Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Thimagryn]

(1) In a poll on MMO-C, people would pay for the service. Discounting those who want to play for free, it's a tie between those who will pay and those who will not pay or not play. SRC: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...Vanilla-server

(2) Players time will undoubtedly be a factor. But many of the (futuristic) Legacy sub's are those who were not going to subscribe anyways. Confusion is fixed by identifying each server as Legacy, as appropriate, with a tool tip, during server selection. Blizzard eating their own words is a problem though. They likely already realize it now, but would be hesitant to admit their "error".

(3) Fans were not petitioning for Warcraft Adventures, Starcraft Ghost, or Titan. There was interest, but not on the level Blizzard is seeing with regard to Legacy.

ps - the other paragraph left untouched. A WoW movie was made already to fan request. Whether it is acceptable requires time, but doesn't look great currently, IMO.

1) Doesn't matter what you want to tell me. I'm not Blizzard, and I'm not the one who will be deciding whether MMO-C polls will be a good gauge for financial security or not. But if I were Blizzard? Polls don't matter. They aren't guarantees.

2) Blizzard is not as interested in subs as much as other methods of income (Tokens, services, microtransactions, boosts). If subs were really all they want, I'm pretty sure there would be a heavier focus on providing more content in each expansion rather than leaving year-long deadzones while working on new expansions instead. Despite all sub loss each quarter, they're able to sustain themselves financially. This is well known public information through their investors earnings.

3) Petitions don't work. The most we're getting out of this right now are talks that will potentially move things forward. Again, they guarantee nothing, because many of the points brought up have not been discussed at all by the ones representing the meetings. Perhaps it's not the right time to have any of those discussions pre-meeting, I wouldn't know. All I know is Legacy is going to be decided at a corporate level. The devs have little control over making these kind of executive decisions.

[Jibjub]

Why more than now?

Keep in mind there are 6.2.3 private servers. I played WoTLK ones during WoTLKs life time, I played cata ones during that expansion, TBC and vanilla during their respective life spans too. I can't imagine how utterly boring a 6.2.3 private server is, but trust me, they exist.

Because you could argue that people playing in most private servers wouldn't be playing live anyways -- especially legacy servers with much larger numbers playing them. If they had legacy servers, they'd be more motivated to funnel people into the official ones for the $$$

[Deleted]

I don't feel like going through 1345 pages, so....

Has anything actually come of this? Last I heard they had a date for the meeting, but that seems like it was a while ago.

[Vineri]

So your proof is polls that were made a month or so ago when this thing started to impact the forums. Not really a strong section of the players and their opinions. Then again many of the polls on MMO-Champ are skewed due to the types of players that play the game and vote on these polls. For example some of them ask where you are in progression and the surveys are skewed more towards mythic when we know the actual % of people in them is quite low. Just don't put much stock in polls on this site imo.

Also looking at your poll only 32.34% of the people would even pay 12.99 a month for it. 57~% of the people who answered wouldn't play it all even it were free. I mean this is when most of the new accounts that came along voted favorably for Legacy things and it still had that pisspoor of a favorable vote.

It's rather bizarre, since many MMO-C polls skew towards current fans, as the majority of visitors. Or at least those active in WoW. When a poll deviates from mainstream WoW, it's worth mentioning.

Actually, 43% would not play even if free. Another 43% Would pay to play. The remainder wish to play for free (which I even discounted in my post, not sure why you brought it up). It's why I mentioned it was a tie.

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I don't feel like going through 1345 pages, so....

Has anything actually come of this? Last I heard they had a date for the meeting, but that seems like it was a while ago.

Mr. Kern says June, next month he is meeting with Blizzard to discuss Nostalrius.

[Eliseus]

(1) In a poll on MMO-C, people would pay for the service. Discounting those who want to play for free, it's a tie between those who will pay and those who will not pay or not play. SRC: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...Vanilla-server

(2) Players time will undoubtedly be a factor. But many of the (futuristic) Legacy sub's are those who were not going to subscribe anyways. Confusion is fixed by identifying each server as Legacy, as appropriate, with a tool tip, during server selection. Blizzard eating their own words is a problem though. They likely already realize it now, but would be hesitant to admit their "error".

(3) Fans were not petitioning for Warcraft Adventures, Starcraft Ghost, or Titan. There was interest, but not on the level Blizzard is seeing with regard to Legacy.

ps - the other paragraph left untouched. A WoW movie was made already to fan request. Whether it is acceptable requires time, but doesn't look great currently, IMO.

Funny enough the poll you linked has already been attacked by the same person who tried to use a poll of 200 people wanting something before WoD as validation towards failure. People won't listen. Yet they will keep claiming their opinion as fact while bowing down to the Blizzard Gods that they don't make mistakes and have someone higher up that's knows more than what the players want. #youthinkyoudobutyoudont.

[Relapses]

Funny enough the poll you linked has already been attacked by the same person who tried to use a poll of 200 people wanting something before WoD as validation towards failure. People won't listen. Yet they will keep claiming their opinion as fact while bowing down to the Blizzard Gods that they don't make mistakes and have someone higher up that's knows more than what the players want. #youthinkyoudobutyoudont.

I hope you realize how much of a caricature for the pro-Legacy movement you've become.

[Jeniwyn]

Why more than now? (Hunt vanilla private servers)

Keep in mind there are 6.2.3 private servers. I played WoTLK ones during WoTLKs life time, I played cata ones during that expansion, TBC and vanilla during their respective life spans too. I can't imagine how utterly boring a 6.2.3 private server is, but trust me, they exist.

Contemporary servers are normally total crap. The last resort of a person with no money at all or no clue at all. They are no real competition.

This is not the case with for example Nostalrius. It was basically the same thing as playing vanilla retail. Servers like that would be seen as a real alternative for the cheapskates among us, not just the truly desperate. Further, and most important these servers would, unlike private servers that crop up for the current expansion, have existed before the official servers arrived at the scene. Thus players who can pay might still be tempted to stay instead. Keep all their lvl 60 chars with gear rather than leaving, starting over and paying $15.

When they shut down Nostalrius, I doubt that they got very many players resubbing to WoD. Most us dont like WoD all that much, as you have probably heard so much that you are sick of it. But we like vanilla, so shutting down a vanilla server is likely to win Blizzard the vast majority of inhabitants as new subscribers. That is a good incentive.

So I'm basically sitting here asking Blizzard to please delete my beloved char, force me to start over and start charging me $15/month. Please!

[Cæli]

The more I read about that, the more I'm convinced that Blizzard want 100% of the things to happen on Live.
Pristine for a starter with it being the live game with restricting rules and they could easily make a vanilla, bc, cata, wotlk limited realm with a few rules;
Then re implementing the old world as an alternative on Live to make nostalgic players interested in the game, new players having more content, and making current players happy, which would build a way to the vanilla type of pristine server.

But while I don't want to discourage anyone, I think that they will never do Legacy, that Legacy is condemned to remain unofficial, and the only moment it will stop being shut down is the day Blizzard stops updating the game, a day where even players might be capable of hosting their own realms officially kind of like a lot of online games today.

Though I expect the store to remain forever where players connects to the store servers with like unhackable keys to prevent anyone to generate those rewards without $$$.

[Deleted]

The technical hurdles were already solved in the case of Nostalrius.

ROFL

Bugs even fixed.

yeah right cause Nost team had access to the SOURCE code..... do I really have to say "9 day deserter buff bug"

Additional anti-cheat code implemented that Blizzard drools over.

SOURCE for your CLAIM? ah right just as I thought....

The last one surviving, because Mr. Kern had the balls to stand up and defend what he believes in, and had the resources to stand up for his investments.

ROFLMAO because he was voicing his legacy support all the last 120 years, right? right? ....

People would pay for a legit server, not for a private server or WoD.

Which was not the point but the LIE that noone was losing MONEY because of NOST....

[snackfeat]

I don't feel like going through 1345 pages, so....

Has anything actually come of this? Last I heard they had a date for the meeting, but that seems like it was a while ago.

Mark kern have a meeting this thursday, and nostalrius is meeting with them in either june or july don't remember which.

[Vineri]

< SNIP >

Why bother yourself in this. The claims were already substantiated before. Stick to a topic you know about.

Technical issues solved. Confirmed, a good recreation of the original Vanilla game, multiple servers, etc.
Bugs Fixed. Confirmed. Patches, patches, patches.
Anti-Cheat++. Confirmed (even acknowledged by Blizzard).
Mr. Kern standing up. Confirmed, unless you are blind.

etc, etc, etc.

[Gadzooks]

I hope you realize how much of a caricature for the pro-Legacy movement you've become.

Careful, he might call you a bully.

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I don't feel like going through 1345 pages, so....

Has anything actually come of this? Last I heard they had a date for the meeting, but that seems like it was a while ago.

What is it you expect to come from them? Real question. What do you think the outcome will be?

Blizzard doesnt need technical information from them.

Mark Kern has no experience running a legacy server, or an illegal one, and hasn't touched code in years. I'm not even sure he codes.

Blizzard doesn't need their population numbers. They don't "prove" anything.

Blizzard has everything they need to make a decision over legacy servers. The Nost team can't possibly have the kind of financial backing to pay for the cost of legacy servers, like if the company that runs Blizzard Asia got a wild hair up their ass and decided to pay for it.

What is it that you think is going to happen at these meetings?

Here's what I think will happen: Mark Kern will talk about the old days, and probably try to get money from Blizzard for the new game he's developing. The Nost guys will have a nice chat, get a free Legion t-shirt and get 15 minutes with real devs to talk about how hard games are to run. And Blizzard might get a DVD of Nost's anti-cheat code.

That's it.

Please. Someone enlighten me what's supposed to happen at these meetings. I'm dying to know.

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ROFL
yeah right cause Nost team had access to the SOURCE code..... do I really have to say "9 day deserter buff bug"
SOURCE for your CLAIM? ah right just as I thought....

ROFLMAO because he was voicing his legacy support all the last 120 years, right? right? ....

Which was not the point but the LIE that noone was losing MONEY because of NOST....

It's adorable, isn't it? They actually believe that if they post it, it's true.

[Vineri]

< SNIP >

Best to ignore this person quotted, since he / she speaks without forms of counter discussion in mind (ref history). Points mentioned were already discussed, but he / she like to keep bringing moot points up as if they were suddenly "new".

He / she is trying to get responders to get worked up and get in trouble. Don't fall for these hogwash comments mixed with laden insults.

Gadzooks, comments made by you are nonsensical and without merit. Most parts are silly, but even the parts that are supposed to be seen as objective fall flat. Re-read your rantings before hitting "post". A T-shirt, really? Who can take you seriously?

[Gadzooks]

Best to ignore this person quotted, since he / she speaks without forms of counter discussion in mind (ref history). Points mentioned were already discussed, but he / she like to keep bringing moot points up as if they were suddenly "new".

He / she is trying to get responders to get worked up and get in trouble. Don't fall for these hogwash comments mixed with laden insults.

Gadzooks, comments made by you are nonsensical and without merit. Most parts are silly, but even the parts that are supposed to be seen as objective fall flat. Re-read your rantings before hitting "post". A T-shirt, really? Who can take you seriously?

I wasn't talking to you, I only expect nonsense like you just posted from you - ie. nothing of substance.

[Eliseus]

I hope you realize how much of a caricature for the pro-Legacy movement you've become.

I hope you realize how wrong you are in every statement you ever make. Some of your initials posts were already calling people toxic that disagreed with you. Not surprised you still hold onto similar views.

PS, way to not refute anything some more and still try and call out people.

[Deleted]

What is it you expect to come from them? Real question. What do you think the outcome will be?

TL;DR. IDGAF what you think, and I don't expect any outcome either way - which is why I'm asking if anything is still happening. I have 4 posts in this entire thread (coincidentally, you have several hundred despite assuming nothing at all will happen at the end...). This shit is on the periphery for me.

Maybe chill that rage boner, bro. It's not good for your blood pressure to get this mad about a game made by a company you don't work for.

[hulkgor]

Weeks pass by, yet the anti-legacy realm crowd still stomps around this thread, insulting and trying to belittle the rest.

Good times.

At this point i just want a legacy-realm to exist so you dudes actually have to stfu for a bit and stop behaving like idiots. Seriously. Oh, nevermind, u'd just find something else to crusade against for no particular reason. Maybe take a worthy cause in rl instead of being internet bullies on something that literally doesn't affect you?

[Eliseus]

Best to ignore this person quotted, since he / she speaks without forms of counter discussion in mind (ref history). Points mentioned were already discussed, but he / she like to keep bringing moot points up as if they were suddenly "new".

He / she is trying to get responders to get worked up and get in trouble. Don't fall for these hogwash comments mixed with laden insults.

Gadzooks, comments made by you are nonsensical and without merit. Most parts are silly, but even the parts that are supposed to be seen as objective fall flat. Re-read your rantings before hitting "post". A T-shirt, really? Who can take you seriously?

Facts. I will give him props though for not telling everyone to F off yet this time around in the thread.

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Weeks pass by, yet the anti-legacy realm crowd still stomps around this thread, insulting and trying to belittle the rest.

Good times.

At this point i just want a legacy-realm to exist so you dudes actually have to stfu for a bit and stop behaving like idiots. Seriously. Oh, nevermind, u'd just find something else to crusade against for no particular reason. Maybe take a worthy cause in rl instead of being internet bullies on something that literally doesn't affect you?

When people have been proven wrong at every corner ad-hominem arguments are the only way to argue anymore. I've been guilty of it as I'm sure other people have been. Sadly you have to keep arguing the same old stuff to the same people doing it over and over so that the random spectator doesn't fall trap to the bait that is them. For example the guy that just posted that he isn't readying all the previous pages.

[Bapestar]

WRONG. When wow started balance was NOT fully playble....ie owlform was later introduced....

Yea they were, maybe not end game content. But that is why I said at least in the leveling content. Stop trying to brainwash people who never played vanilla. Just because x class is bad, doesn't mean it is unplayable.

[Kyanion]

Weeks pass by, yet the anti-legacy realm crowd still stomps around this thread, insulting and trying to belittle the rest.

Good times.

At this point i just want a legacy-realm to exist so you dudes actually have to stfu for a bit and stop behaving like idiots. Seriously. Oh, nevermind, u'd just find something else to crusade against for no particular reason. Maybe take a worthy cause in rl instead of being internet bullies on something that literally doesn't affect you?

*raises an eyebrow* The insults are hardly one sided. Each side is filled with people being jerks. The rest of your post is quite pointless though. We're on a forum about mmos and other games and you are bitching for people to stop discussing them. Maybe you are the one that needs to step back and worry about RL.

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When people have been proven wrong at every corner ad-hominem arguments are the only way to argue anymore. I've been guilty of it as I'm sure other people have been. Sadly you have to keep arguing the same old stuff to the same people doing it over and over so that the random spectator doesn't fall trap to the bait that is them. For example the guy that just posted that he isn't readying all the previous pages.

Oh good lord, yeah try not to sprain your arm while patting yourself on the back there. Prove wrong at every corner? How exactly? Because you claim it is so? Most of us are arguing our opinion as to why we think it is a bad idea or might fail. You seem to be arguing that everything you say is the truth and you are right about Legacy. Makes arguing/debating a topic pretty damn silly.