Tier gear is back into lfr!!

[Sandrox]

I don't understand why poeple think Tier gear in LFR is good, it trivializes dungeons etc

Probably because the difference in performance from someone in equal level gear, 1 with tier bonuses and raid trinkets, and 1 without is astoundingly high. All it did in WoD was hurt low level raiders or alts.

[Osmeric]

and so we return to raid or die as lfr makes all world content trivial and largely a waste of time


...yaaay.

Well, except for legendary drops and artifact upgrades...?

[tylenol]

A reason for another 5 million people to not quit the game again within a couple months, seems Legion is sort of maybe going to be a decent expansion, plus its fun seeing all the whining about this and legendaries and I'm sure when the weapon system was announced there was a lot of bitching about that also, its amazing how vocal the minority snowflakes are at times

[SoulSoBreezy]

You only LFR for gear once a week (well, roll tokens). You can do world quests when they're available.

[therayeffect]

Fuuuuuuuuucccccccckkkkkkkkkk no

Goddammit, I don't mind people enjoying content but I don't want to fucking do LFR. Ugh, holy fuck no. Fuck that shit. Goddammit Blizzard, I don't want to do shitty content not designed for me. Hopefully it's just an early bug and not actually going to happen. Goddammit 4p is going to be too valuable probably so of course I'll have no way to justify not doing it. Now I'll get to enjoy farming LFR for weeks on end hoping to get a stupid fucking trinket too.

OH WAIT. Anyone know if it shares lockout with normal/heroic? If it shares a lockout with them, that would be totally great and I'd be happy. I'm forever an altoholic so while it would be nice to get 4p on my alts perhaps, it would be great if LFR shared a lockout with normal/heroic/mythic so people who do higher tiers don't have to do it just to get 4p or a rare trinket that's 2x more valuable than the heroic one they got.

[LilSaihah]

Another good reason not to be playing Legion, I suppose.

[Oneirophobia]

"Free" Garrison gear is literally raid gear. The HFC cache from the shipyard gives you a random piece of raid gear (essentially) once a week, if you pass the shipyard mission, that is. The piece of gear is essentially the same level as the level of raiding that you're one (as it scales depending on number of raid boss kills at certain difficulties). If you only raid LFR, you only get an LFR cache, but it is actual gear from LFR.

You can raid exclusively LFR, go into your garrison, pick up Frozen/Burning/Shattered path through time and get normal HFC gear. You can even completely skip LFR altogether and still do those very simple quests and, albeit after quite some time, you can have quite a few pieces of gear far better than what you'd get in LFR.

Apexis boosted Baleful (Tanaan Daily) gear is 695. The lowest piece of Heroic HFC gear is 705. Both are modifiable by 10 ilvl of valor. Also, Baleful gear cannot have tertiary stats, warforged (+6 base ilvl), or extra sockets. There is, in all seriousness, no way that Baleful gear can be the same or better than Heroic HFC gear. You are flat-out wrong.

Empowered baleful with valor = 705
Run-of-the-mill heroic HFC drop = 705

That seems like a way to me. Yes, you can get lucky in heroic HFC and get bonuses, or you could not ever step foot in HFC and still have an ilvl of 705 (or higher with the ring, which you can also complete exclusively from the garrison or Tanaan ogre apexis quest) which is on part with HFC heroic, and above LFR and Normal modes. From dailies.

Again, your wrong on the item value. Normal Archimonde drops a base level of 705 that can proc tertiary stats, have sockets, and be warforged as well as upgraded +10 ilvl with valor, achieving a base ilvl of 715. Baleful Tanaan gear can only achieve ilvl 705 through an Apexis Empowerment and dumping 500 valor into them, and even still they will never have tertiary states, sockets, or be warforged. You are absolutely incorrect in saying that Tanaan daily gear is superior to Normal Archimonde drops.

I should have said gear on-par. Yes, its great that gear CAN* by random chance be much better than standard drops, but if it isn't you're still sitting at the same ilvl of empowered baleful + valor. Which, as my main point was, feels really awkward because you're wearing stuff that is on-par with what usually drops fresh off the final boss of the expac. From quests.


I mean, if we really want to stick to gear potential instead of the regular occurrence of drops, I have a necklace on right now that is 735 with pretty fantastic bonuses that has never had anything to do with raiding. I can also take advantage of the mythic dungeon week event for a box containing a random piece of loot from heroic HFC, including ones off Archimonde. Which, again, is a garrison quest completely unrelated to raiding of any sort.

[guardian_titan]

Once upon a time, it was okay to exclude someone based upon their religion. You could deny someone a home, refuse to sell them food or clothing, or even refuse to offer them medical service. Wars were even started over it.

Once upon a time, it was okay to exclude someone based on the color of their skin. People with dark skin were kept as slaves. Once freed, they were often relegated to separate sections of restaurants (if they were even allowed in), forced to give up their seats on the bus, and killed.

Once upon a time, it was okay to exclude someone based upon their sex or their sexual orientation. It wasn't that long ago that there were debate upon debate over same sex marriage and even same sex adoptions. It wasn't that long ago in the scheme of things where women couldn't vote. It was actually pretty recent when rape finally was recognized as a crime. It was more recent still when marital rape was also recognized (and some areas still don't recognize it).

Nowadays, there are laws in place to prevent discrimination based upon thing like religion, skin color, and sex. So why is it okay to discriminate against those who do LFR? Maybe you have never been excluded (by others or by your own choice), but there are plenty of others that have. Try being the only black kid in a white neighborhood (or vice versa). What about a blonde white girl in an Hispanic neighborhood? Or a tall blonde or redheaded European in China? What about the smart kid that always gets As while the rest of your classmates are lucky to get Bs? Or what about the kid that, regardless of how much they try, they can't play any game in gym class? Or what about the mentally disabled kid that struggles to speak and sits a bit strangely? What about a new immigrant that just moved to the area and can barely speak your language?

If you're against LFR being returned to the DS/MoP model, you're nothing but a discriminator. You're the cause of many of the world's problems. Rather than being accepting that everyone is different and we do things are our own pace, you base everyone off your standards while demeaning anyone that underperforms. You take pleasure in seeing others get less and taking things away from others. You're likely a sadist and enjoy seeing others in pain (physical or emotional). If you enjoy degrading others, perhaps you should consider seeking professional help from a therapist because it's never okay to insult someone just because they don't do something as well as you. Nothing should be denied from another person, especially when it comes to games. Everyone pays the same price for content in WoW. By giving LFR shitty quest reward reject knock offs with set bonuses that are so generic they make boring look exciting, that's effectively saying that someone who works at McDonald's as a cashier has no right to buy a brand new car with their money and can only ride the bus. That's effectively saying that a student from a family that barely makes $15,000 a year can't go to college to lead a better life. There are support systems in place to help people achieve something better and outside of exclusive clubs, very little is denied to anyone who wants it. It just might take more effort for some to get it than others.

Besides ... LFR is OPTIONAL. Never has it been required. Never has anyone held a gun to your head and told you you had to run it. If your guild required it, well, they're a shitty guild and you should just find another one. If you're a good player, you'll find another one easy enough. You'll only have a hard time finding a new guild if you're a dipshit, but hey, if you're saying to remove tier from LFR, that is pretty telling in of itself. No wonder you don't want to find another guild. No one will take you if you're a jackass. If you're forcing yourself to run LFR to be competitive, you have a compulsive disorder and should get professional help. Learn some self control. You don't go to a buffet and eat everything in sight because it's there, do you? So why should you feel compelled to do LFR if you do normal-mythic?

TLDR: Nice to see tier returning to LFR in Legion. The WoD "tier" were so shitty I gave up on LFR on my alts. Be curious if it sharing a color with normal will go live or if they'll change it to another color.

[Deleted]

Personally I think it's about effort and reward, tier bonuses should in my opinion take some effort to obtain so I'd rather see them from mythic+ dungeons than LFR. That or LFR should be locked until (or shortly before) next tier is out and offer a pick-up mechanic for that. (with the last tier of the expansion opening up LFR 2 months or more after release of the patch). I'm no raider myself, but I can't get myself to step inside LFR. It's just SO obnoxious.

So unless you do normal+ raiding you won't see the raid content before next is out. (not that that matters) :P

[LilSaihah]

If you're against LFR being returned to the DS/MoP model, you're nothing but a discriminator. You're the cause of many of the world's problems.

Yes yes. Everyone who disagrees with you is Hitler. Get on with it.

[Sett]

This is nice for xmog.

[therayeffect]

*snipped*

You're projecting way too hard and reaching for completely offtopic subjects. I don't want to do it but I will have to do it if tier is in there and I don't have my 4p by the time it's out (since they'll release it in a delay).

I'm fine with it if they make LFR share a loot-lockout with normal/heroic/Mythic so high-end raiders don't have to do it. IIRC there was a raiding mage who had seriously killed Immersious like 30+ times in LFR alone. That's not fun at all and likely killed his interest in this game forever as it would be easy to see him being one of the 5M people who left. I honestly don't care if other people have fun but I do not find LFR to be even remotely fun. I ended up doing it a bit in HFC on an alt but I think I've done it once or twice total so far this patch. It's not fun and it's not meant for me so I hope they don't make it so high-end raiders have to do that shit because it's just not even remotely meant for people like me.

[PassingBy]

On the other hand currently LFR is an awful experience with awful rewards, and it plain sucks.
They will make it an awful experience, with slightly better rewards, it will still suck, but maybe someone will feel better about it.

[alturic]

Why? Why should it be worse than honor gear, or gear you can buy from a vendor in tanaan? That's just bad design.

I can make a case because it's on par with the same difficulty as a heroic and/or solo content? I highly doubt they changed LFR since Dragon Soul, but you could LITERALLY have half the team doing sub-par DPS (not a little, a LOT) and/or AFK and you'd still collect loot. If something isn't any more difficult than a 5-man and/or solo content why in the hell should it be rewarded better gear?

The plus side, Blizzard would be able to actually gauge the interest in all the development time that raids take considering I bet a large majority of the casuals LFR purely because the gear is better and NOT because they want to raid but can't make it in a raiding guild.

[Deleted User Guy]

Well now, that's exciting news!

[Lady Dragonheart]

You can raid exclusively LFR, go into your garrison, pick up Frozen/Burning/Shattered path through time and get normal HFC gear. You can even completely skip LFR altogether and still do those very simple quests and, albeit after quite some time, you can have quite a few pieces of gear far better than what you'd get in LFR.

You know that timewalking happens once per month, and started only recently.

Are you seriously complaining about a once a month quest that awards one item (that can be redundant). In order to be completely geared past LFR via this method, not raiding at all - including LFR, to acquire an item level equal to that of raiders that raid on Normal difficulty or higher, according to statistics and drop chances, would take you months to achieve. You also wouldn't have anything like trinkets with procs or set bonuses that you could benefit from.

Empowered baleful with valor = 705
Run-of-the-mill heroic HFC drop = 705

That seems like a way to me. Yes, you can get lucky in heroic HFC and get bonuses, or you could not ever step foot in HFC and still have an ilvl of 705 (or higher with the ring, which you can also complete exclusively from the garrison or Tanaan ogre apexis quest).

You're ignoring the fact that raid gear can also be leveled up with valor.
You're also ignoring the fact that raid gear procs with tertiary stats, sockets, and can be warforged.
You're also forgetting that you have to be lucky with baleful gear as well, since the secondary stats are completely randomized when you use them.

Also, the ring quest requires raiding (if you are choosing not to do LFR) in order to be made Legendary.

Also, you're stating for someone to valor cap all of his baleful gear without doing LFR at all (in addition to, extremely likely, not be doing mythic dungeons as well from having a low item level).

You're majorly grasping at straws here.

I should have said gear on-par. Yes, its great that gear CAN* by random chance be much better than standard drops, but if it isn't you're still sitting at the same ilvl of empowered baleful + valor. Which, as my main point was, feels really awkward because you're wearing stuff that is on-par with what usually drops fresh off the final boss of the expac. From quests.


I mean, if we really want to stick to gear potential instead of the regular occurrence of drops, I have a necklace on right now that is 735 with pretty fantastic bonuses that has never had anything to do with raiding. I can also take advantage of the mythic dungeon week event for a box containing a random piece of loot from heroic HFC, including ones off Archimonde. Which, again, is a garrison quest completely unrelated to raiding of any sort.

Despite the fact that you're comparing not raiding regularly to raiding regularly. You're literally stating that you don't think that it's fair that that what takes weeks to accomplish with raid, requires many months to a year or greater without raiding... I mean, you're sitting here complaining about a chance of a drop from a quest that you get once every two months, something that can be something that is completely randomized for your class and can be the same thing time and again.

Not only that, you're also expecting the average player that has no raid gear (from choosing not to do LFR or raiding) and no legendary ring to be able to compete in mythic dungeons on a regular basis. While it's possible, it isn't plausible. It is very unlikely, by having such a very low item level, that this player will be select in the LFG tool. Therefore, you're deducing that this average player with a very low item level has some sort of setup in order to be carried in mythic dungeons by either friends or guildies that would tolerate it.

When you raid, you get gear on almost a weekly basis, sometimes several pieces a week. You also get extra rolls for gear from Seals to get even more gear, even faster this way. This is all in addition to things from the garrison. These things aren't excluded from raiders.

[endersblade]

Why do you need upgrades/tier if you're raiding lfr?

The mini set thing just now is a much better idea or how about just remove it already? It's literally just another pointless difficulty.

Why do people who run Mythics need gear that drops from Mythics? The gear they wore into Mythics was obviously enough to beat it, so isn't it just pointless?

Why does someone getting tier gear in LFR HAVE ANY FUCKING THING WHAT SO EVER with what you do in the game? Why do you fuckwits keep bringing this bullshit argument up? Why do we need tier gear in LFR? BECAUSE WE CAN, that's why.

[Blur4stuff]

set bonus options should be available to every type of player

pvp, all raiding difficulties, mythic+ etc...

doesn't mean they have to all be the same. although, i'd rather those buffs be broken apart from set gear. it's kind of like the problem diablo 3 had and still has to a somewhat lesser degree.

since set bonuses are so strong you end up ignoring a lot of gear that drops. it might as well not exist.

[munkeyinorbit]

Lol Blizzard caves in to forum QQ once again.

WTF do you mean by that? I thought Blizzard added tier gear to LFR. I didn't know they removed LFR.

[tanksin the enhance shamy]

i think the fact that world gear can be orange will offset this a little making it still viable to do the new world quests and stuff