[MARKSMANSHIP]Legion Alpha Discussion

[Shynzo]

50% was so obvious to be placeholder, though I hoped for 15 or 20%

Yeah, 25% or 30% is a good number, i guess.

[kaminaris]

Big question is: do they even test this? I am getting a feeling that they take rotation and numbers of ... thin air, and they never actually check it in game. It was pretty obvious they would not leave 50% but if so, why do they even made such change?

[TOM_RUS]

why do they even made such change?

Exact same reason as all those pointless legion hunter changes.

[construkt]

We are headed to beta now, so I guess this is what we get.

I think I'm done here. The class just isn't fun anymore. Funny, too, I never minded hardcasting aimed shot like the old days. The semi mobility wasn't too threatening, but the rest of the class is an incoherent mess.

[Syld]

How is MM looking for PvP in legion? I heard someone say the spec lost all its mobility, is that true?

[Wullfgar]

Actually it's even worse now, just checked on battlenet;

Lock and Load
Passive
Attach an explosive charge to Aimed Shot, dealing strong additional Fire damage to the target and all enemies within 4 yds.
Your ranged auto attacks have a 5% chance to trigger Lock and Load, causing your next 2 Aimed Shots to cost no Focus and be instant.

[Deleted]

Actually it's even worse now, just checked on battlenet;

Lock and Load
Passive
Attach an explosive charge to Aimed Shot, dealing strong additional Fire damage to the target and all enemies within 4 yds.
Your ranged auto attacks have a 5% chance to trigger Lock and Load, causing your next 2 Aimed Shots to cost no Focus and be instant.

Check the date on that blog.. It hasn't been updated since.. gamescon?

[shade3891]

If no-one picks the talent they surely raise the % number! To make it viable again. I'm a big fan of sidewinders, they also look cool ^^

[Sencha]

Sidewinders is weird. Firing small rockets, so much for the class fantasy.

[threads]

Sidewinders is weird. Firing small rockets, so much for the class fantasy.

class fantasy never existed. it was just a trendy way of saying they're going to shit on every spec and do whatever they want.

[kaminaris]

I was having hard time yesterday with quest slay 12 demons on the starting legion quest with sidewinders.
When sidewinders arrived at target it was already dead, pretty much the same for aimed shot.
(Its not a real problem, it just makes tagging low hp bit much hard)

Imo sidewinders should
- do a lot less damage (would need to balance focus return vs dmg done so quite probably little below multishot dmg)
- should have 0 cd
- 1 stack
- travel faster

And it would be playable again, without dead windows, with pretty much the same mobility as the other talents, lot less cancerous RNG.

[Deyron]

Imo sidewinders should
- do a lot less damage (would need to balance focus return vs dmg done so quite probably little below multishot dmg)
- should have 0 cd
- 1 stack
- travel faster

Sidewinders should become Arcane Shot?

[kaminaris]

No, it would still return more focus that arcane shot, it would just deal less damage so spamming it wouldn't produce outrageous dps on AOE.
Right now on live (it still the case on legion for casters i have tested), almost every caster spec has something to do on 3-8s movement phases. Hunter RNG with sidewinders just doesn't. At least they have alternative different than just two:
AOE - stationary
ST - semi mobile

Dotters can reapply dots, cast them on other targets. Mages have ice floes and all of them has instants. There is always something to use even if dps gain would be small (or to simply minimize dps loss).

Icon of mobility, hunter, once taken sidewinders just becomes stationary balista. Trick shot (almost mandatory) is on the same tier as black arrow which COULD somehow give a light in the dark if not for a goddamn minion which taunts. Tanks will not like that.

Another option would be if sidewinders would replace JUST multi shot. Then on movement phase (repositioning, getting away from fire) you could fill your focus to start hitting again. Other talents don't have this problem but that depends on RNG. If you are lucky, you'll get combo arcane shot + marked shot continuously. But with sidewinders and sidewinders being on CD you can hit auto run and grab some snack, smoke a cig, you name it.

Also, marked shot proc should be per focus spent/gained or simply by time.
In all this mess there is too much randomness going on. Everything is chance based. Rotation does not feel fluent and it gets annoying when you just don't get this MS proc for longer time.

Last thing is that i tested hunter with L&L today and it seems that it is higher than 10%. I remember it wasn't proccing so frequently before. It's not 50% but it doesn't look like 10% either. I may be wrong though or just had a lots of luck.

[Youn]

Well, after leveling a bit in beta. If you take sidewinders while leveling be prepared to fight a lot of mobs. It has to be the most uncontrolled spec for leveling. :P

[GoKs]

So sidewinders = Barrage in that scenario...... gonna be laughing real hard when leveling and seeing another hunter pull everything in the zone again.....

[sleepingforest]

Well, after leveling a bit in beta. If you take sidewinders while leveling be prepared to fight a lot of mobs. It has to be the most uncontrolled spec for leveling. :P

It's super annoying in Eye of Azshara, those fucking seagulls come disorient you on half the boss fights.

[Youn]

Well, Sidewinders puts up vulnerability, which means your Aimed and Marked shots hit everything. At that point, you might as well barrage to pick up anything you missed. Luckily you have Exhilaration on a 2 minute CD. That way you can get half your health back from all the things hitting you. And FD for when you have simply pulled too much.

[Deleted]

It's super annoying in Eye of Azshara, those fucking seagulls come disorient you on half the boss fights.

i feel u bro

does anyone even play anything besides sidewinders?
so much dmg ermagherd....

[kaminaris]

Sidewinders is terrible for leveling, and if you want to have some aoe go trickshot, patient sniper and headshot (or L&L). That would be probably the best for destroying mobs while leveling.

Just don't use arcane shot, use multi shot, it also applies hunter mark. If it procs (marked shot) you'll destroy mobs before they realize who hit them, if it doesn't, time for barrage and/or headshot.

I have some super shit gear on newly created hunter, doing some normal dungeons from time to time and on large pack of mobs 5+ dps varies from the best (~160k while no one else comes close) to the worst (like 90k if i have bad luck).

It has this advantage over SW in leveling that it is usually proccing at the beginning so you will need just ~2 more procs to kill pack while being almost perfectly mobile. From what i have seen multi shot is better even with two mobs (4vs5 focus BUT it applies hunter mark). And marked shot is above aimed shot (with trick shot talent) because MS deals full damage to all marked targets not just 100% + 30% to the rest. You will basically be using aimed shots only when you are out of options.

[Deleted]

Hey all,

I'm not in beta but I've been thinking and would like to hear your thoughts.
With blizzard pushing lone wolf and purely adding it back because some people want pet back,
It effectively removes our tier 1 talents. What I would suggest instead is to opt IN,
to pet not out of it. (Lone wolf baseline with MM).

New talent could be "Renounce Ruthlessness"
You and your pet deal x% more dmg replaces lone wolf.

Balanced around being dps neutral with lone wolf (ST) without other T1 talents
The name also implies it's not the best choice.
This way there's 2 options for the 90% right choice rather than 1

Also I would replace the stacking dmg talent (not steady focus) with something
Along the lines of our current tier set

"Quick shot", for 2s after casting marked shot, aimed shots cast time is reduced by 0.5s

Having choices at T1 slightly increases the gameplay of MM hunters which some have complained about
Aswell as synergising with other talents.

This doesn't address other MM issues, but the one that annoys me the most
I realise this is typed in a haste but I would like to hear your thoughts =]