go into a public restroom and peek at young girls, I'm already committing a crime without this law. If I was born a woman and go into a public restroom and peek at young girls, I'm already committing a crime without this law.

[Masark]

The USA isn't a fascist police state.

I am becoming less and less convinced of this.

[Zeth Hawkins]

Thanks, but I don't use this site to look for dates.

When did I imply that this site sold dates?

Yes. Or they wouldn't amputate.

All you're doing is demonstrating a lack of comprehension as to medical definitions. Also that BIID isn't actually delineated in the DSM-V, unlike the issues we're discussing, because it's so rare that very little research has been conducted thus far.

So BIID is so rare and has so little research that I cannot talk about it, but your omnipotence allows you to know that amputation is healthy.

Oh, and it's basic knowledge that treating the symptoms of an illness does not make a person healthy. Cough drops, nasal sprays, and disfigurement all treat a symptom. None of them make you healthy.

[Hiricine]

Did people actually screw up in biology when they were explained the existence of the X and Y chromosomes?

On a second note, people who paid for and own the bathroom should be allowed to make their own rules for the bathroom however they like, and if they don't post anything there shouldn't be any legal ramifications for using whatever bathroom you prefer. If Chick-Fil-A wants to have only birth certified females in the female bathroom it better be ready to post security outside to check the birth certificates.

This is such a non-issue its dumb. "Trans" people are victims of their own and society's stupidity for allowing the argument that unchangeable physical characteristics are meaningless. Its an attempt to create their own victim class and the worst part is that there are idiots taking the bait and antagonizing them.

[Fairybolt]

And, once again, nobody is being oppressed by being required to use the bathroom that corresponds with the gender that appears on their birth certificate.

You do realize many states won't re-release birth certificates at all, some re-release after SRS, and some either do or are considering re-releasing them well before SRS.

So, here's your options:

1.) Let a transwoman into the women's bathroom because, despite having a cock and balls, another state has reissued her birth certificate.
2.) Only let in transwomen who've got a cunt.
3.) Deny any transwoman who have a cunt because their birth certificate can't be changed.

Let's clarify here.

Also, how comfortable are you with transwomen being beaten and raped. You claim no oppression, but I would call assault and murder a clear example of abridging liberty. Who gets to pee in the lady's room, and who risks getting beat to death?

Let's let Hammerfest decide, since he's so fucking smart.

[Endus]

Did people actually screw up in biology when they were explained the existence of the X and Y chromosomes?

Which don't explain XXY, XXXY, XXX, XY women, XX men, intersexed individuals, transgendered, and other conditions I'm overlooking.

If you think gender boils down to XX or XY, you don't understand how complex the biology is.

[Brubear]

Given that until states started to try and pass laws regulating this, many places (Target included) allowed you to use the restroom you identified with. We didn't see waves of perverts using this freedom by dressing up as the opposite gender that they identify with in order to peek/assault others.

So what changed. What happened that makes it so suddenly it's a real, significant threat, enough to require legislating it. Again, it wasn't illegal before states started trying to pass laws making it illegal, so why will it now put people in danger?

In addition, how will making it illegal to use the restroom you identify with prevent this? Everything you're afraid of these people doing is already illegal, so if it's the fear of the law deterring them that seems redundant. If you think it will make it easier for them to commit these illegal acts then why is there not a large record of people doing just that before states tried to make it illegal?

This is an honest, sincere question to the supporters of this law. What changed from the unstated policy of "use what you want" to require us making it illegal, and what dangers would allowing you to do so by law would suddenly arise that didn't happen when that was already allowed?

[Fairybolt]

So what changed.

They weren't allowed to hate on gays anymore (outside of the US. Murdering them is okay in other countries, though). So, onto the next group for them to hate.

[Talsar]

dudes with shlongs are hanging out in the mens room? ummmmm of course they are THEY ARE FUCKING MEN. there is a reason why private areas have been split by gender for thousands of years. not every joe schmo with a blonde wig should be granted access into a woman's bathroom.

yeah and under this law joe schmo doesn't even need a wig, just say "i'm biologically a woman" and if anyone asks say you underwent gene therapy.

you gonna force people to strip naked/provide a copy of their birth certificate to gain access to bathrooms now?

if someone really wants to gain access to a restroom for malicious purposes no petty law is gonna stop it so stop pretending that's what this is about rather than discriminating against the transgendered

[Brubear]

Did people actually screw up in biology when they were explained the existence of the X and Y chromosomes?

On a second note, people who paid for and own the bathroom should be allowed to make their own rules for the bathroom however they like, and if they don't post anything there shouldn't be any legal ramifications for using whatever bathroom you prefer. If Chick-Fil-A wants to have only birth certified females in the female bathroom it better be ready to post security outside to check the birth certificates.

This is such a non-issue its dumb. "Trans" people are victims of their own and society's stupidity for allowing the argument that unchangeable physical characteristics are meaningless. Its an attempt to create their own victim class and the worst part is that there are idiots taking the bait and antagonizing them.

Because genetics is clearly black and white and trans people just bring it on themselves. Yep, genetics and decisions by doctors can in no way play a part in someone feeling like they should be a different gender.

http://www.genetic.org/Knowledge/Wha...ariations.aspx
http://newsarchive.medill.northweste...ws-218194.html

[Machismo]

And, once again, nobody is being oppressed by being required to use the bathroom that corresponds with the gender that appears on their birth certificate.

Says the oppressor...

[RickJamesLich]

Some people don't think black people are really people. Both types of person are wrong, and their opinions are without merit.

Dude plz stop trying to turn this into a racial discussion lol. Most black people don't think their fight for equal rights has anything in common with this. Black people were viewed as an inferior race, which was wrong. Nobody is viewing transgendered people as inferior, rather, we expect them to treat others and their privacy with respect.

This is fundamentally, scientifically, and medically incorrect.

To make matters worse for you, it also directly contradicts your position in this thread, since it would argue that transgendered people after SRS are the genders they identify as, which you were disputing.

That's not why that's their gender, however. Just pointing out the hypocrisy.

So scientists don't believe that the X and Y chromosomes determine sex? lol, I think not. It appears you and me have a disconnect here, you refer to their gender, I'm referring to their sex. And I didn't say anything about post op's, but allow me to clarify. If the person does have the sex change, in that scenario, I'm personally ok with them using the new bathroom, but that's just my opinion on the matter. As I'm sure you will agree, that is a very different scenario from someone who still has their "old parts". And from what I've personally read, it appears that it is uncommon for most transgendered people to go all the way through and get the sex change. The estimations I've seen suggest that there are 700,00 people that identify as transgendered, but only a fraction of sex change surgeries occur in the US each year (estimated to be between 100 to 1,000). My source was:

http://www.surgeryencyclopedia.com/P...#ixzz3IEs78dnj

The number can be found under "demographics".

You can't be arrested for refusing to show your papers. The USA isn't a fascist police state.

There are many instances in which you are expected to have a license, don't be silly Endus. The only thing that has changed is transgendered people are being expected to have ID in the event that they panic someone when they go into the restroom.

[Cthulhu 2020]

I take it you've never actually met anyone that's transgendered.

He probably has met lots of transgenedered people and never knew it. Most people in here would feel really weird if a transgendered man (XX chromosome) went into the women's restroom, because they look like men.

[cuafpr]

Let me just restate this: if you're taking HRT to have time with your GF / BF / See penises or boobies, you're doing everything in your life completely wrong.

Go look up HRT.

u don't have to take HRT... u can simply say i ID as a girl today and walk in... no HRT needed nothing zip zap zero....

[Brubear]

Dude plz stop trying to turn this into a racial discussion lol. Most black people don't think their fight for equal rights has anything in common with this. Black people were viewed as an inferior race, which was wrong. Nobody is viewing transgendered people as inferior, rather, we expect them to treat others and their privacy with respect.



So scientists don't believe that the X and Y chromosomes determine sex? lol, I think not. It appears you and me have a disconnect here, you refer to their gender, I'm referring to their sex. And I didn't say anything about post op's, but allow me to clarify. If the person does have the sex change, in that scenario, I'm personally ok with them using the new bathroom, but that's just my opinion on the matter. As I'm sure you will agree, that is a very different scenario from someone who still has their "old parts". And from what I've personally read, it appears that it is uncommon for most transgendered people to go all the way through and get the sex change. The estimations I've seen suggest that there are 700,00 people that identify as transgendered, but only a fraction of sex change surgeries occur in the US each year (estimated to be between 100 to 1,000). My source was:

http://www.surgeryencyclopedia.com/P...#ixzz3IEs78dnj

The number can be found under "demographics".



There are many instances in which you are expected to have a license, don't be silly Endus. The only thing that has changed is transgendered people are being expected to have ID in the event that they panic someone when they go into the restroom.

and if you're one of the people who aren't born XX or XY?

http://www.genetic.org/Knowledge/Wha...ariations.aspx
http://newsarchive.medill.northweste...ws-218194.html

[hrugner]

So basically you haven't been in a public bathroom in decades? Stalls are completely private and all bathrooms have them.

The gap in your experience is almost as big as the gap in the privacy of a bathroom stall.

[Vanyali]

u don't have to take HRT... u can simply say i ID as a girl today and walk in... no HRT needed nothing zip zap zero....

Except that's not how it works, at all, even the slightest.

[Endus]

So scientists don't believe that the X and Y chromosomes determine sex?

They're involved, but it's not a binary, concrete determinative process, no. That much is scientifically clear.

It appears you and me have a disconnect here, you refer to their gender, I'm referring to their sex.

No, I'm referring to sex. You just don't understand some pretty basic biology. You're trying to gloss over it with a grade 3 oversimplification of the concepts involved.

[hrugner]

shouldn't you be locking this instead of trying to "educate" people?

[Adam Jensen]

And what if you were the guy he was next to when he took that shit?

Uh . . . I take shits in stalls so I generally have no clue who's next to me, as all I see are shoes and pants wrapped around ankles (and hear the occasional grunting.)