Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Morbownz]

We're a good 1,355 pages into this. How many more pages will it take for people to realize that the casualization of WoW is what caused this. Modern WoW is too casual and has forced people to go back to a time where skill and not time meant something. Where pulling more than one world mob could mean death, and that raiding was difficult from the start. Where every dungeon pull required crowd control, not a tank that can AOE spam for threat. Where you had to wait for 3 sunders, and not just go balls to the wall on a boss. Where a fire spell couldn't hurt a boss made of fire, and required you to spec into Frost or Arcane.

Time to admit you screwed up casuals. Turns out, the gaming world doesn't revolve around you. Blizzard employee's, pay attention, cause you're the ones who should listen to my advice. The only reason why we want Vanilla WoW is because modern WoW sucks. It's too casual. Fit it. I'd tell you what to do but I already have many times and you ain't paying me. I'll be back when this thread reaches 2000 pages.

Judging from the hostility in this thread, I reckon we might get another 20 pages out of your post alone.

[Struggle]

We're a good 1,355 pages into this. How many more pages will it take for people to realize that the casualization of WoW is what caused this. Modern WoW is too casual and has forced people to go back to a time where skill and not time meant something. Where pulling more than one world mob could mean death, and that raiding was difficult from the start. Where every dungeon pull required crowd control, not a tank that can AOE spam for threat. Where you had to wait for 3 sunders, and not just go balls to the wall on a boss. Where a fire spell couldn't hurt a boss made of fire, and required you to spec into Frost or Arcane.

Time to admit you screwed up casuals. Turns out, the gaming world doesn't revolve around you. Blizzard employee's, pay attention, cause you're the ones who should listen to my advice. The only reason why we want Vanilla WoW is because modern WoW sucks. It's too casual. Fit it. I'd tell you what to do but I already have many times and you ain't paying me. I'll be back when this thread reaches 2000 pages.

Millions of people played vanilla WoW and TBC casually. Casuals are not the problem. The vocal minority ruined the game, not casuals. The people that suggested "I deserve to see content too!" when in fact thousands of casual players were either working towards it were in fact seeing this content. The people who suggested that anything in the game then that took time was actually boring and took too long.

When I started playing, my two best friends did too. I eventually joined a hardcore raiding guild, they couldn't dedicate the time. Didn't matter at all. Outside my raids, we did dungeons, farmed vanity items and rep, did BGs and later Arena, leveled alts, etc.

They ruined and took over the game, and the fatal blow was that ActiBlizz listened. It wasn't the fault of casuals, and spamming this sentiment is just as harmful as what they did. Fact is like I said, casuals played this game by the millions when the game was itself "hardcore." They didn't get everything right away like us hardcore players did, but they still had plenty to do and could even do what we did after some nerfs were applied. It took time, but when they completed it they probably felt better than I even did completing it, whatever it is.

Stop attacking casuals, they aren't the problem. People who want everything handed to them without any time or effort simply because they paid a sub fee as well ruined the game.

[RickJamesLich]

Yeah I hope this changes their mind and they decide to make a legacy version of the game the petition for it got a lot of support because of him and blizzard responded to his video pretty much the same day the fact that they're going to meet and also wanna keep it disclosed is probably very important.

Definitely agree here. Today is a massive day for all the old school gamers out there, I'm hoping blizzard listens and gives these guy's a chance.

[Eliseus]

If someone were to use (MMO-C or Kern's Twitter) polls as fuel in an argument for or against Legacy servers, then I would dismiss it for being unreliable. Polls made here (or on Kern's twitter) are a collection of opinions sampled from a small group of enthusiasts. They're not representative of the community that Legacy servers would actually affect as a whole.

Again, there is past polls on MMO-C that have shown the people who frequent this site don't want Legacy servers. The exact same polls today show differently. It is a huge difference for what it once was. Do the polls represent the majority of WoW? No, but it definitely showing a polar opposite of what people view that visit this site.

[Eleccybubb]

Definitely agree here. Today is a massive day for all the old school gamers out there, I'm hoping blizzard listens and gives these guy's a chance.

Tbh they could easily hire them to do it. Because any company like that will have safeguards in place to stop them stealing/leaking personal info and if they were found doing so then would be in serious trouble legally. It's the same with Google, Apple and Microsoft for example anyone leaks the private information of it's customers then enjoy your time in the slammer.

[Eliseus]

Here is links, granted 4 years ago to better understand what I'm talking about.

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...a-or-BC-server

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ld-you-play-it

If you go to the end of the first link you can see Darsithis linking other threads full of negativity.

The point is, can polls show from this website show the majority of what the WoW population wants? Maybe not, but it can definitely show the times are changing, at least here.

Btw, http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/17289080493 has a wall of no post in it that shows how these polls were used to help argue the validity of not doing the server .

[Thimagryn]

Again, there is past polls on MMO-C that have shown the people who frequent this site don't want Legacy servers. The exact same polls today show differently. It is a huge difference for what it once was. Do the polls represent the majority of WoW? No, but it definitely showing a polar opposite of what people view that visit this site.

People are quick to voice an opinion on a freshly debated topic. That's all polls really mean.

Blizzard shut down Nost and stirred a hornets nest. Threads related to Legacy popped up here all the time for the past month, with this being the last surviving megathread.

What do you think public opinion would be if Blizzard suddenly removed PVP from the game? Hmm...

[Kyanion]

People are quick to voice an opinion on a freshly debated topic. That's all polls really mean.

Blizzard shut down Nost and stirred a hornets nest. Threads related to Legacy popped up here all the time for the past month, with this being the last surviving megathread.

What do you think public opinion would be if Blizzard suddenly removed PVP from the game? Hmm...

Oh come on, linking ~4 year old polls with less than 100 voters total is really useful. Then Eliseus fails to grasp the concept of Pro-Legacy people, many with fresh accounts, creating new threads and polls and circle-jerking in those threads/polls. Really useful polls those were. Hell even then the voter turnout for those polls was complete crap to some polls that have taken place on this site.

[Eliseus]

Oh come on, linking ~4 year old polls with less than 100 voters total is really useful. Then Eliseus fails to grasp the concept of Pro-Legacy people, many with fresh accounts, creating new threads and polls and circle-jerking in those threads/polls. Really useful polls those were. Hell even then the voter turnout for those polls was complete crap to some polls that have taken place on this site.

MMOChampion poll about whether fans think Blizz should have such servers:

In the wall of no with those polls, that is still used to this day. Matter of fact, if you bothered to stop ad hominem and strawman every convo, you would see that even the battle.net link with the wall of no I'm referencing from was just used in a few months ago. Are you done?

[Thimagryn]

In the wall of no with those polls, that is still used to this day. Matter of fact, if you bothered to stop ad hominem and strawman every convo, you would see that even the battle.net link with the wall of no I'm referencing from was just used in a few months ago. Are you done?

I'm surprised you're still hanging on to all that, considering wall of no people are no longer relevant here, except to the one person bringing them up.

[Kyanion]

I'm surprised you're still hanging on to all that, considering wall of no people are no longer relevant here, except to the one person bringing them up.

That and the wall of no was used to show why Blizzard was not interested in making those servers 'at this time' when the wall of no was last quoted in January by blues and referenced in a video about Legion stuff not long ago. Wall of no had nothing to do with polls and when we were discussing the Wall of No, we weren't bringing up polls. I basically have no fucking idea what Eliseus is going on about and that is one of the many reasons I put them on ignore not long ago.

[Traveler Voltin]

Yeah I hope this changes their mind and they decide to make a legacy version of the game the petition for it got a lot of support because of him and blizzard responded to his video pretty much the same day the fact that they're going to meet and also wanna keep it disclosed is probably very important.

the petition also had people sign it multiple times.
so its an unreliable piece of trash.

[Eliseus]

I'm surprised you're still hanging on to all that, considering wall of no people are no longer relevant here, except to the one person bringing them up.

Not true at all. The convo has been about how irrelevant polls are and how pro-legacy people can't use them. I'm merely refuting that point and using past MMO-C threads to show what polls on this website can show if nothing else.

- - - Updated - - -

That and the wall of no was used to show why Blizzard was not interested in making those servers 'at this time' when the wall of no was last quoted in January by blues and referenced in a video about Legion stuff not long ago. Wall of no had nothing to do with polls and when we were discussing the Wall of No, we weren't bringing up polls. I basically have no fucking idea what Eliseus is going on about and that is one of the many reasons I put them on ignore not long ago.

That is because you are a troll. Hence why you keep trying to personally attack me by quoting other people though responding to me lololol. This is also one of the same people that tried using someone else poll on what we would want before the current expansion as this being a failed project.

[Thimagryn]

the petition also had people sign it multiple times.
so its an unreliable piece of trash.

Despite that, the petition will probably the closest thing we'll get to having Legacy shift Blizz's hard stance. Not saying it's legit or that Blizz will, but it's been better than everything else that's happened so far.

Not true at all. The convo has been about how irrelevant polls are and how pro-legacy people can't use them. I'm merely refuting that point and using past MMO-C threads to show what polls on this website can show if nothing else.

... Get over it.

[Eliseus]

... Get over it.

Oh I've been over it. Are you over being wrong? Don't argue a view then get mad when someone refutes it. I know it is your common tactic in this thread, but responding with "get over it" is childish.

[Vash The Stampede]

Judging from the hostility in this thread, I reckon we might get another 20 pages out of your post alone.

Very Good, Very Good Indeed. Blizzard needs a clue, and this thread probably the best one there could ever be.

Millions of people played vanilla WoW and TBC casually. Casuals are not the problem.

But yet, here we are with only a few million players left and a underground illegal WoW server that had 150,000 active players. This is one of those situations where Correlation does imply causation. The evidence is damning.

When I started playing, my two best friends did too. I eventually joined a hardcore raiding guild, they couldn't dedicate the time. Didn't matter at all. Outside my raids, we did dungeons, farmed vanity items and rep, did BGs and later Arena, leveled alts, etc.

Your definition of casual is very different than mine. Putting time in the game is not what makes one hardcore. Skill is the defining factor. Downing raid bosses requires skill, which if you and 39 other people had, the boss would be dead.

Stop attacking casuals, they aren't the problem. People who want everything handed to them without any time or effort simply because they paid a sub fee as well ruined the game.

Whether it be the casual players or the devs who catered to the casual's, it doesn't matter. We as the community told Blizz this was a good idea, and they continued without any restriction. And plenty of people have said that LFR was bad, and 4 raid difficulties is bad. I could go forever, but I'd be repeating myself and many others.

This thread is so focused on bringing back Vanilla from the past, but very little has been about how Vanilla WoW is an example of what Blizzard did right, so they could fix modern WoW. Jontron said it best, and that's WoD sucks. Fix the game by fixing the game, and not by bringing back Vanilla.

[Traveler Voltin]

Despite that, the petition will probably the closest thing we'll get to having Legacy shift Blizz's hard stance. Not saying it's legit or that Blizz will, but it's been better than everything else that's happened so far.

blizzard also hates petitions.
anyway. why are you stalking me?

[Darkeon]

Kern is back from his meeting and will be tweeting about it.

https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/735978022503743488
https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/735978220864999425

Good to know.

Now, whether they are positive or negative news to the Pro-Legacy crowd, I just hope there is a clear path to be taken and not simply the same mambo-jambo and twisting words in the limbo, never knowing what is their actual plan.

[Kyanion]

Kern is back from his meeting and will be tweeting about it.

https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/735978022503743488
https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/735978220864999425

Love this one: "First, Blizzard and Mike can make NO PROMISES about legacy servers. But, the amount they have been paying attention is incredible."

Yeah good meeting.

[Molis]

NO PROMISES
No promises

He is already spinning.