No flying in 7.0 confirmed

[Deleted]

Its kinda cool on early xpac when leveling first time and you just cant skip everything with your flying mount.
I really enjoyed jumping around to get treasures, finish questlines etc etc. Also you will learn map way better when you actually see places.

When flying came in 6.2, again i found new shit I had never seen before in Draenor so it was cool aswell.

And finally the requirement for flying, completing small part of content you would skip with flying mount was just perfect.

Flying got its place in game, just not in release of new xpac.

anti-flyers are wtf
anti-anti-flyers are just assholes

[Deleted]

Its kinda cool on early xpac when leveling first time and you just cant skip everything with your flying mount.
I really enjoyed jumping around to get treasures, finish questlines etc etc. Also you will learn map way better when you actually see places.

When flying came in 6.2, again i found new shit I had never seen before in Draenor so it was cool aswell.

And finally the requirement for flying, completing small part of content you would skip with flying mount was just perfect.

Flying got its place in game, just not in release of new xpac.

anti-flyers are wtf
anti-anti-flyers are just assholes

Well, enjoyment is subjective. I did not enjoy any jump & run passages in WoW at any time, because the mechanics of the game are so horrible, it's not fun. I enjoy discovering, I have been combing through every area and solo dungeon in Neverwinter to find every hidden passage and treasure - but in Neverwinter, they did a better job with such things.

Fishing and Archaeology is not fun without flying. Period. The only use of being grounded for fishing would be in the tournament - so you could theoretically equal the field for all players at level 40 and above. But I guess, this is not implemented is it? So why the heck do they keep us grounded at max level, especially when questing, exploration are done? Why do we need to farm reputation or world quests for flying? Why do devs want us to spend so much time with travelling on the most horrible of all travel methods existing in games?

This is still the main question here. Why do they want to WASTE our time with an activity which does nothing for our achievements in any part of the game? They got rid of travel in so many group activities, but instead add up the time for open world activities. Teleportation to LFD/LFR dungeons is a baseline feature in modern MMOs.

Anyway, even premade group dungeons without a port profit from flying, when people don't have CM ports available. It's a smoother experience when people just can fly to the entrance and summon the rest with the stone, than doing it the "old" way of flightpath-hopping, then riding across half the map and then waiting... and waiting... I was the one waiting and porting most of the time. I have enough of this waste of time. You will not get any bonus points for this if you lie on your deathbed. Get your priorities straight.

[Deleted]

Flying Sucks. Period.

[Dhrizzle]

The facts is that its ridiculous seeing people defending no-flying thinking that blizzard want to get rid of flying for the sake of the players. When in reality Blizzard only want to get rid of flying for their own selfish reasons, making development easier for them. They don't care at all what you think about flying.
Whats even worse is that blizzard comes up with silly invalid illogical excuses instead of being honest about their real reasons to why they don't like flying. This disconnect from their own community is a great threat to the game.

The largest reason to argue for flying is for the sake of the game. I spent so many years in this game that its hard to argue that its not one of my favorite games but with WoD I don't like the way its headed. And if blizzard gets a chance to remove flying for good it will only get more "on rails" and it will be the end of WoW.
That's why its important to defend flying in this game, for the sake of the game it self and to prevent blizzard from destroying it.

Even if you don't like flying, if they remove flying the game will get much worse for you in every aspect.

What I find ridiculous is people making half-baked theories to try to make their subjective opinions look like objective or "logical" facts. Do you have any good reasons to believe the Apexis zones and treasures in WoD were easier to develop than the daily zones in MoP? Are you honestly trying to tell me that WoD was more on-rails than Cataclysm, the most flight-centric and railroaded expansion ever?

Don't pretend you're on a righteous crusade to stop the game from being destroyed. You're just miffed because the devs are taking the game in a direction you aren't too keen on, but how you feel about the game is not the same as "facts" and "logic."

[Deleted]

Yeah, I'm sure we've all seen those points being regurgitated in this thread. Doesn't make them correct just because someone put them on a blog, especially the one about them trying to go back to stage-illusions for mysterious reasons.

And Blizzard making lame excuses is the correct way to make up "valid reasons"?
Sorry, just because you and other (very few) anti-flight people close eyes doesn't make it false: Blizzard has been caught pants down while making excuses and not delivering one single, logic reason for delaying or even getting rid of flying. Flight hasn't been a problem before WOD, they shouldn't use something like flying as a reason to why they haven't brought more content in WoD.

You are a funny little bunny my friend, but closing eyes won't bring you nowhere. But on the other hand you can believe what ever you want, believe starts where knowing ends..... so every one to their likings i guess ;-)

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What I find ridiculous is people making half-baked theories to try to make their subjective opinions look like objective or "logical" facts. Do you have any good reasons to believe the Apexis zones and treasures in WoD were easier to develop than the daily zones in MoP? Are you honestly trying to tell me that WoD was more on-rails than Cataclysm, the most flight-centric and railroaded expansion ever?

Don't pretend you're on a righteous crusade to stop the game from being destroyed. You're just miffed because the devs are taking the game in a direction you aren't too keen on, but how you feel about the game is not the same as "facts" and "logic."

So that includes you? In the end you try to sell those lame ass excuses Blizz did use to justify the delay (and potential taking from the game) as facts. They are far away from facts, and Blizz them selves did prove they can do better WITH flight.... for FOUR expansions, with a smaller team and even had content that was in areas where flight wasn't possible.

Your "logic" is flawed and your "facts" don't exist.

[Zalamander]

Are you honestly trying to tell me that WoD was more on-rails than Cataclysm, the most flight-centric and railroaded expansion ever?"

Claiming that the least railroaded expansion of them all(Cataclysm) was more on rails than WoD proves pretty much that you are so incredible delusional that there is no point in arguing with you. Cataclysm even had flying from the start, cataclysm had multiple star zones, you could go wherever you wanted.
On top of that you really think WoD took this game in a right direction, you think the subs and revenue of WoW is increasing with the direction WoD took?

[skannerz22]

no expansion had flying on launch day no one was max level
how do you expect it to be different now like wtf entitled much
it has always been you need to be max level or close to it for flying
the only difference now is that FLYING IS FREE ANYONE CAN GET FLYING rather than having a vendor paywall
you unlock flying during the experience of playing 100-110 via things you encounter in the world during that time

[Mafic]

I'm actually ok with this. WoD wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be without flying for release.

That is because you were sitting in your garrison. Legion has no garrisons to hide this putrid design.

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no expansion had flying on launch day no one was max level
how do you expect it to be different now like wtf entitled much
it has always been you need to be max level or close to it for flying
the only difference now is that FLYING IS FREE ANYONE CAN GET FLYING rather than having a vendor paywall
you unlock flying during the experience of playing 100-110 via things you encounter in the world during that time

In MoP I had flying on launch day. I leveled to cap and then bought flying license.

I prefer paying for it than waiting 1 year later to purchase it for "free".

It isn't free if you are still paying a sub waiting for to finish Patch finder.

[Dhrizzle]

So that includes you? In the end you try to sell those lame ass excuses Blizz did use to justify the delay (and potential taking from the game) as facts. They are far away from facts, and Blizz them selves did prove they can do better WITH flight.... for FOUR expansions, with a smaller team and even had content that was in areas where flight wasn't possible.

Your "logic" is flawed and your "facts" don't exist.

The difference is I'm not trying to put across my opinions as logic and facts. I'm not spinning conspiracy theories about Blizzard's internal processes and I understand that opinions can differ between people and what you enjoy in a game is subjective. I thought MoP was terrible because of the way they gated dungeon progression behind a daily-quest rep-grind. I didn't declare it objectively worse than previous expansions or make shit up about Blizz needing to pad subscription time by stretching content. Do you understand the difference?

Claiming that the least railroaded expansion of them all(Cataclysm) was more on rails than WoD proves pretty much that you are so incredible delusional that there is no point in arguing with you. Cataclysm even had flying from the start, cataclysm had multiple star zones, you could go wherever you wanted.

Wow. Did you actually do any of the Cataclysm zones? They severely overused phasing and for the most part there was only one or two chains you could follow. Look at Vash'jir for what has to be the most generically dull quest experience ever.

On top of that you really think WoD took this game in a right direction, you think the subs and revenue of WoW is increasing with the direction WoD took?

As far as questing is concerned yes, both MoP and WoD showed massive improvements over Cata with a main story and various side hubs to explore or ignore. Dungeon wise I'd say WoD's aren't as good as Cata's but more enjoyable than WotLK and what I consider to be the low-point of MoP.

I dunno about revenue but to be honest I seldom judge how much I like a game by how much money it makes. Sub numbers did not grow with WoD, but they stopped growing at the end of TBC so I wouldn't expect them to. Sub losses on average have been pretty constant for Cata, MoP and WoD so you can't really point to them to decide which expansions model is the "best."

[Zalamander]

Wow. Did you actually do any of the Cataclysm zones? They severely overused phasing and for the most part there was only one or two chains you could follow. Look at Vash'jir for what has to be the most generically dull quest experience ever.

Now I'm even starting to wonder if you're just a bad troll or whats going on here. First claiming cataclysm was on rails, then complaining it had almost no quest chains to follow.(quest chains = rails)
While WoD was practically on rails one entire quest chain with almost nothing else through the entire expansion.

As far as questing is concerned yes, both MoP and WoD showed massive improvements over Cata with a main story and various side hubs to explore or ignore. Dungeon wise I'd say WoD's aren't as good as Cata's but more enjoyable than WotLK and what I consider to be the low-point of MoP.

I dunno about revenue but to be honest I seldom judge how much I like a game by how much money it makes. Sub numbers did not grow with WoD, but they stopped growing at the end of TBC so I wouldn't expect them to. Sub losses on average have been pretty constant for Cata, MoP and WoD so you can't really point to them to decide which expansions model is the "best."

Yes MoP was probably the best expansion so far, the world worked excellent, flying worked excellent. Everything was good. WoD however is on the dead opposite side of the spectrum, please never put these two expansions together. When it came to exploration of the world, rare spawns and treasures in MoP was revolutionary, they tried something new for the first time. adding lots of random interesting and challenging content scattered all over the world and flying mounts was a very nice way to explore and find things.
Then near end of MoP things started to go horribly wrong. Firstly they started making rare spawns pop up on your map as skulls because they weren't easy enough to find for noobs.
Moving on to WoD, rare spawns still skulls on the map but turned into worthless boring normal mobs that could be killed just once as a "rare?" and gave you all the interesting loot it could possibly drop right away, such service... -_- However, since there was no flying you could often see these skulls on the mini map. the game letting you know there is a rare spawn in that direction but no way of finding out if its even reachable or hidden behind a quest objective to open an entrance or only accessible at lvl100 through a teleportation of a quest or whatever.
The treasures turned into epic glowing things: ---> LOOK HERE, ITS A HIDDEN ITEM, GOOD JOB FINDING IT <------ that you could click and feel very satisfied after doing such an amazing job of finding it. But ofc should you miss one you could always get a map of all of them in the zone from a vendor or for free after clearing all quests in the zone. /facepalm

So yeah, I can understand how some feel no need of flying out and explore the world like you could in Pandaria and there it was awesome, now turned into some kind of kinder-garden.

Yeah dungeons weren't very interesting in MoP true, they were nice in cata, but that's pretty irrelevant for flying. would be awesome with MoP + Catas dungeons.

[Dhrizzle]

Now I'm even starting to wonder if you're just a bad troll or whats going on here. First claiming cataclysm was on rails, then complaining it had almost no quest chains to follow.(quest chains = rails)
While WoD was practically on rails one entire quest chain with almost nothing else through the entire expansion.

In Cataclysm the quest chains gave you a guided tour of the entire zone. Look at Vash'jir - you go to a cave, get quests in the nearby areas, unlock the next cave, get the next set of quests in the nearby areas...repeat several more times until everywhere is explored and the zone is complete. Hyjal was pretty much the same, Uldum shook things up because there was 2 chains railroading you around the map, Harrison Jones and the Tol'vir rebellion.

WoD had the story arcs for zones too, but there were other quest hubs that you could complete whenever you felt like it or ignore completely. In Cataclysm there was very little choice in where to go next in each zone.

Yes MoP was probably the best expansion so far, the world worked excellent, flying worked excellent. Everything was good. WoD however is on the dead opposite side of the spectrum, please never put these two expansions together. When it came to exploration of the world, rare spawns and treasures in MoP was revolutionary, they tried something new for the first time. adding lots of random interesting and challenging content scattered all over the world and flying mounts was a very nice way to explore and find things.
Then near end of MoP things started to go horribly wrong. Firstly they started making rare spawns pop up on your map as skulls because they weren't easy enough to find for noobs.
Moving on to WoD, rare spawns still skulls on the map but turned into worthless boring normal mobs that could be killed just once as a "rare?" and gave you all the interesting loot it could possibly drop right away, such service... -_- However, since there was no flying you could often see these skulls on the mini map. the game letting you know there is a rare spawn in that direction but no way of finding out if its even reachable or hidden behind a quest objective to open an entrance or only accessible at lvl100 through a teleportation of a quest or whatever.
The treasures turned into epic glowing things: ---> LOOK HERE, ITS A HIDDEN ITEM, GOOD JOB FINDING IT <------ that you could click and feel very satisfied after doing such an amazing job of finding it. But ofc should you miss one you could always get a map of all of them in the zone from a vendor or for free after clearing all quests in the zone. /facepalm

So yeah, I can understand how some feel no need of flying out and explore the world like you could in Pandaria and there it was awesome, now turned into some kind of kinder-garden.

MoP really missed the mark for me. Same sort of daily quests we'd had for the past two expansions, only now they were gating dungeon gear. Flying around in circles hoping to catch sight of a rare mob or waiting for an add-on to ping didn't strike me as fun. I much preferred having to actually find a path to the rare in WoD to just landing next to it. WoD's Apexis zones, treasures and rares may have been poorly incentivised but at least I found them interesting to do, which is why WoD held my attention much longer than MoP.

[Mafic]

Well, enjoyment is subjective. I did not enjoy any jump & run passages in WoW at any time, because the mechanics of the game are so horrible, it's not fun. I enjoy discovering, I have been combing through every area and solo dungeon in Neverwinter to find every hidden passage and treasure - but in Neverwinter, they did a better job with such things.

Fishing and Archaeology is not fun without flying. Period. The only use of being grounded for fishing would be in the tournament - so you could theoretically equal the field for all players at level 40 and above. But I guess, this is not implemented is it? So why the heck do they keep us grounded at max level, especially when questing, exploration are done? Why do we need to farm reputation or world quests for flying? Why do devs want us to spend so much time with travelling on the most horrible of all travel methods existing in games?

This is still the main question here. Why do they want to WASTE our time with an activity which does nothing for our achievements in any part of the game? They got rid of travel in so many group activities, but instead add up the time for open world activities. Teleportation to LFD/LFR dungeons is a baseline feature in modern MMOs.

Anyway, even premade group dungeons without a port profit from flying, when people don't have CM ports available. It's a smoother experience when people just can fly to the entrance and summon the rest with the stone, than doing it the "old" way of flightpath-hopping, then riding across half the map and then waiting... and waiting... I was the one waiting and porting most of the time. I have enough of this waste of time. You will not get any bonus points for this if you lie on your deathbed. Get your priorities straight.

All the WoD and Legion changes are designed for players to log hours running around doing nothing while RNG determines the possibility of a reward. Instead of being able to control and work towards a goal Blizz had decided wasting time should be rewarded via RNG.

Their view point of fun is warped. This is probably why they don't understand why flying is fun. You work towards achieving flight in past expansion (eg paying gold, leveling to cap) and you were done.

A game isn't fun if there is no end to it or finality (eg WoD and Legion gearing system). That is why dragging the issue out with patch finder is going to blow up in their faces.

[Avaddon]

In BC there were some exclusivity to flying which is what sort of gave it that fun factor imo. Like having access to Skettis and Netherwing etc. Now it's just a matter of convenience plain and simple.

[SirCowdog]

In BC there were some exclusivity to flying which is what sort of gave it that fun factor imo. Like having access to Skettis and Netherwing etc. Now it's just a matter of convenience plain and simple.

Which is why I keep repeating the failure of giving flight as a reward without having content for it. If you have to clear virtually all the content to get it, then what's the point of even having it? The entire concept is practically no different than if flight was removed completely.

[Avaddon]

Which is why I keep repeating the failure of giving flight as a reward without having content for it. If you have to clear virtually all the content to get it, then what's the point of even having it? The entire concept is practically no different than if flight was removed completely.

Actually I entirely agree with you. I don't like flying as a vanity point, I like it as a practical point. The way BC gave it that practicality was by saying alright you get 60% mount speed and for *** gold and epic flying for **** gold and to get these bad ass netherwing drakes you have to have the epic flying. So everyone had incentive to go and farm gold and do the Netherwing portion of the game and really it was all tied together with a neat bow, you had to do other stuff to unlock that stuff and so on and so forth.

I mean in a world where I can essentially stand there and queue for a dungeon and be teleported there, or I can use the vast array of teleport items (ring of the kirin tor, Jaina's Locket, Engineering Wormholes, etc). There's literally no practicality to flying mounts besides the fact you can collect them like pokemon and brag about having the 1% drop ones. It's essentially a tasteless design in the game now.

In an ideal world, they would say okay you have to pay (insert somewhat expensive amount for flying at this point OR complete X ground achievements), you know have access to the dungeon / zone Halls of Valor or whatever the viking place in the sky is and maybe they can have a daily hub there and some loot that is slightly higher ilvl than the other dungeons and other cool rewards. it just adds purpose to flying and players will have that drive to obtain it.

This is just my opinion on the matter, I wouldn't expect what I'm saying to be perfect but this is just the jist of it.

[Thirstblood]

Holy fuck this actually going on? I thought we all were past by that?! Holy shittie monie!

[Dhrizzle]

Which is why I keep repeating the failure of giving flight as a reward without having content for it. If you have to clear virtually all the content to get it, then what's the point of even having it? The entire concept is practically no different than if flight was removed completely.

Some people like flight just for the pure joy of soaring above the landscape and seeing the world from a new perspective. With that attitude it doesn't matter when flight is unlocked.

[Mafic]

Some people like flight just for the pure joy of soaring above the landscape and seeing the world from a new perspective. With that attitude it doesn't matter when flight is unlocked.

Actually timing is everything.

No one wants to explore Legion from the air when the next expansion is set to launch a few months later.

[wing5wong]

The facts is that its ridiculous seeing people defending no-flying thinking that blizzard want to get rid of flying for the sake of the players. When in reality Blizzard only want to get rid of flying for their own selfish reasons, making development easier for them. They don't care at all what you think about flying.

I mean maybe they dont want to design a flying game.
Does that make them selfish, or lazy? not at all.
Does it get a few people butthurt, most definitely

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Actually timing is everything.

No one wants to explore Legion from the air when the next expansion is set to launch a few months later.

I didnt mind it.

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This is still the main question here. Why do they want to WASTE our time with an activity which does nothing for our achievements in any part of the game? They got rid of travel in so many group activities, but instead add up the time for open world activities. Teleportation to LFD/LFR dungeons is a baseline feature in modern MMOs.

Anyway, even premade group dungeons without a port profit from flying, when people don't have CM ports available. It's a smoother experience when people just can fly to the entrance and summon the rest with the stone, than doing it the "old" way of flightpath-hopping, then riding across half the map and then waiting... and waiting... I was the one waiting and porting most of the time. I have enough of this waste of time. You will not get any bonus points for this if you lie on your deathbed. Get your priorities straight.

Instant portal direct to everything are one of the single WORST additions.
Some convenience ports nearby, sure. but right to the door, or inside the instance with LFG, nope

[Dhrizzle]

Actually timing is everything.

No one wants to explore Legion from the air when the next expansion is set to launch a few months later.

Firstly there's almost a year between 6.2.2 and Legion launching, quite a bit more than a few months.

Secondly, I for one am quite happy with that timing. I wouldn't have minded if flying had been enabled with the Legion pre-patch.