Paladin Class Fantasy in Legion

[Deleted]

It is holy ground though. That would make her more powerful, and maybe the death knights weaker?

Not to that extent...

[Soikona]

Not to that extent...

It was for the Lich King. Even mentioned during the quest for his frozen heart.

[Deleted]

It was for the Lich King. Even mentioned during the quest for his frozen heart.

Lick King was vs Tyrion.

We are Deathlord (PC) + Mograine + 3 Horseman vs Liadrin. Come one...

[Soikona]

Lick King was vs Tyrion.

We are Deathlord (PC) + Mograine + 3 Horseman vs Liadrin. Come one...

Look up the quest I mentioned. It is said that the only reason the Lich King was defeated at Lights Hope was because of it being Holy Ground and that now tyrion is on unholy ground, he stands no chance. Just some basic taunting between two enemies? More than likely but if we want a lore reason, instead of a "Blizz sucks" reason, it's all we really have to go with.

[Morally Grey Storm]

Lick King was vs Tyrion.

We are Deathlord (PC) + Mograine + 3 Horseman vs Liadrin. Come one...

It was not about numbers.
It was about Holy Ground of Light's Hope Chapel.
It affected fething Lich King himself.
What makes you think you(Deathlord) are tronger than Lich King?

[Deleted]

I wonder how Paladins will retaliate or will we just be "turn the other cheek" shit?

[Sandraudiga]

Have so much invested in my paladin that even contemplating swapping to another toon is really hard, but its stuff like this that is making me more and more sure that I am going to have to.

I don't want to be an arms warrior who gets pushed around by everyone and their dog.

[Daralii]

I wonder how Paladins will retaliate or will we just be "turn the other cheek" shit?

Knowing Blizzard, it'll be turning the other cheek. There's a lot of that for Alliance when the Horde starts shit, so I don't see why they wouldn't do the same here.

[Deleted]

Regarding Liadrin.. don't forget Blood Knights are using the Sunwell as the source of their power. The renewed Sunwell is a combination of Light and Arcane if I remember correctly. She is using Quel'Delar on top of that, which is (at least it was) a powerful weapon on it's own against the Undead and is as the leader of the Blood Knights very skilled. That combined with the Holy Ground of the Chapel, which should still weaken Death Knights even after the Empowerment from the Lich King should give her the ability to hold on until Reinforcements arrive at least.

[Thundering]

I wonder how Paladins will retaliate or will we just be "turn the other cheek" shit?

They will most likly do what the alliance does when the horde destroy their towns, nothing.......

[Deleted]

It was not about numbers.
It was about Holy Ground of Light's Hope Chapel.
It affected fething Lich King himself.
What makes you think you(Deathlord) are tronger than Lich King?

Tyrion is a lot more powerful than Liadrin...

Liadrin is not more powerful than our char + 3 horseman + mograine. Not even close. Holy Ground or not it wouldn't make such a great difference.

She is not Tyrion and even Tyrion isn't stronger than 3 horseman + pc + mograine. On Holy Ground Tyrion could've stood chance, sure but not Liadrin.

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It was for the Lich King. Even mentioned during the quest for his frozen heart.

Yeah it was but he was fighting vs Tyrion. Your average paladi would've been stomped flat by LK holy ground or not.

Liadrin is not Tyrion and she doesn't have The Ashbringer either.

On the other hand we have legendary weapon, +3 horseman +mograine. Holy Ground doesn't paralyze DKs, makes them weaker but they would still mop the floor with just her holy ground or not.

- - - Updated - - -

Regarding Liadrin.. don't forget Blood Knights are using the Sunwell as the source of their power. The renewed Sunwell is a combination of Light and Arcane if I remember correctly. She is using Quel'Delar on top of that, which is (at least it was) a powerful weapon on it's own against the Undead and is as the leader of the Blood Knights very skilled. That combined with the Holy Ground of the Chapel, which should still weaken Death Knights even after the Empowerment from the Lich King should give her the ability to hold on until Reinforcements arrive at least.

Yeah, and our char has one of the most powerful weapons in existance putting Quel'Delar to shame + assistance of 4 very powerful death knights.

WE aren't talking just some normal undead here:P It's 1 better than average paladin vs 5 most powerful Death Knights in existance bar Lich King himself.

[Gallahadd]

Do we know that the horseman are there? I thought it was PC + Darion vs Liadrin.

[Ulthane]

OK them attacking Light's hope chapel only to struggle with Liadrin (player character + Darion + 3 horsemen vs Liadrin) and then get booted by the Light might be ok for the Paladin Class fantasy but at that point it's shitting on DK fantasy . . .

I think inadvertently dks may have got shafted here regardless. Watching more things (gotta watch more) I know what you have isn't Tirion.

When Tirion died you see his light/soul go away to the light. What you have is a husk and that begs the question, what is taking Tirion's place without a soul in there.

Though I could be wrong but yea.

Ultimately the fact we are getting attacked like this and no sign of retaliation or anything just is bs. It's like: ok...... soooo we don't do anything cool.

[Tijuana]

What do you guys think so far?

Honestly, I hate it. I'm all for the mounted speed bosst thing, but I'm getting really tired of the transluscent yellow hammers.

I'm a Blood Knight of Quel'Thalas, who, while the Sunwell was depleted, stole his magic from a living Naaru. I use a swift elven blade, not a bulky hammer, and my angelic wings are hardly a blessing so much as a magical item of theft.

I'm a Tauren Sunwalker. I use the power of the sun to burn my foes and heal my allies. I'm more of a sun-loving druid than a holy crusader. White and gold hammers don't match a thing on me.

I absolutely loved the fact that each class had a differnet fantasy depending on the race you chose, and it really feels like they're taking that away from us. It would be so simple to have Judgement be a beam of light from above. Honestly I just don't understand where all of these white and gold hammers are coming from aside from Humans and I want it to stop.

Blood Knights don't rely on stolen magic from the Naaru anymore. Just sayin...

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

I respect Tirion more than any other NPC in the game. That said, I distinctly remember when he was ready to don the helm of the Lich King because someone had to do it and Tirion was always prepared to make that sacrifice. As much as he deserves to rest in peace, he'd be the first to stand for duty if it meant protecting Azeroth from the Legion.

[Morally Grey Storm]

I respect Tirion more than any other NPC in the game. That said, I distinctly remember when he was ready to don the helm of the Lich King because someone had to do it and Tirion was always prepared to make that sacrifice. As much as he deserves to rest in peace, he'd be the first to stand for duty if it meant protecting Azeroth from the Legion.

As a fething DK?
No.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

As a fething DK?
No.

He was willing to become the Lich King. Not saying it's fair to Tirion; just saying he's all about self-sacrifice.

[Morally Grey Storm]

He was willing to become the Lich King. Not saying it's fair to Tirion; just saying he's all about self-sacrifice.

There might be slight difference between willing to contain world threat by condemning oneself to an eternity of anguish and suffering compared to being forcibly raised from well deserved rest and peace.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

There might be slight difference between willing to contain world threat by condemning oneself to an eternity of anguish and suffering compared to being forcibly raised from well deserved rest and peace.

There might be. I play both a DK and a Paladin. Tirion is an even bigger hero to my DK since he was my main during WoLK. If not for Tirion, all DKs would still serve Arthas! I won't know how I really feel about Tirion becoming a DK until I see how it's handled. Is he given a choice in the matter? How does he react?

I suspect that Darion has consummate respect for Tirion as well; the two of them have quite the history together. I'm hoping that it's more a case of hero-worship, with Darion feeling "Only Tirion can save us" rather than looking at Tirion as just another resource to be exploited.

[Teleros]

I respect Tirion more than any other NPC in the game. That said, I distinctly remember when he was ready to don the helm of the Lich King because someone had to do it and Tirion was always prepared to make that sacrifice. As much as he deserves to rest in peace, he'd be the first to stand for duty if it meant protecting Azeroth from the Legion.

Tirion was choosing of his own free will to don the helm.

I won't know how I really feel about Tirion becoming a DK until I see how it's handled. Is he given a choice in the matter? How does he react?

Check out the other Four Horsemen and their reactions...

*Player resurrects Nazrgrim*
Thassarian: Nazgrim, your Deathlord calls! Feel the icy grip of your master and rise once more!
Nazgrim: I live again... how long has it been since I last tasted death?
Thassarian: Long enough, my friend. The Burning Legion has returned and you have been called to the battle.
Nazgrim: Say no more. I will sever their heads from their bodies...
Thassarian: Indeed you shall, general. Indeed you shall...

*Player resurrects Thoras Trollbane*
Thoras: My son. Where is Galen? Where is the prince who murdered his king?
Thassarian: We took his life, my lord. The prince left us little choice.
Thoras: What has become of Stromgarde?
Thassarian: Death and ruin. Time has not been kind to this place.
Thoras: Then I have failed as both a father and a king.
Thassarian: Stromgarde is lost, but there is still hope for this world... if you will join us.
Thoras: I will do whatever it takes to preserve peace on Azeroth.

*Player resurrects Sally Whitemane*
Thassarian: Rise up, High Inquisitor! Your Deathlord calls you back to this world!
Sally: I... I live? Is the anguish of death over?
Thassarian: We have not come to offer peace, High Inquisitor.
Sally: Why then? Why have you done this to me?
Thassarian: The Day of Reckoning is at hand. The Burning Legion has come to destroy our world. The Knights of the Ebon Blade have come to offer you a chance at atonement.
Sally: Atonement? I doubt that such a thing exists for me..
Thassarian: Join us, and we will find out together.
Sally: Indeed we shall.

Based on that, I don't hold out much hope for the dialogue with Tirion.

= + =

Now factor in this bit from the DK starting experience, the quest "The Endless Hunger":

(PS, it applies to freed DKs too: http://wow.gamepedia.com/Ask_CDev#As...wers_-_Round_2 )

The endless hunger will soon take hold of you, <class>. When it does, you will feel pain immeasurable. There is only one remedy for the suffering: the hunger must be sated.

I give you the key to your salvation.

Chained to the Heart of Acherus are those deemed unworthy of the dark brotherhood. Use the key to free an unworthy initiate. Allow them to equip their gear and battle you for their freedom. Kill and the pain will cease. Fail and suffer for eternity.

Live or die - the choice is yours to make.

Are blood elf death knights still afflicted by their racial addiction to magic?
No, though their new addiction, the one all Ebon Blade death knights possess, is arguably worse: the need to inflict pain. If death knights do not regularly inflict agony upon another creature, they begin to suffer wracking pains that could drive them into a mindless, blood-seeking hysteria—a far worse fate than that of those who suffer from arcane withdrawal.

So this is what the fate is for Nazgrim, Sally Whitemane*, Thoras Trollbane and Tirion. Nice.
*Maybe it's not too bad a fate for the High Inquisitor of the Scarlet Crusade though :P . "Hmm, I need to inflict pain on someone... must be a day ending in a 'y'..."

= + =

And as a bonus, from Warcraft Chronicles Vol 1:

The forces of Life and Death hold sway over every living thing in the physical universe. The energies of Life, known commonly as nature magic, promote growth and renewal in all things. Death, in the form of necromantic magic, acts as a counterbalance to Life. It is an unavoidable force that breeds despair in mortal hearts and pushes everything toward a state of entropic decay and eventual oblivion.

...

The undead are former mortals who have died and become trapped between life and death. These tragic beings derive their power from the necromantic energies that pervade the universe. Most undead are driven by vengeance and hatred to destroy the one thing that they can never have again: life.

Boy, sure is a good good thing Sylvanus is Warchief and that Tirion gets to become the abomination he always fought against, right :P ? Also, further proof (as if any were needed) that being zombified does Very Bad Things (TM) to your personality.