Cincy Zoo kills critically endangered gorilla to save boy

[Celista]

So, I thought this was the case, but I just had an argument with a friend of facebook who feels that it wasn't the parent's fault because the child's hand was in the mother's pocket, and he just "darted off" in an instant and it was the zoo's fault for not making the enclosure harder to get into (I guess they could enclose it in plexiglass or something...).

Yeah I HIGHLY doubt this is what happened.

[dopefishz]

Let the damn child die. If it's dumb enough to go in there, it's not the gorilla's fault to protect it's territory. Just like the 2 lions that tried to eat the man. Shouldn't have been killed.

Then again, being killed is prob better than living in a small cage your whole life.

[TirielWoW]

Do we have access to a picture of the enclosure in question? More specifically the fencing that the child got through?

No, just verbal accounts of the barriers. A fence, some kind of wiring (I'm thinking like a wire fence, doubt it was barbed wire however) and a wall.

Let the damn child die. If it's dumb enough to go in there, it's not the gorilla's fault to protect it's territory. Just like the 2 lions that tried to eat the man. Shouldn't have been killed.

Then again, being killed is prob better than living in a small cage your whole life.

He wasn't in a small cage, and also, were you dropped on your head as a child?

[Lillyth]

It's been explained so many times why a tranquilizer wouldn't work. They don't start working immediately - it takes several minutes for it to kick in. The pain from being darted would probably have agitated the gorilla further, and he was already dragging the 40lb child around like a rag doll and apparently throwing him at points.

So what? The kid is hardly as important as a critically endangered species. He'll have to deal with the consequences.

Great, they are patting themselves on the back now. "Yay we saved a kid that did not know any better!". But what it means in the long run is that a rare animal had to die because humans are letting it die.

[Hooked]

The sad part is the gorilla was actually trying to protect the toddler.

[spinner981]

No, just verbal accounts of the barriers. A fence, some kind of wiring (I'm thinking like a wire fence, doubt it was barbed wire however) and a wall.

Doesn't look like google is turning up any results.

Oh wait, this looks like it might be it:



That is after google image searching for "Cincinnati zoo gorilla fence"

Not sure if this is where the kid snuck in through. The fence seems to fit the description, but nobody said anything about those bushes. They look too thick for a child to easily get through. Might have been a different section. The fence doesn't look very difficult to get past though, especially for a small child.

How do I make an image smaller by the way?

[Celista]

That's very nice though. This child falls into a gorilla enclosure and its straight to "That child shouldn't have been born."

I don't feel like getting into a semantics game as to whether people personally think of abortion as birth control. Apparently you think that is the case, which I think is very odd.

In regards to the quoted, if you recall my original statement was that she clearly has too many children if she can't keep a proper eye on them, and probably should have thought of such things before spitting out more of them.

I don't feel like derailing a thread about a gorilla into an abortion thread so that is really all I have to say about this topic.

[muto]

The thing about animals is this, they do not have a brain that functions as a human's. A cow, a domestic species, can be incredibly unpredictable. A cow can be a lovely animal that drops its head to be hugged. But they can also become wildly violent in a heartbeat if you make a (perceived) threatening gesture. Gorillas are similar. At one moment the gorilla can be curious and gentle. The next moment the gorilla could go into a fit of rage due to thoughts of danger.

Sorry to break your heart but human brains function the same way in that manner. I can be cuddling and happy, but if someone comes out of nowhere and hits me I'm going to become pissed off almost immediately and defend myself.

[Hooked]

That fence looks totally unacceptable. It needs to have a hog wire type construction, not just a few cables marking where an actual fence should be.

[Celista]

So what? The kid is hardly as important as a critically endangered species. He'll have to deal with the consequences.

Great, they are patting themselves on the back now. "Yay we saved a kid that did not know any better!". But what it means in the long run is that a rare animal had to die because humans are letting it die.

In all fairness, if that kid had died it would have had a hugely negative impact on the zoo and consequently other animals due to a lawsuit/loss of revenue from visitors and donations.

However, I don't understand why zoo officials thought it was safer to kill the animal with an actual bullet than to use a tranquilizer gun. What if the bullet missed and hit the kid instead?

[TirielWoW]

So what? The kid is hardly as important as a critically endangered species. He'll have to deal with the consequences.

Great, they are patting themselves on the back now. "Yay we saved a kid that did not know any better!". But what it means in the long run is that a rare animal had to die because humans are letting it die.

Unfortunately for you, human children will always rate more important than the lives of any other species.

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The sad part is the gorilla was actually trying to protect the toddler.

He did seem like he might have been. Problem is, human children are much more delicate than gorilla children.

[Hooked]

In all fairness, if that kid had died it would have had a hugely negative impact on the zoo and consequently other animals due to a lawsuit/loss of revenue from visitors and donations.

However, I don't understand why zoo officials thought it was safer to kill the animal with an actual bullet than to use a tranquilizer gun. What if the bullet missed and hit the kid instead?

Bullets don't miss, they hit where they are aimed from a rifle. If it were over 300 yards it would make a difference, but not at that close range. A tranquilizer wouldn't immediately stop the animal and it may have went into a rage, there was just no good choice.

[spinner981]

In all fairness, if that kid had died it would have had a hugely negative impact on the zoo and consequently other animals due to a lawsuit/loss of revenue from visitors and donations.

However, I don't understand why zoo officials thought it was safer to kill the animal with an actual bullet than to use a tranquilizer gun. What if the bullet missed and hit the kid instead?

I find it odd that you don't consider it a danger to agitate the gorilla with a tranq, but do wonder how dangerous it was to just shoot the gorilla in the off-chance that the bullet hit the child instead. What if they hit the kid with the tranq on accident? I'm no expert, but a tranquilizer used to put down a gorilla would definitely have adverse effects on a child. He would be out near instantly, and might even have drowned in that water for all we know.

[TirielWoW]

In all fairness, if that kid had died it would have had a hugely negative impact on the zoo and consequently other animals due to a lawsuit/loss of revenue from visitors and donations.

However, I don't understand why zoo officials thought it was safer to kill the animal with an actual bullet than to use a tranquilizer gun. What if the bullet missed and hit the kid instead?

The tranq most likely would have agitated the animal for several minutes before it actually kicked in. Animals don't like being tranq'd, and this gorilla has almost certainly been tranq'd before, so he'd know what it was.

According to the articles I read, the zoo has a special team of rapid response personnel who are trained and rated in firearms every year by the local police department. I would imagine that they had a crack shot handling it.

[dopefishz]

He wasn't in a small cage, and also, were you dropped on your head as a child?

Compared to its natural habitat, I sure call that a small cage.
I can ask my mother later if she dropped me, if you REALLY want to know.

[TirielWoW]

I find it odd that you don't consider it a danger to agitate the gorilla with a tranq, but do wonder how dangerous it was to just shoot the gorilla in the off-chance that the bullet hit the child instead. What if they hit the kid with the tranq on accident? I'm no expert, but a tranquilizer used to put down a gorilla would definitely have adverse effects on a child. He would be out near instantly, and might even have drowned in that water for all we know.

It actually would have probably killed the child, drowning or no drowning. The amount of sedative needed to bring down a 400lb gorilla would stop the heart of a 40lb toddler.

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I can ask my mother later if she dropped me, if you REALLY want to know.

For science.

[Celista]

That fence looks totally unacceptable. It needs to have a hog wire type construction, not just a few cables marking where an actual fence should be.

I actually agree with this. If the picture is an accurate portrayal of the fence then that is not acceptable, also the second fence/rock wall should be higher or the shrubbed area should be deeper (more like a trench).

I'm also amazed that the kid survived that fall, that moat looks deep.

[TirielWoW]

I actually agree with this. If the picture is an accurate portrayal of the fence then that is not acceptable, also the second fence/rock wall should be higher or the shrubbed area should be deeper (more like a trench).

I'm also amazed that the kid survived that fall, that moat looks deep.

Agreed. The fence looks way too small even for adults. What if someone slipped and fell over? They'd kill themselves falling in.

I really think that can't be the right fence, because apparently the zoo hasn't had anyone actually manage to get into the enclosure in 78 years. And that fence looks super easy to just accidentally fall over.

[Celista]

I find it odd that you don't consider it a danger to agitate the gorilla with a tranq, but do wonder how dangerous it was to just shoot the gorilla in the off-chance that the bullet hit the child instead. What if they hit the kid with the tranq on accident? I'm no expert, but a tranquilizer used to put down a gorilla would definitely have adverse effects on a child. He would be out near instantly, and might even have drowned in that water for all we know.

I do consider it dangerous to use a tranq, I just think that the decision to use bullets was also dangerous.

[spinner981]

I actually agree with this. If the picture is an accurate portrayal of the fence then that is not acceptable, also the second fence/rock wall should be higher or the shrubbed area should be deeper (more like a trench).

I'm also amazed that the kid survived that fall, that moat looks deep.

Same google image search, I think this is a different angle of the same exhibit:



Looks very similar to the images captured of the gorilla and child on the news too:



The water looks deep enough to at least some minor cushioning. Still a pretty far drop for a three year old. But I don't see it as an impossibility for the child to remain conscious.

Ya, in this video you can see the same waterfall: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vo-3RULsZ2E

I think I actually remember coming to this exhibit when I was younger. We live pretty close to Cincinnati.

I do consider it dangerous to use a tranq, I just think that the decision to use bullets was also dangerous.

It was probably the least dangerous method.