No more stat squish in the future? New biggest number 9 quadrillion+

[TwilightAss]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20743924233#11

Seems like new biggest number that WoW can hold is 9 quadrillion +

I wonder if they'll decide for another stat squish in the future to keep numbers low or go with it like diablo style once we reach a point where every ability and autoattack does milions so we'll see things like 34 000 M etc.

I guess if they decide for no stat squish they can please both sides that are for and against it by adding M, B , T etc letters to the numbers or add option for that like in Diablo.

People think that bigger numbers means more load for their computers and WoW servers. But in reality computers don't give a fuck, cause for them numbers are not 103 and 2356793, they are all 0000000000000001100111 and 1000111111011000111001.

[nekobaka]

Is there a reason why they inflate the numbers so much... like you go from ~30k health to 160k from 90 to 100 just by questing.

Perception of character power increase has been discussed by the devs needing an exponential increase. Adding to this is the large ilvl gaps between each tier due to all the difficulties with once again needing to keep perceivable power increases between the difficulty as one gears up.

[FelPlague]

When did I say I viewed the forums so poorly? I'm referring to Redditors

to be fair almost every forum website out there is filled with random negativity and complete ignoring/over exaggerating of things

only safe places really is a few streamers twitch chats

nobbel and finalbosstv are the two i watch as the rest have just become cesspools of "garrison 2.0 is the death of wow"

but idk, i am fine with numbers going up high, as long as we have the option to do what we do in diablo

full number 1,111,111
Thousend 1,111K
Million 1.11M

(and later billion) 0.001B

so on so forth so idk, im fine with it

[Socialhealer]

Thousand 111K
Million 1.11M

is how you should be reading it anyway the other digits are not important, keep it to this, and everyone should be able to realise how hard spells are hitting.

[Kagthul]

I was thinking it'd be the maximum 64 bit integer but that's ~9.2 quintillion. Still don't think it's a joke, they probably don't want to have to do a stat squish every 2 expansions.

Then they should stop being absolutely mentally handicapped when it comes to gear inflation, and throw out exponential stat gain.

to start.

[FelPlague]

is how you should be reading it anyway the other digits are not important, keep it to this, and everyone should be able to realise how hard spells are hitting.

exactly, just idk if in game it allows you to shorten it to that ( i use a addon that auto does it)

[Gilgemesh]

The biggest problem with stat squishing is that it doesn't apply to the entire game in one go. It has to be applied in each individual area. Mobs, bosses, players, items. That wastes development time I'd rather be spent elsewhere.
I don't particularly have a problem with large numbers, so long as they aren't so long that a small amount of them fills a large majority of the screen. A diablo 3 type solution would work very well for me. I'd also like to see them put an additive AOE counter in stead of showing individual numbers...perhaps just showing one line. ie: 55 hits 4885k(holy)...but that would waste development time.

[Al Gorefiend]

The biggest problem with stat squishing is that it doesn't apply to the entire game in one go. It has to be applied in each individual area. Mobs, bosses, players, items. That wastes development time I'd rather be spent elsewhere.
I don't particularly have a problem with large numbers, so long as they aren't so long that a small amount of them fills a large majority of the screen. A diablo 3 type solution would work very well for me. I'd also like to see them put an additive AOE counter in stead of showing individual numbers...perhaps just showing one line. ie: 55 hits 4885k(holy)...but that would waste development time.

I don't get why Blizzard feels the need to curve item levels and stat budgets on items to such a massive hike each expansion.

[Gilgemesh]

I don't get why Blizzard feels the need to curve item levels and stat budgets on items to such a massive hike each expansion.

I think the problem is systemic. Since they've used the ability to scale gear according to level, I'm guessing they have to maintain a certain order of magnitude to maintain a feel of power, especially against lower level content. If a level 90 item gave 100 strength and a level 110 item gave 180 strength, it doesn't leave a ton of room for level 100 items. And the higher the level cap goes, the less and less stats that can go on low level items. This means items up to level 40(speculation) would look very much the same as level 10 items, stat wise. This power creep has been the biggest problem to nearly every multi-expansion game.

With that said, there are other ways to milk stats. You can still have a massive buff against lower level mobs. You can also make players have scaling stat bonuses. So say each item gives a +1 increase to main stats and 1.2 increase to stamina every 3 item levels, this still puts level 100 and 110 items in close proximity to each other, so the player gets a +x% stat scaling from stats based on player level. The power creep is still there. It is just less pronounced. They would have to be very careful to make players not want to keep and use gear from previous expansions. Some sort of "for each level above an item your stat scaling on that item is reduced by 20%"

And I'm afraid even changes like that would present a terrible technical and developmental hurdle. I can't be sure, I'm not a programmer.

[SL1200]

Squish was the worst thing they ever did to wow. I still can't believe so many of you wanted it and want to be squished again.

[Schlosh]

I still don't get the fuss over the numbers, at the end of the day, no matter which way you look at it, it's all relative. Abilities hit for a % of the target's health, abilities like execute are used at a %, not a specific number. I know which abilities do the most damage. If I see one ability hit for 900k damage, and another ability hit for 899k damage. I still know which one did more damage. It's not that hard to read. Go solo Lich King, it's not hard to read the numbers coming off him when you hit him with an ability.

[Leyre]

we need bigger ilvls otherwise gear from past expas can still be reasonably good

[Deleted]

Then they need to get their heads out of their asses, do one massive squish that brings every bit of content down to a reasonable level, then, going forward, do away with the hyper inflation and find some other metric of difficulty beyond, "You need ilvl x to complete this content."

Hell, the fact they can't figure out that their highest end raid level, in this case mythic, should be the metric of their inflation boggles my mind. To prevent the hyper inflation, they need to sit back, go, "Okay, we're going to have three raids and we don't want hyper inflation, so at the end of the third raid, we only want the ilvl to have gone up by 100 points. How do we make this happen?" Simple as that really. We don't need to be double or triple as strong as we were when we started an expansion. A small noticeable difference will suffice.

The inflation has gotten out of hand extremely though. Back in Vanilla the average DPS was around 700 with BiS gear. Today, it's up near 130,000 DPS. That's almost a 186 times DPS increase over the course of 50 more levels.

Aye, and in WoDs case.

Some classes have actually gone not x2 or x3 times stronger... but a mindboggling ~100x.(short durations obv)

[PrairieChicken]

Then they need to get their heads out of their asses, do one massive squish that brings every bit of content down to a reasonable level, then, going forward, do away with the hyper inflation and find some other metric of difficulty beyond, "You need ilvl x to complete this content."

Hell, the fact they can't figure out that their highest end raid level, in this case mythic, should be the metric of their inflation boggles my mind. To prevent the hyper inflation, they need to sit back, go, "Okay, we're going to have three raids and we don't want hyper inflation, so at the end of the third raid, we only want the ilvl to have gone up by 100 points. How do we make this happen?" Simple as that really. We don't need to be double or triple as strong as we were when we started an expansion. A small noticeable difference will suffice.

The inflation has gotten out of hand extremely though. Back in Vanilla the average DPS was around 700 with BiS gear. Today, it's up near 130,000 DPS. That's almost a 186 times DPS increase over the course of 50 more levels.

Well if we didn't have the squish we will be sitting in 10 million dps+

[Deleted]

Well if we didn't have the squish we will be sitting in 10 million dps+

Well, bursts in MoP, on my ret, went towards 2M+ IIRC.

Taking that into consideration, we lost quite a lot the first levle in due to scaling but eventually... our starter dps in WoD, which was maybe 15-25K-ish, turned into 60+(long duration) in BRF and HFC now at well, what? 150-200? I'm not maining ret or geared towards it but something along those lines.

Mages go 1M+ if really lucky(and good with le burst). Soo, I'd wager that if there hadn't been a squish.

200M+ on some classes?
That boss would need trillions of HP.

[spikeh]

I still don't get the fuss over the numbers, at the end of the day, no matter which way you look at it, it's all relative. Abilities hit for a % of the target's health, abilities like execute are used at a %, not a specific number. I know which abilities do the most damage. If I see one ability hit for 900k damage, and another ability hit for 899k damage. I still know which one did more damage. It's not that hard to read. Go solo Lich King, it's not hard to read the numbers coming off him when you hit him with an ability.

Yeah, everything is absolutely just % based which is actually constant over expansions. Designers think about combat durations and scale HP to meet those and not about the actual numbers. It's the players that love seeing big numbers get bigger over time, given the oft-complained about character progression being non-existent for non-raiders during WoD.

Also, the numbers during HFC are highly inflated by the legendary ring which was arguably the most moronic system Blizzard had ever introduced, so it's not entirely down to gear. The problem with the ring is the burst, in conjunction with a bug in RPPM trinkets (they are almost guaranteed to proc within the first 10s of combat), pre-pot, CDs and Bloodlust.

[Deleted]

games evolve your mind stays weak and feeble, sorry you can only handle 3-4 digits, do you struggle with your bank account or are you poor?

Not infracted

You're an idiot.

Infracted {ML}

Infracted

This is a new all time low for the mods on this site

(Not that i am suprised)

[Echo of Soul]

I currently play on the beta and the numbers are so high my mind actually just ignores them isntead of trying to keep track of what ability does what damage.

it kidna does bum me down a bit when i think about it.

It liked back in the day when i knew what my various abilities where going to hit for

Seeing your frostbolt go from 600 damage to 620 damage is with a couple of new gear pieces is easy to process. Seeing it go from 34578 damage to 35731 damage is not. Percentually the increase is exacly the same but your mind doesn't notice the change. We just have to come to terms with those days being gone, or wait for someone to develop a smart addon that normalizes floating combat text.

[coprax]

Is there a reason why they inflate the numbers so much... like you go from ~30k health to 160k from 90 to 100 just by questing.

They want you to feel the increase in power and 5 or 10% per tier does not make a noticeable impact unless you look at logs. And the bigger the numbers get the harder it becomes to feel more power with a linear increase. So they decided to use exponential scaling.

[Deleted]

So instead of solving the problem they just pushed it back a couple of expansions.

going by the dps curve of the last expansions cata: ~25k DPS, mop ~50k, WoD ~120k DPS. cata to mop was 200%, mop to wod was 240%...
Keeping it linear with 240% increase:
Legion: ~300k DPS
Making the 9.2 quintillion a 988 444 year fight for a single person.
After Legion we will be around 720k DPS so having a 411 851 year fight.
After that we will be around 1.73M DPS with a 171 604 year fight.
After that we will be around 4.15M DPS with a 71 501 year fight.

Going exponential with 1.2 times the last increase:
Legion: ~345k DPS (288% increase)
Making the 9.2 quintillion a 859 516 year fight for a single person.
After Legion we will be around 1.19M DPS (345% increase) so having a 249 187 year fight.
After that we will be around 4.93M DPS (414% increase) with a 60 148 year fight.
After that we will be around 24.45M DPS (496% increase) with a 12 128 year fight.

Yes the fight time is really really high... but the exponential growth could and most likely would be much higher. Just bumping it up to 1.3 would mean increases of 312%, 405%, 486%, 584%.
So nothing is solved it's just pushed back to a later date.