Can I cry now? *Spoilers*

[Zandalarian Paladin]

Compared to Xe'ra he would be considered a boy

To us RL humans he's ancient, but to someone that's been around since almost the begining of the universe it's young

This, exactly. Illidan is nothing compared to a Naaru longevity. Even the fact that he's called a boy - and not a baby - is something in itself.

Honestly, I love this arc. The fact that the naaru, in the book, is against Illidan initially - but also the fact that everyone believes he's everything that's wrong in that world.

I'm really happy with how this turns out to be.

[Wildmoon]

This, exactly. Illidan is nothing compared to a Naaru longevity. Even the fact that he's called a boy - and not a baby - is something in itself.

Honestly, I love this arc. The fact that the naaru, in the book, is against Illidan initially - but also the fact that everyone believes he's everything that's wrong in that world.

I'm really happy with how this turns out to be.

ํYou must like Thrall and Med'an too.

[Nurvus]

Because that will be a shitty Story that insults the intelligence of every player. And why Illidan is called a boy? That all sounds like a cheap Harry Potter Rip-Off. Illidan is a fucking 10.000 years old adult man.

It's a boy to the Naaru. Try again.

[dd614]

Awful story-telling. A fanfiction.net writer could do a better job. Blizzard can't stop Mary Sueing their franchise to death.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

ํYou must like Thrall and Med'an too.

No, I actually dislike them. I do love Jaina and Anduin, however.

EDIT: Oh, and Tirion, Saurfang, Nazgrim, Muradin, Cairne/Baine, Medh'iv, Khadgar, Velen, Kael'Thas and a bunch of other I forgot about. I dislike Vol'jin, Sylvanas, Lor'themar Theron, Tyrande, Malfurion, Thrall, Med'an and a bunch of others.

[Wildmoon]

No, I actually dislike them. I do love Jaina and Anduin, however.

EDIT: Oh, and Tirion, Saurfang, Nazgrim, Muradin, Cairne/Baine, Medh'iv, Khadgar, Velen.

ิีbut they are the chosen ones too.

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Awful story-telling. A fanfiction.net writer could do a better job. Blizzard can't stop Mary Sueing their franchise to death.

How to make a protagonist? Make him the chosen one. Why it must be this guy? Well, he is chosen. That's Blizzard's writing for Med'an,Thrall and Illidan. I am almost glad that Anduin may have escaped this fate.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

ิีbut they are the chosen ones too.

No, they're not. I like characters that have some depth. I've read the book. Illidan has depth. Jaina has depth. Med'an? Rhonin? They're extremely shallow. Thrall has some depth, but I can't help but picture Metzen every time I see him.

[Verdugo]

No, they're not. I like characters that have some depth. I've read the book. Illidan has depth. Jaina has depth. Med'an? Rhonin? They're extremely shallow. Thrall has some depth, but I can't help but picture Metzen every time I see him.

You have no idea what depth is if you think Jaina has some.

[Melsiren]

Uhm... No. We killed him, Arthas defeated him. He was not overpowered, at least not as much as he should.

Some one being able to be killed does not exempt them from being overpowered.

It's also been stated by two books now that Illidan vastly overpowered Arthas, but Illidans hubris was his own downfall.

Seriously? Illidan was one of the best heroes who sacrificies himself for his own people, now they're going to make him another Mary Sue? It was good character because it wasn't overpowered/special snowflake like Thrall or Med'an.

The guy had his eyes burned out by -Sargeras-.

Heck it's speculated that he defeated Azzinoth before he became a demon hunter, a powerful doomgaurd commander of the Burning Legion.
That's on top of a mountain of feats that makes lore characters pale in comparison.

How is he not a special snowflake? Majority of the main story characters are special snowflakes, and there's nothing wrong with that they push the story forward.

[Vynestra]

No you can't cry because we knew this army of light thing for a long time now, this was obviously in motion for a -long- time.

As soon as they asked about an illidan redemption arc, the gears turned in metzens head right away I guarantee, I would not be surprised if it was discussed shortly after what to do with illidan in the future.

We should have saw this coming better. We knew illidan was coming back and was going to get redeemed, we knew the army of the light was a thing.

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Predictable, Illidan is the protagonist of the game until the void is defeated

I fixed that for you.

[Donald Hellscream]

it is a very touching moment, you may cry.

[hydrium]

So Illidan is Kerrigan, destined to save the universe?

I've said it once and I'll say it again.

Metzen has no business being anywhere near a pen when a story requires anything more than a blurb on a loading screen.

I'm so tired of the saga of Green Jesus and now Illidan is Kerrigan wrapped in a Warcraft bow.

There are so many "chosen ones" in Warcraft that the title may as well be given to anyone picked by throwing a dart at a dart board.

[steelballfc]

Xe'ra's Core communicates with player and is asking for Illidan.
Because Illidan's fate is to destroy Argus by using the Prime Naaru's core as a Light Bomb and destroy Argus, demons' leaders and the Sargeras inside him (Illidan).
Last patch events in the last raid.

"watching Argus Destroyed"
and then we wait for Sargeras to send his son into space shuttle and send his son to Azeroth

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And you named them in relation to some of the big villians in the Warcraft universe and stated as a fact that they all held more of these values than Illidan Stormrage. I still call bullshit, because in every step of the way, from W3, through BC through the book it is demonstrably false.



So has the player character. Worse, we'll go from continent to continent, world, to world, foe to foe, none too large or small or petty. We do it for coppers. We've been easily fooled to slaughter dozens and happily smiled as we burn forests and slaughter wildlife. We're bloodthirsty little bastards and we have been for years.

We're far worse than Illidan yet we're being worshipped in-game as well.

"cries"
i didn't know that there is so much blood in my hand
my sins can't be forgiven
i must chose Death
"commit suicide"

[Qualia]

I've said it once and I'll say it again.

Metzen has no business being anywhere near a pen when a story requires anything more than a blurb on a loading screen.

I'm so tired of the saga of Green Jesus and now Illidan is Kerrigan wrapped in a Warcraft bow.

There are so many "chosen ones" in Warcraft that the title may as well be given to anyone picked by throwing a dart at a dart board.

If using "the chosen one" trope for one or many characters means the writer(s) is terrible and "has no business being anywhere near a pen when a story requires anything more than a blurb on a loading screen" then likely 75% (before someone pick at the number, that's just an arbitrary percentage obviously) of fantasy writers, and much higher percentage of fantasy *game* writers should quit their jobs. Damn those incompetent writers!

(I just find it funny that for some, the entire argument can be summarized as "I hate this trope; It has been used by so many things so any plot using it suck automatically for me; Since I personally hate that, the writer is terrible with skill of a 10yo kid". Sure, that's your respectable opinion, but it doesn't make a good discussion when we just talk about I-hate-this, you-hate-that, instead of pointing out what was the relatively-objective flaws)

Edit: oh, and for the record, I'm neutral about this plot - I'm happy that Illidan seems to be getting his happy ending, but in general I'm neither interested nor hate it. I just don't get reasoning behind the obvious hatred from some of us.

[Deleted]

If using "the chosen one" trope for one or many characters means the writer(s) is terrible and "has no business being anywhere near a pen when a story requires anything more than a blurb on a loading screen" then likely 75% (before someone pick at the number, that's just an arbitrary percentage obviously) of fantasy writers, and much higher percentage of fantasy *game* writers should quit their jobs. Damn those incompetent writers!

(I just find it funny that for some, the entire argument can be summarized as "I hate this trope; It has been used by so many things so any plot using it suck automatically for me; Since I personally hate that, the writer is terrible with skill of a 10yo kid". Sure, that's your respectable opinion, but it doesn't make a good discussion when we just talk about I-hate-this, you-hate-that, instead of pointing out what was the relatively-objective flaws)

Edit: oh, and for the record, I'm neutral about this plot - I'm happy that Illidan seems to be getting his happy ending, but in general I'm neither interested nor hate it. I just don't get reasoning behind the obvious hatred from some of us.

Being the chosen one can work, if the story is written well. But I am trying to think of a recent game that I played that had a "chosen one" story...

Dragon Age Inquisition, but the plot device made you it but you could deny it at every point in the story... so since we have player agency to play it down, it works.

Otherwise none of the games or movies I watched in the last 5 years really come to mind.

[Wildmoon]

If using "the chosen one" trope for one or many characters means the writer(s) is terrible and "has no business being anywhere near a pen when a story requires anything more than a blurb on a loading screen" then likely 75% (before someone pick at the number, that's just an arbitrary percentage obviously) of fantasy writers, and much higher percentage of fantasy *game* writers should quit their jobs. Damn those incompetent writers!

(I just find it funny that for some, the entire argument can be summarized as "I hate this trope; It has been used by so many things so any plot using it suck automatically for me; Since I personally hate that, the writer is terrible with skill of a 10yo kid". Sure, that's your respectable opinion, but it doesn't make a good discussion when we just talk about I-hate-this, you-hate-that, instead of pointing out what was the relatively-objective flaws)

Edit: oh, and for the record, I'm neutral about this plot - I'm happy that Illidan seems to be getting his happy ending, but in general I'm neither interested nor hate it. I just don't get reasoning behind the obvious hatred from some of us.

There's no objective flaw because we are discussing subjective thing. There's a point when the trope is so overused that it has become so predictable that it makes you cringe. The chosen one trope usually sucks because it makes for an unbelieveable story. Why the hell in this vast universe that certain someone is chosen? What condition make him the chosen one? What if there are other people with those conditions? and after all said and done who chose him the first place? Not to mention by being the chosen one you are chosen by something which means your actions are irrelevant because you are destined to walk down a certain path. Story work far better when heroes are forged by actions and circumstances.

We have had Med'an then Go'el and now we will have Illid'an. Anduin should be glad that his role is taken, so that he won't become a joke of a character for people to ridicule like what happened with Med'an and Thrall. Illidan used to be a character I like.

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Being the chosen one can work, if the story is written well. But I am trying to think of a recent game that I played that had a "chosen one" story...

Dragon Age Inquisition, but the plot device made you it but you could deny it at every point in the story... so since we have player agency to play it down, it works.

Otherwise none of the games or movies I watched in the last 5 years really come to mind.

Blizzard has never done the chosen one trope well. They always have some sort of prophecies that foretell the chosen ones and that's it. They don't explain the condition or anything. DA:I's main protagonist is a hero that happened to have that power because of certain event not because it was destined or fortold by some prophecy that it must happen.

Basically, Blizzard needs an excuse why it must be Illidan thus the chosen one. They simply don't realize that they don't need to make it so that it MUST be Illidan to make Illidan the main character. It can work in the way that it's Illidan who take the charge because of his specialty on the legion and through actions and circumstances he become the hero.

[Jester Joe]

DA:I's main protagonist is a hero that happened to have that power because of certain event not because it was destined or fortold by some prophecy that it must happen.

Literally by pure accident even.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

You have no idea what depth is if you think Jaina has some.

Biased much? Child of one of the greatest Alliance general. Sacrifice her life to study magic and protect Theramore, first character to make uneasy pacts with the horde to work toward peace. Has been a major player in several events in the game, not the least being the destruction of Yogg and the hunt for the Lich King. Then came garrosh, mass-murdering everyone she ever loved - and learning at the same time she's been betrayed by renegades in her own council AND being abandonned by her best friend, Thrall, who basically created this whole shitstorm by acting like Jesus. Since then, she has been working restlessly to break the new Horde, almost anihilating Orgrimmar, throwing the sunreavers out of Dalaran, coming back to the front in Thunder Isles and finally being a key player in Garrosh's "demise".

She is all but shallow.

[Qualia]

There's no objective flaw because we are discussing subjective thing. There's a point when the trope is so overused that it has become so predictable that it makes you cringe. The chosen one trope usually sucks because it makes for an unbelieveable story. Why the hell in this vast universe that certain someone is chosen? What condition make him the chosen one? What if there are other people with those conditions? and after all said and done who chose him the first place? Not to mention by being the chosen one you are chosen by something which means your actions are irrelevant because you are destined to walk down a certain path. Story work far better when heroes are forged by actions and circumstances.

I disagree with this. There are flaws that we can point out from bad plots - for example: the inconsistency, or out of character action without any possible explanation, deus-ex-machina, etc. There are more if it's a literature piece, but since it's a game (MMO even), I'd give it a bit more leeway since many things can't be presented visually in game as nicely as they can by words. I know that each of us have his / her own taste, thus I didn't bother with the hate posts so far. Yet, I believe it was a bit too far to claim that certain Blizzard writers (whoever responsible for this plot) to be incompetent, having 10 years old skill, or should quit writing altogether without pointing out any flaw other than "duh, I hate this" or going further and claim that anyone who didn't hate this must have terrible taste as well (not yours, though, but there were a few posts until the one I quoted).

Now that aside, back to the chosen one theme in this plotline. I said the same thing back in the "Illidan" book thread - just keep in mind that this is just the beginning of this certain plotline. I'd understand the complaints about it going out of nowhere if we are at the end, but we aren't anywhere close to it yet. We have at least two years for Blizzard to develop this (likely more since I doubt they are having us killing the Void Lords and Sargeras next expansion). To me, it's pretty much just an introduction in the line of "Okay, you are going to enter a plot revolving around Illidan being redeemed and turned into a champion of the Light in the end". Is there any need to explain why Illidan - or certain main characters of any plot - is the main character? Do we often get an explanation of why the main characters being main characters, or we just understand that they are, then continue and see how their stories go?

Consider this - if we don't get this vision of Xe'ra but the rest of the plot remains the same (however it is going to unfold, I can't say yet), would it still be any better or worse? If not, then why is being spoiled of the ending by a vision bad? From my take, it's not like Illidan is going to do whatever he is going to do because he is chosen as a hero, but the other way around - the Xe'ra's prophecy happened because Illidan was supposed to do all that by fate since the beginning. I'm pretty sure Illidan isn't going to poof, turn into a hero out of nowhere, but instead going through proper "actions and circumstances" (or I'd like to believe anyway, seeing Blizzard supposedly planned for the end of Legion / the fight with enemies from the Void years ago).

[Deleted]

Who let Knaak taking control of Legion's story?

To be fair, it's not even a problem of "ok, lets redeem Illidan by becoming a champion of Light", it's a cringy that dialogue is. Illidan was already a "meh" powerhungry anti-hero with savior complex, so he getting new powers is right into his character. But Xe'ra's dialogue...