[Beta] Havoc Discussion

[jettzypher]

well I figured since you wanted haste to reduce the cd of eye beam then you'd want to have a fair bit of haste in order for it to reduce it a noticeable amount and I don't feel like haste should really be a focus of a demon hunter.

A comment made in conjecture and intended to be more humorous than serious. I understand full well that as the stat exists now, it's worthless. My original point, however, is based on a pipe dream of it being changed to be useful.

[Ryanite]

A comment made in conjecture and intended to be more humorous than serious. I understand full well that as the stat exists now, it's worthless. My original point, however, is based on a pipe dream of it being changed to be useful.

ah okay, my bad then.

Not sure if this has been discussed already but wowheads artefact calculator allows me to place 3 extra point into unleashed demons. at 3/3 it reduces the cd of meta by 1 min and at 6/6 allows for a 2 min reduction. is this doable in game? as I'd guess this would be quite strong for any 10 + minute fights and also handy for PvP or potentially mythic plus dungeons.

- - - Updated - - -

Technically you could build an entire mastery spec couldn't you? With how the lv110 talent for Demon Hunters scales in percentage with mastery percentage? Wouldn't that overweigh the value of crit at that point with that talent?

from what I've last heard crit is placed above even agility and synergies so well with fury generation that I don't think it'd ever fall from number 1 secondary. I could be wrong though, I'm not in the beta just observing

[Vanyali]

It's not above Agility; it's a little blow Agility.

You can do the three in UD trick with 3 UD relics, but you'd likely sacrifice massive +ilvl boosts because you're trying to stack them. Which would then reduce your damage overall.

[Ryanite]

It's not above Agility; it's a little blow Agility.

You can do the three in UD trick with 3 UD relics, but you'd likely sacrifice massive +ilvl boosts because you're trying to stack them. Which would then reduce your damage overall.

ahh yep, forgot about the ilvl increase to the weps

[Zyky]

from what I've last heard crit is placed above even agility and synergies so well with fury generation that I don't think it'd ever fall from number 1 secondary. I could be wrong though, I'm not in the beta just observing

Its hard to say with certainty and I've been testing it in beta, atm yes, crit is ahead. But I feel with enough mastery, you can make mastery your number 1 it just might not happen until raid gear.

[Vanyali]

Its hard to say with certainty and I've been testing it in beta, atm yes, crit is ahead. But I feel with enough mastery, you can make mastery your number 1 it just might not happen until raid gear.

Sims say otherwise with how mastery scales. It doesn't scale well, at all, so the amount of mastery you'd need is phenomenal and the amount you'd lose due to lower crit returns compounds the issue.

[Myta]

With crit being out best stat and with the legendary helm, expecting that most people will have most of the Chaos Strike increasing artifact talents by then I expect that Demonic will become the best once you have that helm. You'll be in and out of meta constantly landing huge Chaos Strikes.

I think it's for this reason they nerfed Eye Beam because they expect DH with this helm with Demonic and Demon Reborn to be doing ludicrous amounts of damage, especially to any boss that involves adds.

[8bithamster]

I am so confused with this class oO I am currently starting in Aszuna and stuff is just beating me to 50% without issues. What I do:

Builder
Builder
Eye Beam
Artifact ability
dump ability

and then spam dump/builder until dead

Now that works fine for 1 v 1 PVE fights. But as you know, that never happens

[Myta]

I am so confused with this class oO I am currently starting in Aszuna and stuff is just beating me to 50% without issues. What I do:

Builder
Builder
Eye Beam
Artifact ability
dump ability

and then spam dump/builder until dead

Now that works fine for 1 v 1 PVE fights. But as you know, that never happens

Make sure you have a bodyguard (set in your Order Hall table, Altruis or Kayn, Later you get Akama but I'd avoid him because he's a lag monster.) and you want Demonic Appetite while leveling. This is just me but I went Chaotic Cleave, Demonic Appetite, Momentum and I moved a lot. DH's are pretty damn squishy so you can actually pull more and use your mobility to your advantage. You can also use Blade Dance on the move as well, it's very effective for kiting.

Vengeful Retreat + Momentum is good for building Fury for Chaos Cleaves, Fel rush for collecting souls while doing damage. Also don't hestitate to pull more and use Blur, then stun when Blur drops, these are pretty short cool downs.

Demon Hunters are basically glass cannons, I personally find it fun the use my mobility to avoid damage while waiting for windows to burst down stuff. Also rejoice a bit cause you can die while leveling which we've not really had in years.

[jettzypher]

Technically you could build an entire mastery spec couldn't you? With how the lv110 talent for Demon Hunters scales in percentage with mastery percentage? Wouldn't that overweigh the value of crit at that point with that talent?

As mentioned already, crit is simply too good. It scales well and the fact that it refunds the resource cost of your most used ability, the more you have the better. Mastery is fun, especially the movement speed increase bit, but it simply does not scale as well. If it had a higher increase to chaos damage per point, then maybe. Unfortunately, it's still rather low currently.

Also rejoice a bit cause you can die while leveling which we've not really had in years

Well, to be fair, you could before if you didn't know what you were doing. And we all know many players don't. It is nice feeling as if the threat is real, more so than in the last few expansions.

[Slyre]

I just have to say, this thread has been very helpful and a nice read. I really appreciate all the work that people do and also Vanyalis videos have been nice to watch while waiting for a chance to get in to test things myself. I am facing a dilemma though I would much rather play Nelf, but my guild is horde.

[jettzypher]

Clearly, the answer to your problem is have your entire guild faction change. *thumbs up*

[Vanyali]

I just have to say, this thread has been very helpful and a nice read. I really appreciate all the work that people do and also Vanyalis videos have been nice to watch while waiting for a chance to get in to test things myself. I am facing a dilemma though I would much rather play Nelf, but my guild is horde.

I want to play Belf, but we're alliance.. clearly, we should just switch guilds!

[Myta]

As mentioned already, crit is simply too good. It scales well and the fact that it refunds the resource cost of your most used ability, the more you have the better. Mastery is fun, especially the movement speed increase bit, but it simply does not scale as well. If it had a higher increase to chaos damage per point, then maybe. Unfortunately, it's still rather low currently.


Well, to be fair, you could before if you didn't know what you were doing. And we all know many players don't. It is nice feeling as if the threat is real, more so than in the last few expansions.

I'd like it that there were serious contenders to Prepared and Demonic. Fel Blades became a bit better after the EB nerf, but I don't think EB will go live nerfed this much. I imagine a mastery heavy Chaos Blades build could be quite cool if Mastery were stronger and some of our other talents like Felblade did Chaos damage.

Since DH only has 2 specs, I don't think it's asking too much for Blizz to add some dev love to other talents in the Havoc tree to make them compete with a crit build.

I want to play Belf, but we're alliance.. clearly, we should just switch guilds!

If you don't change guilds just to play Belf, clearly you don't love Belf enough!

[Xenyatta]

I'm trying to understand something. My Metamorphosis says 3.67 second cooldown but whenever I use it, it counts down from a 5 minute CD. I'm so confused as to why.

[Vanyali]

I'm trying to understand something. My Metamorphosis says 3.67 second cooldown but whenever I use it, it counts down from a 5 minute CD. I'm so confused as to why.

Unleashed Demons is broken and doesn't properly go on the reduced cooldown.

[nox597]

What would you guys think if they added a talent that made Spectral Sight into a small dps cooldown?

Something like, "Spectral sight no longer breaks on dealing or taking damage, and your physical attacks now bypass armor for the duration."

It would add a button into the rotation, and buff Demon's Bite, Throw Glaive, and autoattack damage, while adding some RP flavor to the spec.

[BiggestNoob]

I want mastery to be stronger and for another ability or two to be useful in ST DPS. And instead of just flat nerfing EB, it could be made to have a more interesting mechanic, like starting at 765% AP and scaling up to 1500% AP at the edge of the beam or something.

[Slyre]

Clearly, the answer to your problem is have your entire guild faction change. *thumbs up*

You, I like you!

I want to play Belf, but we're alliance.. clearly, we should just switch guilds!

Yes this , also for us not to get latency issues you should move to Europe and I to USA, but hey appearances matter!

[Segerr]

What would you guys think if they added a talent that made Spectral Sight into a small dps cooldown?

Something like, "Spectral sight no longer breaks on dealing or taking damage, and your physical attacks now bypass armor for the duration."

It would add a button into the rotation, and buff Demon's Bite, Throw Glaive, and autoattack damage, while adding some RP flavor to the spec.

I hate the visual effect of Spectral Sight...