Arms Legion Discussion

[Lightbull]

Are you guys still going on about pruning?

Months have gone by and Blizzard have stood their ground on these changes. It's not gonna be reverted. Just give feedback based on what buttons you have. You're probably going to forget you even had those abilities 3 months in, just like with WoD.

It's not a big deal as people make it out to be. Every class is still very fun, if not more fun than in WoD.

[Archimtiros]

And minus the GCD. I can live with that. It's not a straight-up wash anymore, and 10% is low enough that you can sit in Dstance for as long as you need without your damage turning to absolute shit.

The GCD part to me is the funniest, because I raged against that and was told it was intended that it be on the GCD.

- - - Updated - - -

Are you guys still going on about pruning?

Who's talking about pruning? These abilities were just shuffled around, nothing has been pruned since early Alpha.

Months have gone by and Blizzard have stood their ground on these changes. It's not gonna be reverted.

Obviously not, considering they just made some changes based on feedback.

Just give feedback based on what buttons you have. You're probably going to forget you even had those abilities 3 months in, just like with WoD.

It's not a big deal as people make it out to be. Every class is still very fun, if not more fun than in WoD.

I'm not sure you understand what feedback means, or the idea that "fun" is subjective. Some people may consider smacking their head into the wall until they're unconscious fun, but I wouldn't recommend it on a day-to-day basis.

[Kirbydude65]

Are you guys still going on about pruning?

Months have gone by and Blizzard have stood their ground on these changes. It's not gonna be reverted. Just give feedback based on what buttons you have. You're probably going to forget you even had those abilities 3 months in, just like with WoD.

It's not a big deal as people make it out to be. Every class is still very fun, if not more fun than in WoD.

The difficult thing about, "Fun" is that it's not only subjective from person to person, but also can change based on time played, or skill level. For example I use to be a very staunch player of DotA and didn't like how League of Legends played. Fast forward several years, and I now only have fleeting memories of playing DOTA, yet I'm more likely to boot up League or Heroes of the Storm.

Fun is always hard to pinpoint and pin down, because of the fact that even the people who consider certain things, "Fun" may not consider it to be fun, hours /days/weeks/months down the road.

[Deleted]

Defensive stance changed.

Now only provides 20% damage reduction but the damage dealt reduction has been reduced to 10% from 25%.

They also changed DBTS, it now has a cooldown 3 minutes but from what I have read, it no longer replaces Defensive stance.

[Nition]

Defensive stance changed.

Now only provides 20% damage reduction but the damage dealt reduction has been reduced to 10% from 25%.

They also changed DBTS, it now has a cooldown 3 minutes but from what I have read, it no longer replaces Defensive stance.

Just a tad late on that one. I don't think the other 4/5 posts about it were enough

[Deleted]

Just a tad late on that one. I don't think the other 4/5 posts about it were enough

Apologies, my fault. Just saw the update pop up and didn't expect anyone here to have already seen the changes.

[toolsv]

You can't cheese the Defensive Stance cooldown with a cancel aura macro can you now that it's not really a real stance, can you? Hopefully their implementation is crap and they don't fix it.

[Caargon]

The GCD part to me is the funniest, because I raged against that and was told it was intended that it be on the GCD.

I'm constantly reminded of blues defending flagrantly stupid designs when this sort of thing comes up. My personal favorite remains BCs "Epic doesn't necessarily mean better, it just means rarer."

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet

Will of the First King (Rank 1) Whirlwind critical strikes generate 5̶ ̶r̶a̶g̶e̶. 2 Rage.

So now that artifact trait sucks too.

[Exotath]

You can't cheese the Defensive Stance cooldown with a cancel aura macro can you now that it's not really a real stance, can you? Hopefully their implementation is crap and they don't fix it.

You can't "click" it off so I imagine you can't cancelaura it either.

[Warriorsarri]

Will of the First King was a tad OP, so that nerf was very much deserved.

[kimicate]

Will of the First King was a tad OP, so that nerf was very much deserved.

You almost never starved rage while in AOE situations.

[Caargon]

Will of the First King was a tad OP, so that nerf was very much deserved.

How? It affected one ability and would, on average, return 5 rage in a given use. Outside of BC your chance of getting even a double crit is something like 3-4%. It created the weird situation where whirlwind was better than slam during battle cry, sure.

[Artunias]

How? It affected one ability and would, on average, return 5 rage in a given use. Outside of BC your chance of getting even a double crit is something like 3-4%. It created the weird situation where whirlwind was better than slam during battle cry, sure.

On AoE you had infinite rage. Which is the primary use of Whirlwind.

[Caargon]

Didn't even cross my mind. Two weeks without a day off has made me retarded.

[Hellravager]

lawl at that whirlwind change, blizzard you might as well remove it at 2 rage >.>

[Warriorsarri]

The issue with WotFK was that the gains didn't get reduced if you picked Dauntless or Fervor, so even against two targets using one of either of those two talents, on average, you where at a rage positive. Now at 2 rage I'm not sure if that is still the case.

Also worth noting was that you can only proc WotFK once, per target, per use, but it can proc from any of the three hits. This means that you have 3 chances per use, per target to crit.

[Bullettime]

Are you guys still going on about pruning?

Months have gone by and Blizzard have stood their ground on these changes. It's not gonna be reverted. Just give feedback based on what buttons you have. You're probably going to forget you even had those abilities 3 months in, just like with WoD.

It's not a big deal as people make it out to be. Every class is still very fun, if not more fun than in WoD.

There's been very little discussion over the pruning in awhile now. A lot of the discussion is about PvP Arms or how bad proc fishing is/was, and now the Wotfk topic.

Limited buttons doesn't really matter as much as long as there's intuitive gameplay. Arcane has had very few buttons for awhile but has had immense depth since Cataclysm. Arms is down to few buttons, which again isn't bad, but the problem is that the gameplay is basically all built around Colossus Smash and praying RNG smiles on you.

[chooi]

Now that I've played a bit more of Arms and got more gear I can say it's playable. It's still a dumb spec but not better or worse than WoD Arms (just different) once you reach a sweet spot of Haste. I'd say >15% Haste enables the spec. Adding Mortal Strike to Tactician was a huge improvement to the overall feel of the spec as well.

Now, I think they only have to change two things for the core rotation:

1) include all singletarget abilities (Slam, MS, Execute) to Exploit the Weakness trait. There is no reason not to with the nerf on Tactician to 10% and would be a logical next step to improve the ST rotation even more.

2) reduce Colossus Smash CD to 30sec as a bad RNG protection. Especially with the 10% Tactician nerf it happens even more often than before that you have to spam MS/Slam for >30sec for a CS reset.

AoE rotation is fine so far.

Some talents still feel a bit weak/useless but I guess most of this has been discussed already, so I won't go into detail about that.

[kubuntu]

If CS woud be on Charge system it woud be perfect protect ageinst bad RNG in my opinion

[Artunias]

Has anyone else ever sat around thinking Legion arms could have done well to almost copy/paste 5.4 fury with the abilities being called Arms names?