[Megathread] Bernie Sanders 2016

[Skroe]

Its not about habits. Its about a crime that shouldn't be a crime that has a very real and serious negative effect on countless lives. Criminalization means fewer able bodied workers, fewer parents, more money on prisons, it means long term damage to earning potential etc etc etc.

Don't do yourself the disservice of just turning it into hippie punching.

Read my followup to ringpriest.

I get that. What I don't get how legal weed could ever be someone's leading reason to vote for ANYBODY (not saying that's the reason people supported Bernie but it is the reason PLENTY supported Ron Paul).

But more to the point, smoking anything is a nasty habit. With cigarettes your breath smells like garbage. With weed, it has it's own distinctive nasty smell. It's actually hygienically gross.

[Matchles]

This thread is characterized by gloating, trolling Hilary supporters. The responses have been a model of restraint, frankly.

You people have been mostly awarded respect that you don't deserve.

It is a discussion forum. More than anything it is the democratic primary mega thread since it is a two person race and anything that is a plus or minus for Sanders or Clinton is appropriate. It is just funny how much of a victim's complex many of you seem to have. It isn't possible to have a reasonable disagreement with you. Anyone who disagrees is a paid shill or pure evil. And if that is the case, you can stop with your threats to stay home is Sanders doesn't get the nomination. The party and politics as a whole are better off without you. Because compromise and debate are the only two constants in politics and you are incapable of either.

[Wells]

Read my followup to ringpriest.

I get that. What I don't get how legal weed could ever be someone's leading reason to vote for ANYBODY (not saying that's the reason people supported Bernie but it is the reason PLENTY supported Ron Paul).

I can see very much why someone would find it to be the primary issue for them. Our justice and penal system has a lot of serious problems with widespread consequences. Drug prohibition, especially for marijuana, is a huge part of that.

But more to the point, smoking anything is a nasty habit. With cigarettes your breath smells like garbage. With weed, it has it's own distinctive nasty smell. It's actually hygienically gross.

That's nice. You seem to be coloring your own perception of the issue on its merits with your own distance for the substance personally.

[mvaliz]

http://blindgossip.com/?p=78645#comments

Blind gossip website but they've been around for awhile, most of their stories end up coming out/getting verified.

...care to, you know, explain what the link is? If you haven't realized it by now, usually when somebody posts a random link from an unknown site and responds only with a suspiciously clickbaitey "yeah, people say it's true" comment are most likely knowing they're going to share something incredibly stupid.

[Dextroden]

Its not about habits. Its about a crime that shouldn't be a crime that has a very real and serious negative effect on countless lives. Criminalization means fewer able bodied workers, fewer parents, more money on prisons, it means long term damage to earning potential etc etc etc.

Don't do yourself the disservice of just turning it into hippie punching.

I'm waiting for any politician to submit actual meaningful legislation. To atleast, at the barest minimum, force a real debate on putting an end to this properly. Instead of, you know, going on about legalizing it during campaign time. Or claiming it will destroy America. Or wasting time on bathroom laws in either direction.

[Skroe]

I can see very much why someone would find it to be the primary issue for them. Our justice and penal system has a lot of serious problems with widespread consequences. Drug prohibition, especially for marijuana, is a huge part of that.

I think that's symptomatic of much larger and fundamental problems relating to the economics of criminality, the social origins of it, and structural defects in our justice system (such as ungodly powerful prosecutors, the immense inequities defense has against them). Yes sure, Drug users certainly feel the sting disproportionatley due to their huge numbers, but even in their absence the core problems afflicting our justice system would remain.

By all means, end the war on drugs. But anyone thinking "I'm going to vote for the guy who will end the war on drugs BECAUSE he'll end the war on drugs", plainly hasn't thought about the larger motivators of crime.

That's nice. You seem to be coloring your own perception of the issue on its merits with your own distance for the substance personally.

Well I mean it is a political opinion right? But seriously, as a non-smoker, to anyone who smokes weed regularly, you're every bit as gross as a tobacco smoker. Different plant, same nasty.

[Celista]

...care to, you know, explain what the link is? If you haven't realized it by now, usually when somebody posts a random link from an unknown site and responds only with a suspiciously clickbaitey "yeah, people say it's true" comment are most likely knowing they're going to share something incredibly stupid.

Christ. I have 14k posts and you don't trust me by now, mvallas? :P Here I'll just quote it.

The spouse of a Presidential Candidate is currently having an extramarital affair!

The person with whom they are having the affair is a French model living in New York. The affair has been going on for over a year.

The model has a big mouth, so we don’t know how the Candidate’s campaign is going to keep this one quiet in the run-up to the Presidential Election.

It is a blind gossip website so clearly take it with a HUGE grain of salt, their previous presidential candidate blinds have all been revealed so far for this campaign cycle though.

[Wells]

I think that's symptomatic of much larger and fundamental problems relating to the economics of criminality, the social origins of it, and structural defects in our justice system (such as ungodly powerful prosecutors, the immense inequities defense has against them). Yes sure, Drug users certainly feel the sting disproportionatley due to their huge numbers, but even in their absence the core problems afflicting our justice system would remain.

By all means, end the war on drugs. But anyone thinking "I'm going to vote for the guy who will end the war on drugs BECAUSE he'll end the war on drugs", plainly hasn't thought about the larger motivators of crime.

So basically since it won't solve crime they're wrong to make it their top priority?



Well I mean it is a political opinion right? But seriously, as a non-smoker, to anyone who smokes weed regularly, you're every bit as gross as a tobacco smoker. Different plant, same nasty.[/QUOTE]

I don't smoke either. But I see what prohibition is doing.

[Celista]

Well I mean it is a political opinion right? But seriously, as a non-smoker, to anyone who smokes weed regularly, you're every bit as gross as a tobacco smoker. Different plant, same nasty.

Weed is a pretty benign habit comparatively to other substances, especially alcohol use.

[Skroe]

Weed is a pretty benign habit comparatively to other substances, especially alcohol use.

Also not a great habit

[mvaliz]

Christ. I have 14k posts and you don't trust me by now, mvallas? :P Here I'll just quote it.

Heh, sorry to offend - but It's MMO-off-topic... it's not you, it's that I honestly don't trust anybody here anymore - which is why I rarely post here nowadays. :P

EDIT: And thx for the info - It wouldn't surprise me, but I don't want to end up like a certain side and believe something to be true simply because I WANT it to be true. :P

If it was true, and I was her (shudder...) I would gather as much evidence as I can, and wait till deep in the general election. Doesn't matter if it came out true or not, you'd become a celeb overnight. :P

[Celista]

Heh, sorry to offend - but It's MMO-off-topic... it's not you, it's that I honestly don't trust anybody here anymore - which is why I rarely post here nowadays. :P

EDIT: And thx for the info - It wouldn't surprise me, but I don't want to end up like a certain side and believe something to be true simply because I WANT it to be true. :P

If it was true, and I was her (shudder...) I would gather as much evidence as I can, and wait till deep in the general election. Doesn't matter if it came out true or not, you'd become a celeb overnight. :P

Understood, no worries.

It's a gossip site so I can't overstate the "this may be 100% fake" ness of the post; I only posted it because he's been right 100% of the time this election season and it's a fun juicy tidbit.

I actually wonder if it's Melania who's the one having the affair, if true. Shrug.

[derpkitteh]

Read my followup to ringpriest.

I get that. What I don't get how legal weed could ever be someone's leading reason to vote for ANYBODY (not saying that's the reason people supported Bernie but it is the reason PLENTY supported Ron Paul).

But more to the point, smoking anything is a nasty habit. With cigarettes your breath smells like garbage. With weed, it has it's own distinctive nasty smell. It's actually hygienically gross.

i didn't say legal weed was the leading issue. i said the most important is money in politics, which is the linchpin issue, and regime change wars.

[Gray_Matter]

I'm worried she's going to screw this up (the polls are getting bad) and end up messing up all of the progression we've tried to make. Ironically I'm not sure what's more worrisome for progression, her getting elected or Trump getting elected. Maybe people will go with a split vote and vote for Trump but vote in a Democrat Congress. We'll see.

A democratic senate would also be very beneficial for a Clinton SCOTUS pick. I have a feeling that Elizabeth Warren is staying out of things because Clinton is going to pick her for that.

[Matchles]

Jesus Christ. Every time I just think that maybe Sanders is going to wise up, his campaign pulls something like this.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016...debate-n580641

In the latest twist to this unpredictable 2016 presidential race, presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump and Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders independently agreed Wednesday night to debate each other.

On ABC's "Jimmy Kimmel Live!" Trump was asked if he would consider holding a debate with Sanders. Trump agreed to the idea.

"If he paid a sum toward charity I would love to do that," said the business mogul noting a Sanders vs. Trump debate "would have such high ratings."

Sanders quickly responded with a tweet reading, "Game On. I look forward to debating Donald Trump in California before the June 7th primary."

This response taking an implicit jab at Democratic front-runner and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who this week declined to face off with Sanders in a previously agreed upon California debate.

Sanders said during a Santa Monica rally Monday that he was "disturbed but not surprised" that Clinton "backed out of the debate."

Clinton's communications director Jennifer Palmieri wrote in a statement that her candidate's time was "best spent campaigning and meeting directly with voters across California."

If this goes through, Sanders just committed career suicide. The second he gets back to the Senate and off his soap box. Bye bye, every committee appointment.

[McCulloch]

Jesus Christ. Every time I just think that maybe Sanders is going to wise up, his campaign pulls something like this.

If this goes through, Sanders just committed career suicide. The second he gets back to the Senate and off his soap box. Bye bye, every committee appointment.

I felt the same, but I think there's an upside. If Sanders plays this well and only hits Trump, it's an avenue for unity.

Some of his supporters won't vote if it's Hillary v. Trump and some will even vote for Trump. However, if Bernie is aggressive enough in denouncing Trump to his face, it could make Hillary more palatable to Sanders supporters.

It all depends on how Sanders plays this.

[Matchles]

I felt the same, but I think there's an upside. If Sanders plays this well and only hits Trump, it's an avenue for unity.

Some of his supporters won't vote if it's Hillary v. Trump and some will even vote for Trump. However, if Bernie is aggressive enough in denouncing Trump to his face, it could make Hillary more palatable to Sanders supporters.

It all depends on how Sanders plays this.

I hope so. I think Trump is just going to agree with him as much as possible to try to appeal to Sanders supporters and make sure the only things negative said are about Clinton.

[Merkava]

If this goes through, Sanders just committed career suicide. The second he gets back to the Senate and off his soap box. Bye bye, every committee appointment.

I'm inclined to agree, but has he stated his intentions for after the election? Isn't he up for reelection this year?

- - - Updated - - -

Some of his supporters won't vote if it's Hillary v. Trump and some will even vote for Trump. However, if Bernie is aggressive enough in denouncing Trump to his face, it could make Hillary more palatable to Sanders supporters.
.

But what percentages are you talking about? If you had to guess, what percent stay home, what percent cross over to Trump, and what percent vote Hillary?

[Magicalcrab]

I hope so. I think Trump is just going to agree with him as much as possible to try to appeal to Sanders supporters and make sure the only things negative said are about Clinton.

I'm withholding judgment on the Sanders-Trump debate until I see how it plays out.
Although, I have to say Clinton could have used a debate to do the same thing. Use the stage to appeal to Sanders' supporters and attack Trump when he doesn't even have a chance to defend himself.
If only Hillary had an opportunity to do something like that. Oy vey.

[McCulloch]

But what percentages are you talking about? If you had to guess, what percent stay home, what percent cross over to Trump, and what percent vote Hillary?

I'm not quite sure enough to give percentages. Less specifically, the vast majority vote Hillary. A sizable portion stay home. A small percentage vote Trump.

I'm mainly hoping that a debate like this would invigorate the ones who might stay home. Drive up her poll numbers a little bit if they realize Trump is a real threat, since the erosion of support from Bernie's people is a huge factor in her decline. Anyone who would cross over and vote for Trump is beyond convincing at this point.