Why so much hate towards WoW?

[WowIsDead64]

P2W = Pay to WIN. Buying a mount is not "winning" unless that mount is a 500% speed increase or something else game-breaking.

Also, I doubt anyone is going to pay over $500 for a mount. The spectral tiger was a special circumstance (it was printed in limited numbers and duping wasn't a problem then), this is just a vendor mount that can be bought at any time between now and WoW's end.

FYI having your agenda in your username is not a good idea if you want to be taken seriously.

Win - is SUBJECTIVE. May be not for you, but for some players having Spider mount = win.

Again, this has been said many times recently - interests and preferences of other players may differ from yours. Game isn't being developed personally for you and you actually can be just a tiny minority.

[Phantombeard]

HATE!!!!!?!?!?!? Since when? I love wow. Wow helped me overcome drug addiction and probably ended up saving my life. All this talk about hate, wheres the Love?

[Deleted]

Too much pay-to-win.

Lol dumbest thing I've read on these forums in a while I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're just trolling

[Dhrizzle]

Top of the MMO genre for subs?? It must of been nothing to do with vanilla bringing in 5.6 millions subs?

Closer to 7m I think, then TBC took it over 10m, WotLK held it around 11m and the expansions since then have seen a steady decline of of ~100k a month. What is the point you're making?

[ornichi]

Lol at people saying they are not listening to the community. I'd say exact opposite - they failed, because they started listening.

People wanted fresh leveling, flying in Azeroth and interesting quests - Cataclysm. Now people bitch about it being boring and lacking content.
Then people asked for tons of content and non-recycle - MoP. Now people bitch about pandas not being part of actual lore ("it's not a Dreamworks movie, ffs!") and tons of dailies.
At last, people asked for more lore and less dailies - WoD. Now people bash garrisons and apexis grinds for NOT being dailies.

Should I mention people, who were asking for vanilla leveling and now that Blizz nefred the XP (hotfix), they cry on the forum that it was unnecessary?

Point is, Blizzard should never ever listen to what people want, cuz people actually don't know what they want, lol.

[Deleted]

Why is there so much hate towards wow?

Because a new set of developers forced their ideas on an existing game that attracted over 11 million subscribers and changed it into something else, when what they should have done was make a separate game for their intended demographic and type of gamer.

They have turned WoW from a realm-based world into a cross-realm current-content-only set of mini-games.

Is there anyone else that hopes for the best for the game?

Yes, the millions of players who wanted to believe the hype for Warlords of Draenor. They almost doubled WoW's subscriber numbers back to over 10 million.

They, and many others, left when the hype was replaced with the experience of what WoW is really about these days.

[HappyCola]

Point is, Blizzard should never ever listen to what people want, cuz people actually don't know what they want, lol.

This is true in general for product and service development. It is well established that people are irrational and do not know what they want. People think, for example, that more choice will make them happier, while it has been shown via numerous experiments that more choice makes people less happy. Customers can tell you if they like your offering or not after trying it, but they are not designers that could design a product that they like. That's the job of the company.

[Malico]

Because, wow is too good game and never die!

[Lilija]

On long term (and WoW is a good example of long term game), the rules of the game, more specifically the game design, define the community, not the opposite.
If you have a bad experience with people in a game, that means the game is not suited, not designed for that.
This is why designing the mechanics of a game is a real job and not just listening to the playing people, who actually never know what they like.

There are many multiplayer games that do not maintain and create social networks on their own (most FPS, RTS..). There's matchmaking, then the game starts, it finishes, and goodbye. It's not an accident, it's just the way it's done.
World of Warcraft, today, is built the same way (you select the map in a menu, basically). But it was not always like this, so you get a huge "I don't like this game anymore" feeling.

The thing is WoW is only partially matchmaking. There is plenty of things in WoW still build around social interaction. Tho that interaction is a choise. This means the resposibility of being social falls more onto players. Some people for some reason prefer the game to force them into socializing which isn't really a good design.

There is also one issue. On almost every topic around WoW game design people will have the full variety of opinions. What I don't like about the people who "don't like the game anymore" is that they claim their view is somehow superior because reasons. They complete negate the fact there is plenty of people who think the opposite and their opinion is as valid. And Blizzard basicly at some point has to chose the approach they want to follow. They can't make everyone happy. So those that are unlucky to be in the unhappy group should do the adult thing: quit the game, go enjoy something else, stop bashing on people who still play and enjoy the game blaming them and the devs that the game changed in the way they don't like.

[ornichi]

This is true in general for product and service development. It is well established that people are irrational and do not know what they want. People think, for example, that more choice will make them happier, while it has been shown via numerous experiments that more choice makes people less happy. Customers can tell you if they like your offering or not after trying it, but they are not designers that could design a product that they like. That's the job of the company.

exactly.
/10chars

[Eon Drache]

I wasn't comparing it to anything. Marketing got the people in, but the product couldn't deliver.That is why it is just a spike. Nothing controversial in that.

They came back to see if the game was going back to the roots that was the amazing TBC like they thought it was. And were disappointed that the game wasn't the "hardcore" MMO they remember. And for good reason.

[HuxNeva]

You still lacked to explain how it puts you at a disadvantage to other players, as that's what a pay-to-win feature does if you're compared to someone using it while you're not using it.

Ever noticed how people forced together in prolonged situations seem to bond? Getting stuck in an elevator at work with 5 other people for 8 hours is no-one's idea of fun, and yet, these situations often lead to a bonding experience that persists long after the event, so much so that people afterwards say it was one of the best days of their lives. Ever notice the experience of camaraderie and accomplishment when the sh*t hits the fan and you needed to team up with a group of people to work together through the night to avert a crisis? These activities all include small to large inconveniences, and yet, the payoff is huge in terms of fulfillment. This is what people get out of a shared experience that requires investment. This is why the social bonds used to be formed, why people felt accomplished, and why people enjoyed playing. You were stuck in a wow-leveling ride for months on end seeing the same people every day, you needed help from some of them with quests and instances. You got to know who you could rely on, who to avoid. You made friends for years to come, and knew who the assholes were and shunned them together with the rest of the server community. Trust built over long time.

Now try to get that same feeling by asking people stepping in the elevator whether they would like to stay with you in the cab for 8 hours, when they can get of and on when they like, and other people are passing through on regular lift rides all the time. Ask your colleagues to work through the night with you by choice, 'just for the team-building'. What do you think the results are going to be.
In modern wow everything is convenient, fast and ephemeral, communication and reputation non-existent, shared accomplishment only reserved for highest tiers of raiding.
Meaningful, consequential and inescapable shared inconvenience is the substrate that forges the bonds, also in gaming. The fact that there is other people in other buildings taking smooth elevator rides doesn't destroy the experience of the people stuck. They can and need to do everything to escape as the inconvenience and the will to overcome it needs to be real. You passing through 'their' elevator, but even more so, the fact that the doors can be opened at all, that ends the situation and denies the result.

That is why 'then you just don't do it' isn't a sensible answer.

[McNeil]

Does this really need to be asked? Pretty sure people have been stating why troughout WoD's lifespan, just visit this forum enough and you'll see plenty of threads why.

To me its because of an incompetent development team thats only using the game to milk it out as much as possible before it dies, while focussing on all their other games which aren't even near its quality. But these other games so bring in a lot of cash while it doesn't cost much to maintain them at all. From a business perspective its very smart what Blizzard is doing, but WoW players are drawing on the short end. And yet Blizzard gets away with it because of all the ''fanboys'' protecting them, and thats a lot.

And the game has changed way to much since the early days, to the point of being unrecognisable with entirely different goals (leveling might aswell not exist, while raiding is now where the game is at). Despite all the QoL improvement troughout the years, the direction this game took changed for the worst.

[akaTheDude]

The developers have single handedly destroyed the MMO genre by not listening to the playerbase.

The game is 1% of what it used to be. Everyone can do everything. 0 sense of server community. 0 sense of any community what so ever.

There are 4 raid difficulties...for every raid. Think about that. You have 4 versions of the same raid......with 4 different tier sets......of the same tier.

Imagine if Karazhan had Kara LFR Kara Normal Kara Heroic Kara Mythic....imagine how stupid that would be. That is what we currently have.

Rewarding mediocre players instead of encouraging people to get better is why WoW has declined.

This guy nailed it!

[HuxNeva]

Again, yes the leveling experience can be better to help with the social dynamic of the game but the point was that the ability to skip leveling is not a pay-to-win feature. It seems you're trying to argue that for some reason if some players skip leveling then they're no longer being forced to level up with you and potentially be your friend. Personally, I would still just level on my own because that's not really the fun part of the game for me and I didn't like waiting around for people. Either way, there's still people who enjoy that same things you enjoy so you're literally losing nothing by having a leveling boost option.

You seem to confuse a few posts. I never mentioned 'pay-to-win'. On that subject: 'pay-to-win' is not a black and white issue. It is a sliding scale of being able to buy advantages/conveniences (anything but pure cosmetics) through plonking down real world cash rather than playing the game being the sole means of obtaining things in-game. So yes, there is some 'pay-to-win' since you can buy gold, the universal currency which in turn can buy everything else, but as of now it is still 'prohibitively expensive' for it to become problematic (yet wow-progress already had to ban BMAH so the issue is not hypothetical).

'potentially be your friend' has nothing to do with it. It is the part about 'They can and need to do everything to escape as the inconvenience and the will to overcome it needs to be real' you need to read again. I find 'buying a 100' less problematic than e.g. LFG. It is still not innocent as it creates (like server transfer) too easy a way to escape the consequences of toxic reputation destroying actions.

[Deleted]

Actually it was the Warcraft [RTS] franchise that brought vanilla 5.6m subs. Not Vanilla WoW itself...

https://www.google.com/trends/explor...tz=Etc%2FGMT-2

Warcraft has actually little to do with wow's success.

[Jademist]

To those who say that Blizzard isn't trying haven't been following their recent dev posts. Blizzard is listening and trying to make a game that appeals to the broadest audience. They're trying to provide more content, make PvP less about gear and more about skill, trying to fix the leveling issue, and so on.

I, for one, want to see WoW keep going. I have been playing since half-way through Vanilla when I was just a kid. Now that I am an adult I can see why certain changes were necessary. It's ridiculous that people insist that Blizzard is trying to kill WoW. There are some aspects of older WoW expacs that I miss but the game HAS to change to keep surviving. Sure, some of the changes may have caused WoW players but that does not make Blizzard some kind of self-hating entity who only wants to see the end of the thing they have been working on for more than a decade.

I am excited for Legion. World quests, PvP that isn't gear reliant for once, Mythic dungeons that increase in difficulty with some challenges attached to them, crafting looks fun, I am actually excited for artifact weapons...I am excited.

[Taeldorian]

If gold doesn't make the game easier, why bother acquiring it via Tokens? You don't feel you need gold for any other aspects of the game, other than to purchase BOE's? Mmm hmm..

Of course I do, so I farm it. It takes me 4-5hours of time (I don't have to be logged in for this, only have to log in once for 15-20m) and I can make that 45k. Why would you buy a token when we have an in game gold mine aka garrison/shipyard?

[Raetary]

because its cool to hate something you play.

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No, people are literally saying they want this game to die on this forum.

which is funny, if you want the game to fail then you should stop supporting it by buying the expacs, paying the sub or buying more game time.

[djcoin]

Blizzard has been screwing over the game by making degrading decisions since 2008, they refuse to learn their lesson year after year so people are hoping they go down for it as an act of justice.