A guild I was in for seven years disbanded today

[Pull My Finger]

being happily married = being "trapped in wedlock."

In the case of this guy, you bet.

[Deleted]

I haven't been active in/with too many guilds, but there's one problem I could observe in a few. Females were by no means worse than males. Yes, a few of them, just like with males, could be complete scumbags. But that's not the issue. It's that the male guildies/guild leaders don't react properly when it's a female who is causing drama.

Whenever a male member reveals himself to be an asshole, guilds seem to be very likely to deal with them. When it's a female who's starting bullshit, however, guild leaders are often a little more... reluctant to react consistently. Reasons for that could be the woman's relationships with other guild members or the mere fact that the male guild leaders just cannot for the sake of it assert themselves in front of girls.

And when it goes like this, I really can't blame the asshole-female for the destruction of a guild. Instead, it is the irresponsible guild leader's fault.

If I was you, op, I'd blame the officer just as much as her.

And guess what, only once in my WoW "career" it was a relationships issue. Dont make this bigger than it is or blame the women for this. Its a problem of leadership.

Basically, this.

[Pull My Finger]

There's a specific club of people around here who'd tell you women are only out there to seduce you, marry you and then steal your money and run away. True story bro.

But that's kind of interesting. This one guy was telling me that I was a white knight that puts women on a pedestal and acts as if they couldn't do any wrong, in hopes of getting laid.

Now you're talking about paranoid woman haters who think that them wenches are the root of all evil and only seek to exploit you, feast on your wealth, gut you like a fish and kick you when you're down.

That's kind of - polar opposite programs. Jeez, what am I now? Tell me, internet life experts!

[Deleted]

mustve been a good guild to let that happen : D I have a guild for 6 years now myself and removed so many of this kind of troublemaker. Couples who would discuss their problems in guild chat and make people choose sides between them. One girl flirting with each and everyone simultaneously. 1 Warning, then kick. Everyone standing by her side will leave automatically, which is good.
Also: yearly guild meetings helped to strenghten bonds. I dont think any guild should be destroyable by a single flirty teenage girl.

[Ealyssa]

your gm should have grew a pair and kick the officer and that bitch out of the guild

This.

There is only one solution to drama : cut the cancerous cells out. Actually happend to me once in my whole 11years of wow, during MoP a girl tried flirting with me, even sent me an half naked pic on our guild's forum. She wanted more raid spots, and more loot. I, and the other officers, kicked her right away.

My current guild has 3 girls on the roster and everything is nice and quiet. Just avoid drama queen/king.

[FelPlague]

Ran a competitive sponsored guild back in vanilla and we ran into something similar. 3 of my top officers (also RL friends) were infatuated with one of the female raiders. Whenever someone had any criticism of her, they'd flip the fuck out, which was often because she was terrible. Always OOM, always standing in fire, it was always everyone elses fault. I don't mind people fucking up, IF they take responsibility for it (which she never did). The guys were some of the top on the server, but holy shit they went pure apeshit whenever she logged on. They knew how good they were and thought that made up for carrying her (meanwhile they wanted to cut anyone else who was fucking up). They'd bend all the rules for her, and she took full advantage of it. White knighting at its finest.

She started influencing guild decisions, and since I made decisions based on council between 6 officers (with me as the GM being the final vote), we started to clash hard. It was inevitable, we all saw it coming, but we stuck around because we were the best guild at the time.

We pushed through with top AQ kills, but when Naxx was released egos eventually boiled over. They wanted to go to ZG (because she needed to finish her robe) despite us having a scheduled raid. Those 4 gquit on the spot, half the guild went with them since they were actively recruiting from within before they quit.

Their guild imploded shortly after since she kept getting loot defaulted to her. My half took a break and pushed into TBC, but my hardcore raiding days were done.

So much drama

wait a girl playing vanilla? get out of here you liar

[Deleted]

Ok i understand 5-10 ppl in the guild to be involved but 1 officer ...Your GM is weak bro
Our one rule with iron fists there is no friends when we start raid if person can prove that can be part ot the main raid will be there if not will not be there and there is no exceptions

wait a girl playing vanilla? get out of here you liar

I know atleast several who played Vanilla one was from our guild back in the time one still palying
Isually most of the girls are really good players (we have 1 now in the main raid) but if some GF who just get forced to play this game then they may not be that good

[Deleted]

But that's kind of interesting. This one guy was telling me that I was a white knight that puts women on a pedestal and acts as if they couldn't do any wrong, in hopes of getting laid.

Now you're talking about paranoid woman haters who think that them wenches are the root of all evil and only seek to exploit you, feast on your wealth, gut you like a fish and kick you when you're down.

That's kind of - polar opposite programs. Jeez, what am I now? Tell me, internet life experts!

Hoping of getting laid or some kind of relationship with someone who probably lives hundreds of kilometers away is pretty damn pathetic in general.
I mean the odds.. are pretty damn slim, you probably have more chance to get laid if you walk up to the first girl you see when you go to the mysterious place that's called "outside".

[Deleted]

Have any of you dealt with similar behavior?

If you let a girl destroy your guild and no-one did anything, you deserved it. You could have kicked her. You could have told her that her behavior was intolerable. Yet, no-one did so I don't think your guild was much worth defending then.

Just treat everyone the same. That would have sorted your issue easily. If some guy had been an ass, you would have told him so. What magical force prevented you from doing so in this case? Kinda stupid.

Tits, penis, vagina, girly voice on Teamspeak. Won't matter. Treat everyone the same. The trash will cry and leave but your guild/team of gamers will be stronger and better for it.

You might find nice female gamers too, you know, the kind who actually play to enjoy and progress in a game and hate the general "omg a gurl" attitude boys tend to give them online.

[Incarnia]

Usually it's not only 1 or 2 people that starts the down spiral which ends up in a disband.. However, 1 or 2 people can become the final nail in the coffin.

I've seen regular nice guys become power crazed monsters when going from Raider to Officer. It is fucked up and causes havoc - but a tight knit community within the guild will survive that shit and eventually manage to get rid of the idiot. If the core of the guild is already off balance though? It will end in disaster. I've lived through that too... The guild I've been in since 2008 "disbanded" roughly half way through HFC Mythic. Change in leadership, drama between officers (girl involved there), bad attitudes from some. "I'm superior to you" type of crap. Some raiders leaving without giving a heds up fucking the raid team over and hard to find good enough players to replace them with was the reason/s.

- - - Updated - - -

If you let a girl destroy your guild and no-one did anything, you deserved it. You could have kicked her. You could have told her that her behavior was intolerable. Yet, no-one did so I don't think your guild was much worth defending then.

Just treat everyone the same. That would have sorted your issue easily. If some guy had been an ass, you would have told him so. What magical force prevented you from doing so in this case? Kinda stupid.

Tits, penis, vagina, girly voice on Teamspeak. Won't matter. Treat everyone the same. The trash will cry and leave but your guild/team of gamers will be stronger and better for it.

You might find nice female gamers too, you know, the kind who actually play to enjoy and progress in a game and hate the general "omg a gurl" attitude boys tend to give them online.

Thumbs up on this!

Throw the "hi I'm a girl give me stuff" females in the trash bin... Everyone will be better off.

[Glaziola]

Remove them both from the guild if you are the guild leader, find a new officer.

I remember my old Guild back in Wrath we had plenty of women in our raid team, they were performing pretty good and they were a lot of fun to talk to on vent so we never had any issues with that, I'm sorry that you had to experience some idiot destroying your guild.

[Deleted]

It seems this stuff happens quite a lot..

I joined a guild recently, a (VERY) casual raiding guild.
The guild leader is "female". I use quotes because I sincerely doubt it. No one has ever heard "her" and the only evidence we have is a facebook acount with pictures of your typical barbie girl (spanish version).
Anyway.. She demands to be in every raid, raid starts at 20:00, we often wait till 20:30 - 20:45 just because she isn't there yet. She dies to the simplest mechanics (green stuff on floor is out...) and gets a combat ress every bloody time only to die again shortly after... (cause us more than 1 wipe). As the guild's priest healer I have to constantly pull her out of stuff or just watch her die because I can't keep up.
She's the girlfriend of both our Raid leader and our main dps.. I won't even get into that story because I don't know the details myself but she is, obviously, long distance relationship

Anyway, being one of the only healers of our small guild, this has been bugging me for so bloody long, so bad even that I stopped going to raids because I didn't want to deal with that stuff.
She acts like a total bitch towards my sister as well (also guildie) and a couple of days ago our Raid Leader whispered my sister that he couldn't be friends with her anymore, just have contact on a guild basis. (they were battlenet friends, were )
Sad thing is that she's the guild leader and has the raid leader and top dps in her pocket because I really like the other people in it and it's the only guild I know that raids on such a casual level. (cleared hc hfc but they're not strict in any way so it's pretty chill).

So yeah, guess what I'm trying to say is that this kinda stuff seems to happen quite a lot. The power of internet anonymity I guess...

Greetings and good luck

[Super Kami Dende]

Of all the guilds I've been in that have fallen apart abruptly. ALL of them have been from Women causing fucking drama.

My last Raid guild did not allow Females to join since it was mostly Raiders of 2 previous guilds that had been destroyed by 2 separate Women.

First Guild we had a fair chunk of Women. Started Raiding and such, 1 Woman started flirting with the loot council leader, started sending him nudes etc for "preferential" loot distribution. We got pissed at it for a while but since she was a Enhance Shaman we just let it slide mostly since nothing really clashed with her AGI mail wise. Got annoyed at times from 1h weapons being taken away from Rogues and such, but whatever.

Another Woman started raiding with us. She was a Marks Hunter. Suddenly there is contention with AGI mail gear. The new Woman is about 5x better looking than the first Woman. The second Woman starts the flirting with the Loot council leader now. doing the same shit as the first one, but being better looking the leader starts giving her preference.

Basicallly both Women go RAWR!!! at each other for a couple of nights, the other raiders tell them to fuck off since we are sick of their whorish shit. They have a cry and get all the beta nerds white knights on their side and destroy the guild. the raiders that didn't give a shit about them stick together and reform Guild #2.

Guild#2 starts out fucking great. about 5 months in a couple joins, a BF and GF. they are pretty chill people. a couple months later another girl joins.
Long story short, they live close to each other. BF starts fucking new chick for a while, new chicks actual BF joins guild. The BF of new chick finds out old BF and her had been fucking, blurts it out over Ventrillo, the 2 Women have Meltdowns. Once again WhiteKnights jump in and leave with the girls to make "new guilds" away from the other girl and her posse. Once again the Raiders that gave no fucks just made a new guild together and started recruiting.

We never invited Women to the next guild as a Rule. Guild lasted for a long time until it peetered out due to content drought and people moving on from WoW. Still have many friends to this day from it.

TL;DR Women cause unnecessary drama all the fucking time in MMO's.

[Maia Moon]

This.

There is only one solution to drama : cut the cancerous cells out. Actually happend to me once in my whole 11years of wow, during MoP a girl tried flirting with me, even sent me an half naked pic on our guild's forum. She wanted more raid spots, and more loot. I, and the other officers, kicked her right away.

My current guild has 3 girls on the roster and everything is nice and quiet. Just avoid drama queen/king.

This so much, just kick the drama queens/kings and enjoy your peacefull raids.

In my 10man raiding guild for 4 years we've had 5 women. Of the 4 only 1 was flirty (she was a teenager at the time), she was mainly mocked for her flirty/childish behaviour and poor gameplay, and was quickly kicked out of the guild.

No girl drama ever since.. Sure we've had to kick others too for causing trouble or just being bad, but no women. We're all adults who just want to play the game.

How the hell do you manage to find these rotten apples anyway?

[xcess]

You can have females, but only females then youll fix the guy problens (it might create new ones though)

[tmkai]

TL;DR Women cause unnecessary drama all the fucking time in MMO's.

The conclusion of your story could as well be: Men causing lots of drama because they cant act normal arround women or stand their ground.

[shammypowa]

Of all the guilds I've been in that have fallen apart abruptly. ALL of them have been from Women causing fucking drama.

My last Raid guild did not allow Females to join since it was mostly Raiders of 2 previous guilds that had been destroyed by 2 separate Women.

First Guild we had a fair chunk of Women. Started Raiding and such, 1 Woman started flirting with the loot council leader, started sending him nudes etc for "preferential" loot distribution. We got pissed at it for a while but since she was a Enhance Shaman we just let it slide mostly since nothing really clashed with her AGI mail wise. Got annoyed at times from 1h weapons being taken away from Rogues and such, but whatever.

Another Woman started raiding with us. She was a Marks Hunter. Suddenly there is contention with AGI mail gear. The new Woman is about 5x better looking than the first Woman. The second Woman starts the flirting with the Loot council leader now. doing the same shit as the first one, but being better looking the leader starts giving her preference.

Basicallly both Women go RAWR!!! at each other for a couple of nights, the other raiders tell them to fuck off since we are sick of their whorish shit. They have a cry and get all the beta nerds white knights on their side and destroy the guild. the raiders that didn't give a shit about them stick together and reform Guild #2.

Guild#2 starts out fucking great. about 5 months in a couple joins, a BF and GF. they are pretty chill people. a couple months later another girl joins.
Long story short, they live close to each other. BF starts fucking new chick for a while, new chicks actual BF joins guild. The BF of new chick finds out old BF and her had been fucking, blurts it out over Ventrillo, the 2 Women have Meltdowns. Once again WhiteKnights jump in and leave with the girls to make "new guilds" away from the other girl and her posse. Once again the Raiders that gave no fucks just made a new guild together and started recruiting.

We never invited Women to the next guild as a Rule. Guild lasted for a long time until it peetered out due to content drought and people moving on from WoW. Still have many friends to this day from it.

TL;DR Women cause unnecessary drama all the fucking time in MMO's.

Hrmmm, interesting. So the men who could only think with their little heads instead of the big heads weren't responsible for their parts in the drama at all?

[Deleted]

Meaning the guys in the guild are weak and think they'd not be able to handle it? That's just pathetic.
I'm pretty sure those guilds have a no-tolerance for drama period, and still experience it despite being all-guys. Kungen himself is the daddy of drama.

Why do you care so thoroughly about invading this perceived male space anyway? They don't want women in their guild? Their perogative, move on and find a guild that does or make your own? Which I assume is what you did so why flame about it?

[Super Kami Dende]

Hrmmm, interesting. So the men who could only think with their little heads instead of the big heads weren't responsible for their parts in the drama at all?

They weren't the ones that started the shit storms. Both Guilds broke up specifically by the Women leading the charge. The guys were just chilling until they started the shit. Both times until the Women started the exodus of leaving the Guild everyone else was still fine with raiding.

[Vaelorian]

So fun as to how people seem to think this has nothing to do with females or males and everything is equal.

There aren't as many women as men playing wow, period. If you crossreference that with the amount of dramatics vs male dramatics, you will see what people in this thread are saying.

Are all women/girls bad in WoW? Hell no. Are there no male dramaqueens? No there are those obviously.

What is usually the case though is that some women tend to drag others with them. They try to form a base of power and solidify that with sex or the promise of sex or the hint of sex. Insecure men will flog to them and will try to keep that promise alive at all cost. Those women know what they are doing. Those men should know but are blinded by love or sex. In the end the guild loses.

examples I had in my "hardcore raiding career":
1. sleeping with an influential and beloved raider, while she was very bad at WoW and was very powerhungry, bitchy to others - I as GM removed her and he sadly followed. I had no choice.
2. trying to "seduce" me with the promise of sex, which I declined - she didn't suck at wow but switched guilds after my decline and went to another GM and fucked him. Turned out that he showered her with loot and the guild imploded.
3. had social girlfriend of a raider wanting to become a raider. We tried and she failed horribly. We extended the trial period for his sake and we were scared to lose him. If she would shape up, it would be ideal. She failed again and they both went to another guild. He could not accept that she sucked. He thought it was "decent enough". Well decent enough isn't what a hardcore guild is looking for.
4. Had a girl come in to the guild and she started bitching to another girl we had or comparing herself to the other girl. Like if we called out the new girl on fails, she would go on and on about how we never call the other girl out. Which was not the case but she made far less mistakes and was not a trial either. So after a huge drama catfight sorta on TS I kicked her.
5. Had a non officer /w to a girl raider (who was pretty good but very stubborn) that she was standing in the fire too long or standing in the wrong place I can't remember. And she didn't take that info well as it came from a non officer. She started an offensive in /w back and then in /raidchat. Telling him that he should put a giant dildo up his ass. I saw the screenshots of the conversation and can only conclude that she was very much overreacting. Should he not have said anything? Maybe, he wasn't an officer. On the other hand we had a very open policy concerning feedback as long as it isn't poorly worded (insulting). This was not the case.
6. Two girls teamed up to be very negative in the guild. My guild ran very efficient, almost every aspect was managed very good. But since they weren't accustomed to it, they started doubting everything. They wanted to know why and how. Me and my officers tried to manage their questions and were pretty much always polite, why not? After a while they started to bash on "lesser" players who were longstanding and performing admirably. Just not top notch. And starting to say that we should replace them by recruiting them out. Meanwhile there was nothing to recruit. The only recruits available were worse. At our level it was just plain hard to get "better" ones. So they started focussing on that and kept going on it. This went as far as that I just gave up and quit the game. I was with my back against the wall. I could not /gkick them or the guild would not be able to raid and would lose a significant portion of the guild in the process (2 maintank and 2 dps) - so we would not be able to raid. Replacing them would take such a huge amount of time... and recruitment was already so hard... I just gave up. The two girls made a new guild and this collapsed because they started to bitch about eachother to the rest of the guild. And it imploded.

Thankfully I have had the pleasure of playing with 4 great women/girls aswell. But those 4 are exceptions in my experience.