The Great American Lie: Work Earns Living Wage

[Kathandira]

I think you underestimate the Midwest. In all 3 areas you listed.

The coasts are becoming increasingly expensive and many tech companies and startups are moving or starting here in the Midwest.

My city has a big arena for not that big of a city and one if the best local music scenes outside of very large cites NYC LA etc.

Interesting. How is the Pharma Industry looking out there? Because I work with Medical Technology.

As for the music scene, large areas are far out of my reach. It is local venues that I frequently play at. NJ has a ton of them!

[Theinquisition]

I respect that. The Vets I know are the same. They honestly don't want to be reminded about their time in service. It was a stepping stone to building their life.

But there are the few who will get up in arms if you question their reasons for going to war.

As for your benefits, it's the least of my worries. More times than not, Vets are getting screwed out of what was promised to them anyhow.

You want to talk about benefits that are not deserved, look at our government. They are the ones who are getting the lions share of benefits that they do not deserve.

I agree 100% you're a good man big K.

When asked about why I went to war, I don't get into the politics of it. I went to keep my brother to the left and the right alive and healthy.

[Daerio]

Most veterans don't feel people like yourself owe us shit. We would rather you leave us alone and quit whining hen we get something you don't.

Want veterans benefits? Be a veteran, otherwise leave us alone.

Again, nobody is talking about your benefits big boy, just your totally warped sense of reality.

[Theinquisition]

We're essentially negotiating the CONTRACT for the WORK to be done for the foreseeable future in the private sector.

That's what minimum wage is. That's not welfare or handouts or charity.

And get real asshole, you didn't negotiate your contract with your recruiter like you're some master businessman deserving of a living wage, while everyone else is scum that deserves to be poor. Sure, the military is definitely real work, expectations are definitely high at times, and some of the pay grades lag behind, but the benefits of doing government work generally far outweigh it. We throw all kinds of money at the military, if not in the wisest of places.

Who said anything about negotitating?

It's a contract between two agreeing parties. The benefits are part of the contract.

Want the benefits, sign the contract. It's simple as that.

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Again, nobody is talking about your benefits big boy, just your totally warped sense of reality.

Good thing I wasn't quoting you huh.

[Tinykong]

no need for down payment here, I bought my 10 Acre farm building site without any money down.

If you want to buy a house, without a down payment, enjoy pissing away a lot of money on PMI. My sister's PMI is more than my car payment. No thanks!

[Daerio]

Who said anything about negotitating?

It's a contract between two agreeing parties. The benefits are part of the contract.

Want the benefits, sign the contract. It's simple as that.

It's an artificially set wage by government regulation.

Exactly what minimum wage is.

2+2 = 4

[Fugus]

If you're coming out of the service and the best job you can get is a entry level Wal-Mart employee, I think they have bigger issues than the service itself.

We can site anecdotes to each other all day, but my point remains the same.

If someone wants to whine about veteran benefits, be a veteran. Listening to this constant whining from people who Want the benefits without putting in the time for them is annoying.

I am not whining about the benefits, I am saying that those shouldn't be benefits, those should be baseline for a civilized nation and that veteran benefits should go beyond that.

And as for them leaving the military and getting stuck at entry level jobs. They were basic infantry (I think one of them did artillery) and never bothered with the higher education so when they got out after about a decade or so in the army, their skill set pretty much limited them to entry level, police officer, or security guard. And given the job market, even those can be hard to get. So they came out thinking in the same mindset that they had while they were in that even the lowest man on the totem pole was paid enough to live and that you could try and prove yourself and all. Then they ended up real life where none of that happened as much as they expected it to.

Most of them quit or got fired within the first 9 months or so and one quit Walmart for McDonalds as they were offering to pay him better.

Off-topic since I know I have talked about it to you before, would you believe it but after all this time I am STILL stuck fighting the Department of Veteran Affairs over disability? Got a Lawyer about 6 months ago and they even tried to get over on them. The doctors filed the paperwork for the claim to get it started only to have them try to rush the paperwork and come to a decision before the evidence packet even arrived and tried to deny more due to lack of evidence which was still in the mail.

At this point they are fighting me, Lawyers, the VA's doctors, a Civilian doctor and the Surgeon who cut me open and they are STILL trying to fight it. And getting my discharge corrected to medical is just as big of a fight. They are trying to say that my service connected injury with all the paperwork on the planet dating back to when I got it but to them, they are saying it didn't happen till I got out and trying to claim the MRI only showed minor issues but was otherwise normal ignoring the fact that the messed up disc pinching a nerve was neither minor nor normal.

[melodramocracy]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...vernment-help/



Conservatives will no doubt rewrite history and say these people don't deserve to be paid a living wage. This is what happens when the wealthy go unchecked.

Exactly. This is what wealth consolidation looks like.

[Gamdwelf]

Interesting. How is the Pharma Industry looking out there? Because I work with Medical Technology.

As for the music scene, large areas are far out of my reach. It is local venues that I frequently play at. NJ has a ton of them!

One of glakso Smith kliens big locations is in my town. They used to be phizer. We have some big agricultural medical technology companies too.

We have a huge local music scene at least where I live can't speak for the whole Midwest.

[Kathandira]

When it comes to our social services in the U.S., it is a huge lie.

For example, in NJ we have a transportation trust fund. This was a fund to keep our roads and infrastructure safe. Well...our politicians ignored the word Trust, and decided to fund their campaigns with that money. Now our roads are a horrible mess, our bridges need repairs and so on, and there is no money left. It is dried up.

So now they want to raise taxes on the citizens!!! Rather than investigating to find out who stole the money, and holding them accountable, it got thrown right on the back of the residents.

Our government is beyond corrupt, and there is very little we can do about. And with that, we sit here and argue about it, while they sit back in their comfy chairs drinking scotch and having a laugh at all of us poor bastards.

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One of glakso Smith kliens big locations is in my town. They used to be phizer. We have some big agricultural medical technology companies too.

We have a huge local music scene at least where I live can't speak for the whole Midwest.

Very interesting. Well, i'll have to reconsider my view of the mid west if it is on the rise like that.

[Theinquisition]

I am not whining about the benefits, I am saying that those shouldn't be benefits, those should be baseline for a civilized nation and that veteran benefits should go beyond that.

And as for them leaving the military and getting stuck at entry level jobs. They were basic infantry (I think one of them did artillery) and never bothered with the higher education so when they got out after about a decade or so in the army, their skill set pretty much limited them to entry level, police officer, or security guard. And given the job market, even those can be hard to get. So they came out thinking in the same mindset that they had while they were in that even the lowest man on the totem pole was paid enough to live and that you could try and prove yourself and all. Then they ended up real life where none of that happened as much as they expected it to.

Most of them quit or got fired within the first 9 months or so and one quit Walmart for McDonalds as they were offering to pay him better.

Off-topic since I know I have talked about it to you before, would you believe it but after all this time I am STILL stuck fighting the Department of Veteran Affairs over disability? Got a Lawyer about 6 months ago and they even tried to get over on them. The doctors filed the paperwork for the claim to get it started only to have them try to rush the paperwork and come to a decision before the evidence packet even arrived and tried to deny more due to lack of evidence which was still in the mail.

At this point they are fighting me, Lawyers, the VA's doctors, a Civilian doctor and the Surgeon who cut me open and they are STILL trying to fight it. And getting my discharge corrected to medical is just as big of a fight. They are trying to say that my service connected injury with all the paperwork on the planet dating back to when I got it but to them, they are saying it didn't happen till I got out and trying to claim the MRI only showed minor issues but was otherwise normal ignoring the fact that the messed up disc pinching a nerve was neither minor nor normal.

Not shocked to be honest, the hardest part of the entire process is getting the VA to acknowledge shit in the first place.

I just submitted my paperwork to add my wife and baby as dependants.

One form....just one form.

Estamated time of processing? Nov 2017.

Anyway, I always encouraged my soldiers to use their TA assistance before they got out, primarily to avoid the issues your buddies are having now.

I'd even let them out a hour early to make class if need be. I cared about my Joe's.

Anyway, I SMH at the guys who get out and DON'T use their GI BILL at all. That shit is gold.

As far as the rest of the population? I have a hard time caring. Most left wingers hate veterans and whine that we get something they dont, and right wingers use us as political pawns while fucking us over.

I got out, use my GI BILL and have a job that I love going to everyday that pays enough to support my family and provide a generous lifestyle.

[Ahovv]

Its incredible how ass backwards the cons have become.

They tout small midwest America but don't give 2 shits that Wal-Mart has bulldozed virtually all traditional small businesses like hardware stores, pharmacies, etc. They tout small town farm culture but defend Big Ag which has literally destroyed most family farms. Now they're gonna shit all over what used to be the backbone of America, factory jobs, all so the 1% can get even more while they vote for the embodiment of that corporate greed in Trump.

For fuck's sake...the walmart logic? Yes, I'm sure without walmart (and assuming no other business steps up in its success) there would be many more smaller stores. And guess what? They would all be more expensive.

[Daerio]

As far as the rest of the population? I have a hard time caring. Most left wingers hate veterans and whine that we get something they dont, and right wingers use us as political pawns while fucking us over.

What about when the US government essentially says what you're saying, "Fuck you, got mine" - already got your service, why should we keep funding your benefits?

Is that when you appeal to past service, honor? The rest of the population you refer to, who carry your salary with their productivity and you regard as utter shit should now care about your problems?

[Fugus]

Anyway, I SMH at the guys who get out and DON'T use their GI BILL at all. That shit is gold.

As far as the rest of the population? I have a hard time caring. Most left wingers hate veterans and whine that we get something they dont, and right wingers use us as political pawns while fucking us over.

I got out, use my GI BILL and have a job that I love going to everyday that pays enough to support my family and provide a generous lifestyle.

I have heard a bunch of guys saying that about left wingers but I honestly have never met one in my life who does short of those extremists you see who end up starving their child to death trying to force them to be vegan or some crap.

Most left wingers I have met have no issues with our veterans or our soldiers, their issues are with the leaders who are issuing them orders or private contractors abusing them for revenue streams and such. Never with the soldiers themselves.

As for my stuff, the lawyers estimate my wait time between this June and next June depending on who's desk it falls on. Then after all that is done, I will end up having to go to another lawyer to deal with getting my discharge corrected which will cost me about $5,000 to $7,000 as they stated that I can no longer appeal my discharge through them and must go to a court of appropriate jurisdiction.

So far, I have had them try to ignore my MRI (done through the VA) twice along with 8 months of medical records 2+ years ago and this year they so far tried to ignore my surgical records + follow ups, my post-op MRI showing where the surgical area scarred over instead of healing up and the medical opinions of the VA doctor who has seen me since 2014 and the civilian doctor the lawyers sent me to with both doctors stating the exact same things with the VA doctors going a lot more in depth on them.

[Theinquisition]

What about when the US government essentially says what you're saying, "Fuck you, got mine" - already got your service, why should we keep funding your benefits?

Is that when you appeal to past service, honor? The rest of the population you refer to, who carry your salary with their productivity and you regard as utter shit should now care about your problems?

I'm not to concerned with entry position holders, and frankly, I make enough that if my disability were cut off tomorrow it would be an inconvenience, nothing more.

The entry level burger flippers are not paying for it anyway since most are getting back every penny they paid in federal taxes anyway.

If and when the govt ops out of paying those benefits, I'm sure the rest of the country would have already gone up in flames.

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I have heard a bunch of guys saying that about left wingers but I honestly have never met one in my life who does short of those extremists you see who end up starving their child to death trying to force them to be vegan or some crap.

Most left wingers I have met have no issues with our veterans or our soldiers, their issues are with the leaders who are issuing them orders or private contractors abusing them for revenue streams and such. Never with the soldiers themselves.

As for my stuff, the lawyers estimate my wait time between this June and next June depending on who's desk it falls on. Then after all that is done, I will end up having to go to another lawyer to deal with getting my discharge corrected which will cost me about $5,000 to $7,000 as they stated that I can no longer appeal my discharge through them and must go to a court of appropriate jurisdiction.

So far, I have had them try to ignore my MRI (done through the VA) twice along with 8 months of medical records 2+ years ago and this year they so far tried to ignore my surgical records + follow ups, my post-op MRI showing where the surgical area scarred over instead of healing up and the medical opinions of the VA doctor who has seen me since 2014 and the civilian doctor the lawyers sent me to with both doctors stating the exact same things with the VA doctors going a lot more in depth on them.

Once it goes to court you should be fine, provided that you have documentation backing you up. You'll get what you earned, with lots of back pay.

As far as the left winger stuff goes, most are too cowardly to talk shit to your face. They save it for places like mmoc.

Just so happens that most of them also support Bernie.

If you ever move to Phoenix, jacksonville, atlanta, or Dallas let me know, I will give you a job reference for a position that will pay roughly 27-30 an hour.

[Macaquerie]

For fuck's sake...the walmart logic? Yes, I'm sure without walmart (and assuming no other business steps up in its success) there would be many more smaller stores. And guess what? They would all be more expensive.

Prices are not the main issue here though. Money spent at local mom and pop stores circulates within the local economy, as mom and pop go and spend their profits at other businesses in the area. Money spent at Walmart goes into the pockets of shareholders, who by and large use it to buy more shares of stock. While that enables companies to make investments, it's unlikely that the money will ever circle back to where it was spent initially, and small towns have been crushed under this weight for the past few decades, meaning that people start leaving to seek opportunity elsewhere which hastens the decline of the local economy.

This isn't to say that there's some magic formula that will revitalize small town America, that model of economic organization was admittedly inefficient and is probably never coming back in the same form. However, the important thing is to ensure that money continues to circulate, which is only possible if it goes to people who will actually spend it and not go toward enriching the wealthy who have no need to buy any more and just want to stash it somewhere they can earn good returns, which not coincidentally are becoming harder and harder to find these days.

[Daerio]

I'm not to concerned with entry position holders, and frankly, I make enough that if my disability were cut off tomorrow it would be an inconvenience, nothing more.

The entry level burger flippers are not paying for it anyway since most are getting back every penny they paid in federal taxes anyway.

If and when the govt ops out of paying those benefits, I'm sure the rest of the country would have already gone up in flames.

It's a slow erosion to the benefits, not an overnight cut. It's why you see people having such a hard time with the VA. It's why you see wages not increasing for military personnel.

And I get it, you're a total narcissist. That doesn't mean the country is going to benefit by being lead by narcissists. The country will not survive that way.

[Fugus]

I'm not to concerned with entry position holders, and frankly, I make enough that if my disability were cut off tomorrow it would be an inconvenience, nothing more.

The entry level burger flippers are not paying for it anyway since most are getting back every penny they paid in federal taxes anyway.

If and when the govt ops out of paying those benefits, I'm sure the rest of the country would have already gone up in flames.

That is actually one of the main things about having a living wage.

With a living wage, the workers now make enough to pay in taxes instead of getting all that money back and on top of that, they no longer are collecting welfare because they no longer need it or even qualify for it. And it would force companies to pay what the work is worth and not force the government to subsidize the company in the form of welfare to their employees.

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Once it goes to court you should be fine, provided that you have documentation backing you up. You'll get what you earned, with lots of back pay.

As far as the left winger stuff goes, most are too cowardly to talk shit to your face. They save it for places like mmoc.

Just so happens that most of them also support Bernie.

Yeah, the evidence I have at this point I personally would consider overwhelming at this point so just a matter of how long they are trying to drag it out hoping I die first.

And most left wingers I typically talk about are those I typically talk to on Facebook or so but even on here I typically don't see many claiming it without themselves being Orlong level crazy themselves and possibly a stage act trying to troll on here.

But most of the left wingers I personally have spoken to and know of, they have never had an issue with our soldiers, their issues have always been with the orders they were given and how they were exploited by private contractors and such.

Basically one of those "I love our soldiers but hate our military" type situations similar to "I love our nation but hate our government".

[Theinquisition]

It's a slow erosion to the benefits, not an overnight cut. It's why you see people having such a hard time with the VA. It's why you see wages not increasing for military personnel.

And I get it, you're a total narcissist. That doesn't mean the country is going to benefit by being lead by narcissists. The country will not survive that way.

I'm not a Narcisist at all. I'm just tired of hearing whining from people that can't rub enough brain cells together to figure out simple requests like "no onions", "Please put extra hot sause in the bag", or "can i have a straw".

I'm not sympathetic of their plight.

[Gestopft]

Most left wingers hate veterans and whine that we get something they dont, and right wingers use us as political pawns while fucking us over.

I got out, use my GI BILL and have a job that I love going to everyday that pays enough to support my family and provide a generous lifestyle.

As a left winger, I have no issue with soldiers or veterans. I have issues with a) massive military spending and b) wars that we shouldn't be fighting.

And as someone for whom military service is not an option (asthma), I have no issues with the GI bill. For starters, it was instrumental in building the middle class after WW2 (that dreaded socialism).