Getting rid of Heirlooms?

[Dormie]

Because this is exactly what happened with Blizzard removing flight in Draenor. They didn't even apply it game-wide, and people were unhappy with a change due to expectations for having something they've always had being forcibly changed/removed/left absent. Now we have a poll that shows there is very little interest in changing Heirlooms, and you want history to repeat itself by having Blizzard do something that will obviously have repercussions.

You can remove anything from the game and get the same amount of backlash flying got. That and a poll aren't indicative of anything. And Heirlooms need to be made less OP, not removed completely. Just like flying, something Blizz didn't get.

[Thimagryn]

Heirlooms are just a piece of the problem. They aren't what caused sub loss just a symptom of a bigger problem and that's convenience, Thimagryn.

It's a symptom to 25% of the people who polled here. To the rest of the 75%, it's absolutely fine.

This is more like vegetarianism. Your group is acting like vegetarians who can't seem to accept others eating meat, period. No one is forcing you to eat meat, but you feel you're missing out because you're being charged the same for a salad as for a steak. So your solution to this is to ban all meat off the menu because you see this as being the solution to your symptoms.

You can find different groups of people who are also vegetarians and eat along side them if it makes you more comfortable, but that doesn't satisfy you. We can even suggest there be vegetarian restaurants be an option, but that gets ignored. Instead of finding a compromisable solution, the goalposts are moved so that meat should be banned for non-related reasons, like obesity rates or humane treatment of animals. All in all, the problem has nothing to do with people eating meat in a restaurants; it's still all about the vegetarians who feel like they need special treatment. The 'symptoms' may be real, but the solution isn't. Not every meat eater is obese or treats animals cruelly. Even if vegetarians see it this way, it does not mean they are right to take away the choice to eat meat from everyone else.

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You can remove anything from the game and get the same amount of backlash flying got. That and a poll aren't indicative of anything. And Heirlooms need to be made less OP, not removed completely. Just like flying, something Blizz didn't get.

I agree that the poll isn't indicative of anything, other than general opinion. But it shows that general opinion doesn't believe Heirlooms are OP to the point they need to be nerfed or changed. I think that's a strong statement being made in this discussion, which is purely based on subjectivity.

Heirlooms are working as intended, as far as general opinion is concerned. Would it be better if they were nerfed? That's a purely subjective topic, because as far as I'm concerned, there is no clear problem with them. They're completely optional. Like I said before, there are already solutions in place that allow you to play with others in a heirloom-less environment. Yet no one here seems to substantiate any of that as a factor, rather taking the 'easy scapegoat' route of blaming Blizzard and anyone who argues against nerfs/change.

[Aeriedk]

Too many "I worked hard to get those looms so I could be lazy while leveling" answers. Looms are boring. I have them, they're upgraded. Take them away please. I like your ideas. Get rid of the looms but earn an experience boost not linked to gear in its place. He'll make it a toggle. That way you still get fun new gear.

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They're completely optional.

I hate when people say this. It's not completely optional. It's optional with strings attached. Wear them and be on a level playing field but have a significantly more boring leveling experience. Don't use them and have a quality leveling experience, BUT you will be at a disadvantage to the players whom which you play with around you.

Like I said, sure it's optional, but there are strings.

[endersblade]

Too many "I worked hard to get those looms so I could be lazy while leveling" answers. Looms are boring. I have them, they're upgraded. Take them away please. I like your ideas. Get rid of the looms but earn an experience boost not linked to gear in its place. He'll make it a toggle. That way you still get fun new gear.

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I hate when people say this. It's not completely optional. It's optional with strings attached. Wear them and be on a level playing field but have a significantly more boring leveling experience. Don't use them and have a quality leveling experience, BUT you will be at a disadvantage to the players whom which you play with around you.

Like I said, sure it's optional, but there are strings.

Actually, if all you do is solo quest, BoAs really aren't needed at all. I mean, pre-Legion, since it seems things are going to get buffed against us in Legion. But I have leveled several characters to cap level without heirlooms and had absolutely no issues at all. Quests dole out a decent array of gear now, post Cata. You'll stay fairly geared all the way up. Granted, if you hop into dungeons it could be an issue when everyone else is in BoAs, but the higher in level you get, the less BoAs matter.

I'd say that anything below level 60, and then anything that is a X1-X5 (so 61-65, 71-75, etc) are where BoAs really shine. But once you get out of those level ranges, BoAs don't really matter that much. And the X1-X5 blocks are only because of the massive stat jump between expansions. Things even out about mid expansion level and BoAs do as well.

[Dormie]

Heirlooms are optional like medicine is optional

[Eleccybubb]

Shoulders and Chest were fine tbh. Don't see why they added more when those 2 still over leveled you in zones.

[Bullettime]

I kind of like the system FFXIV uses where you get an XP bonus to jobs based on the current job versus your highest.

Just make it toggable in WoW, due to the nature of multiple characters and some may want to enjoy the full adventure, and voila.

[Thimagryn]

I hate when people say this. It's not completely optional. It's optional with strings attached. Wear them and be on a level playing field but have a significantly more boring leveling experience. Don't use them and have a quality leveling experience, BUT you will be at a disadvantage to the players whom which you play with around you.

Like I said, sure it's optional, but there are strings.

The stat difference between Blues and Heirlooms are so insignificant in the leveling process that the disadvantage is going to be the difference of a couple auto attacks in a minute-long fight. The weapon is probably the most significant upgrade, since it's not easy to come by blue weapons every level. I don't see why your enjoyment of the game should be impacted by the performance of others, especially when leveling content is already as easy as it is.

You see it as yourself being as a disadvantage. I see it as everyone else having an advantage over the content. There isn't an expectation for everyone to use Heirlooms while leveling, and it isn't stigmatized to the point where everyone leveling will spit on the non-heirloom user. When I say it's completely optional, it's because it is completely optional. You feeling like the strings are attached to you doesn't change anything. I've said time and time again, there are groups that are entirely dedicated to not using Heirlooms that you can join with so that this whole advantage thing is bypassed completely.

Project fucking sixty.

Hate all you want, but the solution has already been provided by the community. Don't like it, don't use it, and many people are playing exactly in this way (and more, like no-use of talents, mount use only at 40, etc). It's a widely recognized style of play that even Sodapoppin participates in. Heirlooms are completely optional, and this community is proof of it.

[Aeriedk]

Actually, if all you do is solo quest, BoAs really aren't needed at all. I mean, pre-Legion, since it seems things are going to get buffed against us in Legion. But I have leveled several characters to cap level without heirlooms and had absolutely no issues at all. Quests dole out a decent array of gear now, post Cata. You'll stay fairly geared all the way up. Granted, if you hop into dungeons it could be an issue when everyone else is in BoAs, but the higher in level you get, the less BoAs matter.

I'd say that anything below level 60, and then anything that is a X1-X5 (so 61-65, 71-75, etc) are where BoAs really shine. But once you get out of those level ranges, BoAs don't really matter that much. And the X1-X5 blocks are only because of the massive stat jump between expansions. Things even out about mid expansion level and BoAs do as well.

I get that, but I like to occasionally play with other people.

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Heirlooms are optional like medicine is optional

This is gold. Great way to explain how "optional" heirlooms are.

[Thimagryn]

Heirlooms are optional like medicine is optional

Which means your argument is "Medicine works too well, make it less effective so I don't feel tempted to use it".

[Pantomime]

I'm the only one who thinks that having almost the same gear from 1 to 90 level is kinda monotonic?

Transmogging heirlooms is 1g, so change their appearance to your hearts content.

[Idoru]

This is gold. Great way to explain how "optional" heirlooms are.

Nah, that's just pyrite.

[zaino]

I can't agree more, honestly.It's more like "Hey this fella invented a new vehicle which lets us travel faster than the horses we have without hassle, they should definitely ban it. Because in my opinion it's killing the joy of riding a horse"

"i dont want to gimp myself and i dont want to use heirlooms"

little did they know they cant have the cake and eat it too

[Pantomime]

Too many "I worked hard to get those looms so I could be lazy while leveling" answers. Looms are boring. I have them, they're upgraded. Take them away please. I like your ideas. Get rid of the looms but earn an experience boost not linked to gear in its place. He'll make it a toggle. That way you still get fun new gear.

I will never understand the anti-loom, anti-flying crowd. You'd like to take something from us because you have no self-control. If you don't want to loom. Don't. If you don't want to fly. Don't. Simple. Solved.

I hate when people say this. It's not completely optional. It's optional with strings attached. Wear them and be on a level playing field but have a significantly more boring leveling experience. Don't use them and have a quality leveling experience, BUT you will be at a disadvantage to the players whom which you play with around you.

Like I said, sure it's optional, but there are strings.

Mog them. 1g. Cheap. Simple. Solved.

[Deleted]

I'm the only one who thinks that having almost the same gear from 1 to 100 level is kinda monotonic? Whenever something drops from a dungeon or I get an item from the drop/quest I immediately sell it(or save it for the future T-mog, but that happens like... 0,5% of the time?). The same thing happens when something nice drop, you may think that you could sell that item for a nice amount of gold, but unfortunately almost everyone is running now with Heirlooms. What do you guys think about that?

Dont like them? Dont use them! "problem" solved!

You can ask me - But what with the faster leveling?
Simple solution: For every character you have at max level, you get +X% Experience bonus. (like ~15-30)

So people like me with 20 max toons get an advantage leveling another toon over other people with only 2 max chars why?....

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In a non-gaming example, let's look at steroids in baseball. If they were allowed, then you could very well say "Don't like them? Don't use them." BUT ... by not using steroids you are handicapping your own performance and your team's. Even the audience is affected. And then contracts and TV deals and advertising deals, etc etc etc.

Thats the worst and dumbest comparison Ive ever seen agaisnt looms. Leveling is NOT a competition.

[Zhira]

I would like the xp bonuses removed from the heirlooms and added as a toggleable feature. This way I could get increased leveling speed but still find usable items while questing or doing dungeon content.

Z.

[Bosen]

I like your idea. I'd get rid of heirlooms and refund the gold they're worth to those that already have them.

[FuxieDK]

I like your idea. I'd get rid of heirlooms and refund the gold they're worth to those that already have them.

Sounds like, you should have your school money refunded because you have clearly gotten rid of your wits..

[Aeriedk]

I will never understand the anti-loom, anti-flying crowd. You'd like to take something from us because you have no self-control. If you don't want to loom. Don't. If you don't want to fly. Don't. Simple. Solved.

Its not a self control thing its a they dynamically change the game thing. Its not as simply as if you don't like them don't use them when you have desire to play with other people. Either you cant help the group because you're not in looms, or you're going to get your ass kicked by this ally/horde because you're not in looms, etc., etc. I want things to come down to more than just looms. I worked hard and this long quest chain and worked to get this piece of gear vs. I paid for something at max level.

I get that not everyone will agree, but looms may have significantly reduced the lifespan of wow mr. 19 level 100 toons that likely had tons of help from looms and many likely would not have exist without them.

Mog them. 1g. Cheap. Simple. Solved.

I never said anything about looks.

[guerron]

Its not a self control thing its a they dynamically change the game thing. Its not as simply as if you don't like them don't use them when you have desire to play with other people. Either you cant help the group because you're not in looms, or you're going to get your ass kicked by this ally/horde because you're not in looms, etc., etc. I want things to come down to more than just looms. I worked hard and this long quest chain and worked to get this piece of gear vs. I paid for something at max level.

That still doesn't answer the question why other people have to play the game on your terms? If there was anykind of substantial demand for this you would find players who like to play that way, since you don't it is probably not really attractive to more than a handful people

I get that not everyone will agree, but looms may have significantly reduced the lifespan of wow mr. 19 level 100 toons that likely had tons of help from looms and many likely would not have exist without them.

So whats bad with s.o. having that many max lvl toons?