Upcoming talent change gutting

[ornichi]

I don't get what the problem is.

We have already been using an Inscription item for talent changes since the introduction of the new talent system.

What's so different about this one?

this one's probably gonna cost a lot. They wrote smth about "it's designed for group usage so the price will be corresponding". Still can't see the problem though. People were asking about "hardcore" vanilla experience and now, when they gave us smth similiar, start bitching about it. So basically blizz were not wrong, people just think they want vanilla, when actually they won't last even a month if it's implemented.

[Ehuehuecopter]

I must be stupid but what does "a cost for a group" mean?

means NOTHING ATM until they update beta with that item, it can cost 1silver or 2milions gold and be crafted with legendary items that drop off a rare mob with 89hours respawn.


people are already crying in despair for nothing christ.


even if it will cost 100g im quite sure that YOUR HARDCORE GUILD will pay the "item" for min max his raid and be on the top


also if this item is crafted with NON LEGION mats this will be overstacked during the pre patch time

[mysticx]

I must be stupid but what does "a cost for a group" mean?

It means "The sort of cost a single person won't like having to cough up", few hundred G apiece probably, to make it a raid-consumable rather than something you bring a stack of to go do dailies...

I still wonder what the point of talents is if you can swap them so easily, but that's probably just me.

[l33t]

To be honest, with this change I see completely no point in having talents at all, except for bringing forced inconvenience.

[ReVnX]

It means "The sort of cost a single person won't like having to cough up", few hundred G apiece probably, to make it a raid-consumable rather than something you bring a stack of to go do dailies...

I still wonder what the point of talents is if you can swap them so easily, but that's probably just me.

I guess warlocks will have a lot of work summoning people who HS'ed to change talents then

[Ehuehuecopter]

To be honest, with this change I see completely no point in having talents at all, except for bringing forced inconvenience.

this change is the proof that Blizzard listen to the players BUT the players are retards.

- - - Updated - - -

I guess warlocks will have a lot of work summoning people who HS'ed to change talents then

Not really because the "group item" could be a scroll like those in ashran that give a "reset" to all the raid and be on a 20min cdr so no summon like in vanilla.


i really dont get where people read "YOU WILL NEED LOCK" if blizzard stated that you will have a group item for reset the talents, its like a jeeves inscription for repairs

[RobertoCarlos]

As always blizzard developers having conflicting design goals. Color me surprised. Talents were made more accessible and easier to change and now they are going back on that and making changing them quite a pain to be honest and as always they use hyperbole examples to illustrate their point "WE DONT WANT PLAYERS CHANGING FROM MOVEMENT SPEED WHILE RUNNING TO THEIR FLYING MOUNT THEN CHANGING BACK TO SHADOW STEP FOR THE BOSS SO WE MADE IT REALLY INCONVIENT INSTEAD"

getting flashbacks of the water strider change where they said they didnt want players constantly just using the water stride because it had an added advantage being able to walk on water. Just fucking relax and focus on making the game fun for a change.

[Jessicka]

Yeah but that's more an issue of how the current talents are designed.

Basically now most classes have talents tiers designed as flat utility/AOE/single target talents, and not getting the relevant talent in the given situation ruins your performance (a class like retribution paladin is heavily dependant on those talents). It's not just a QoL choice as it should be, it's just that you just cannot mathematically do the same thing depending on what talent you choose no matter how you adapt your gameplay.

Well exactly, this is why they aren't choices at all, and is why the irritation that they're making essential button clicking UI navigation more tedious. It's not choice, it's just piss annoying mistake if you get distracted, forget or someone pulls and you're unable to go through those motions.

[bewbew]

Rogue A cant play tonight so we take rogue B. Please copy rogue A spec while in the city and we port you in. Sounds like all the vanilla fail wrapped in a cheaper legion edition. You can pretend all you want that you will make thoughtful choices etc in reality the vast majority will copy the cookie cutter specs proposed by their twitch heroes and they will simply pop in and out of cities every other boss or BG to respec.

You have the guts to have true "identity"? One spec one set of talents and 10k gold to change it with double the cost to change every time. Then we see how much you love "identity".

Rogue A can't play tonight, but Rogue A's Outlaw spec was better fit for fight 1, 4 and 7 and Rogue's B Outlaw Spec is better for fight 2 and 10, which is the hardest.

The point is EXACTLY to have to play with sub-optimal stuff, and not have EVERYTHING THE BEST EVER ALL THE TIME.

Having always the best choice at hand means you ACTUALLY have no choice at all.

[Gaidax]

My only issue with this is that it is another piece of junk to carry in the bags.

[Ehuehuecopter]

If your guild doesnt bring you to some boss because you are not playing the nutella spec. change guild.

you dont have to play with the hardcore guild if that conflict with your "fun"

[Deleted]

Rogue A can't play tonight, but Rogue A's Outlaw spec was better fit for fight 1, 4 and 7 and Rogue's B Outlaw Spec is better for fight 2 and 10, which is the hardest.

The point is EXACTLY to have to play with sub-optimal stuff, and not have EVERYTHING THE BEST EVER ALL THE TIME.

Except this was a valid line of thought in vanilla, back when class had meaningful utility spells and the usefullness of people wasn't merely their DPS/HPS or tanking output, but I don't think it is particularly fun in the current wow, where all matter is the speed you push your buttons and the sheer output of DPS/HPS and mitigation you can pull off.

[Al Gorefiend]

This is awesome!

[snackfeat]

Lel, all the people cried about a trivial gold cost, and then got something even worse.

[bewbew]

Except this was a valid line of thought in vanilla, back when class had meaningful utility spells and the usefullness of people wasn't merely their DPS/HPS or tanking output, but I don't think it is particularly fun in the current wow, where all matter is the speed you push your buttons and the sheer output of DPS/HPS and mitigation you can pull off.

It's hard to translate utility as a relevant factor into smaller raids where so many enemies are already immune to so many effects.

This, however, does not change the notion that only by LIMITATIONS and by enforcing said limitations you can make Identity and Differences exist.

[RobertoCarlos]

This is awesome!

How is this awesome when you forget to change one talent like say leeching poison for rogue so you can do your dailys or outworld content then once you're there realise you still have your raiding fient talent. You're not going to go back to a city or class hall to change it you will just smash out the dailys with the less than effective talent choice. Or you will fly back/hearth and waste time. Lame.

[bewbew]

Still avoiding my original question where do all these mounts come out from. I guess the same dark place that your arguments come out from...

It's irrelevant. Your question has absolutly no bearing into a discussion about limitation breeding difference, it' s just cherry picking on a loose definition of logic.

[Puri]

this change is the proof that Blizzard listen to the players BUT the players are retards.

I cannot remember a single post that said "Please make respeccing free again but give talent changes a group-effort cost". But I'm sure you can find the retard that asked for that.

[Deleted]

It's hard to translate utility as a relevant factor into smaller raids where so many enemies are already immune to so many effects.

Yeah it is hard but not impossible (see vanilla or TBC as an example).

the reason were not seeing that anymore is mostly because wow 3.0 shifted the game from an utility based game (classes started being self sufficient, when before they relied on synergies) to a pseudo action based game.

[bewbew]

How is this awesome when you forget to change one talent like say leeching poison for rogue so you can do your dailys or outworld content then once you're there realise you still have your raiding fient talent. You're not going to go back to a city or class hall to change it you will just smash out the dailys with the less than effective talent choice. Or you will fly back/hearth and waste time. Lame.

So you play suboptimally. That's the whole point.

Your character should NOT be the best at everything as you just instantly switch to be the best possible for the situation because you....went out of combat.