Impossible Torbjorn counter and Bastion abuse

[Raptar]

Good evening loves,

First of all, I do love this game. Really enjoying it, but the more I play, the more I see some flaws. Man o man, what I just encountered.... So unbelievable bad for my blood pressure and my life span. How people can play the game like this? Winning like this shouldn't be fun in my opinion, you don't even want to win like this. Really pathethic. I will explain it with an image I made. A little legenda:

1 (yellow) is a turret of a Torbjorn.
2 (yellow) is also a turret of another Torbjorn.
B (purple) is a Bastion.



So at point 1 and 2 were standing the Turrets, both from a Torbjorn. Turret one was behind a wall, uncounterable from our side without taking damage. Turret 2 was standing behind a ledge, here counts the same as for turret 1: uncounterable. At the orange B dot there was a Bastion, also not counterable without taking massive damage from the turrets, or him. I only just mentioned 3 heroes, so there are another 3 heroes on the defense side here. I thought it was a Pharah, a Junkrat and a Mercy. My question to you, whats your tactic for winning this game now?

In my opinion there isn't. It was so incredible hectic, unexplainable. If you just peeked for one second, if only a hair on your head went behind the corner you became a bullet sponge. I see many people complaining about Widowmaker, McGee or Bastion being overpowered, but did you guys met the nightmare from hell Torbjorn? What's the skill in those turrets, what do you need to do for it? You don't even have to aim. The thing is a freaking aimbot mini Bastion, with decent armor. Of course we could destroy one, but by the time we did, the second turret or lovely bird Bastion killed us. I don't make this topic just after one experience, I'm noticing this for quite some days and games now. They really need to do something about that automatic soulless no skill turret. It's like a bot, it shouldn't be in games.

Why I was talking about abuse in my post above is because we were winning this game pretty hard. Unfortunate you see this most of the time, when people are losing they always start to roll the same heroes and abuse them (Bastion, Torbjorn and Junkrat). I don't say Junkrat is OP, but with him spamming grenades all the time it really is impossible to even touch the ground. The floor is like lava, the little child game. Mine fields in North Korea are easier to walk through, blindfolded. But the most annoying thing: raping Bastion. Really, can we please forbid the following two things: Bastion camping as a turret on a payload, and Bastion camping near the spawnpoint at the beginning of a game. I find this the definition of cowardly. It reminds me of the CoD noobtubers and the huntards (not every hunter is, you know the ones I mean) from WoW. They need to find a passive mechanic ingame that automaticly counters this.

Long story short: this is not playing like it's intended to be. I also probaly forgot to mention some important points, likely because I'm very agitated right now. I'm interested what you guys or girls find of this.

Love,
Raptar

Edit: orange is purple now. Orange (so purple) is now B instead of 3 .

[xStevooo]

This is one of the easiest pushes because you can be behind the payload until it's around the corner and on the last stretch, tracer absolutely ruins campers if you know how to play, widowmaker should be sniping those turrets instantly, two peeks at max charge damage to take out number 1. Rein can charge bastion with a lucio ult or a mercy heal. Winston is an absolute god at diving a backline with his ability to wait until he's almost dead to pop his ultimate, or better yet have a rein and winston for final push - with a tracer diving the backline. You should easily be able to take them down, if a couple of them fall then mercy revives them and gg?
I've never had a problem and i come up against this setup a lot, the best way to play against a bastion/tor is to never let them setup, have two tracers skip the payload and go straight into the backline, when you kill them don't let them get into position keep pushing their spawn.

If you come up against this setup you need an aggressive line up, winston, lucio, tracers, reaper, soldier etc. Time your ultimates and it's easy - unfortunately a team that combines their abilities together can stomp almost anything.

Still struggling to pick off a bastion/tor setup and you have nobody on your team diving the backline, then just go Hanzo and play hard, save your ultimates for when they are setup, the range and damage is broken. Easy win

[Xkiller9000]

Tracer, Genji, Widow, Hanzo, done

[Reyvah]

How people can play the game like this? Winning like this shouldn't be fun in my opinion, you don't even want to win like this. Really pathetic.

A Bastion / double Torbjorn is not some ultimate master strategy that is unbeatable.
The biggest issue I see is teams sending low HP heroes into the fray expecting to live against two turrets. It's not going to happen. This is one of those situations where playing the hero and going in Rambo-style is ludicrous.

What champions did your team use?

In cases of defense going full "bunker mode", I've found a Reinhardt to be a fantastic bunker-breaker.

[baskev]

long story : THIS IS HOW IT IS INTENDED TO BE PLAYED. If you loose because of tactics your a sore loser. Or have bad team m8 or are a bad player.

How to counter this:
2+B : seeing as they are so close to each other: Ultimates from roadhoag, pharah, D.VA would do the trick. A well thrown ice bomb of mei also. and a fast tracer bomb also. A winstom jumpin in with a decent dps like mei, reaper would wreck those 2. A Roadhog that uses chain on bastion to pull him. and 2 other dps take care of turret nr2.

While turret nr 1 gets nuked by the rest. Make sure you have a mercy with her cooldown. After everything is dead. pop her cooldown.

little side not if they where on those spots they are easy killed by a junkrat to...they have bad line of sight there. And like someone else said. stay behind the payload and only turret on the left is a problem.

[destia]

Am I the only one seeing that Bastion dot that's supposed to be orange as purple ?

[Cairhiin]

In my opinion there are many ways to break that defense. Junkrat is a good option. Genji, Widowmaker, Hanzo, Pharah as well.

Am I the only one seeing that Bastion dot that's supposed to be orange as purple ?

Purple to me as well, though I am colorblind.

[Killadrix]

Fun fact: many classes such as Junkrat, Hanzo, and Genji and Winston can scale the wall to the right of 2 & B and fire down on them.

Exceptionally easy if your team has the other team distracted with a Rein push out front.

I'm not even sure why this is a thread.

[jackofwind]

So at point 1 and 2 were standing the Turrets, both from a Torbjorn. Turret one was behind a wall, uncounterable from our side without taking damage.
Love,
Raptar

Uncounterable? What a ridiculous statement. This push is easy since you can hide behind the payload.

Have you never picked up Junkrat? Bounce a grenade spam around the corner.

You put so much time and effort into this post that would have been better used getting a basic understanding of hero counters and strategies. So many people coming out of the woodwork that are just bad and want to blame the game instead of just learning.

[Phookah]

Good evening loves,

First of all, I do love this game. Really enjoying it, but the more I play, the more I see some flaws. Man o man, what I just encountered.... So unbelievable bad for my blood pressure and my life span. How people can play the game like this? Winning like this shouldn't be fun in my opinion, you don't even want to win like this. Really pathethic. I will explain it with an image I made. A little legenda:

1 (yellow) is a turret of a Torbjorn.
2 (yellow) is also a turret of another Torbjorn.
3 (orange) is a Bastion.



So at point 1 and 2 were standing the Turrets, both from a Torbjorn. Turret one was behind a wall, uncounterable from our side without taking damage. Turret 2 was standing behind a ledge, here counts the same as for turret 1: uncounterable. At the orange B dot there was a Bastion, also not counterable without taking massive damage from the turrets, or him. I only just mentioned 3 heroes, so there are another 3 heroes on the defense side here. I thought it was a Pharah, a Junkrat and a Mercy. My question to you, whats your tactic for winning this game now?

In my opinion there isn't. It was so incredible hectic, unexplainable. If you just peeked for one second, if only a hair on your head went behind the corner you became a bullet sponge. I see many people complaining about Widowmaker, McGee or Bastion being overpowered, but did you guys met the nightmare from hell Torbjorn? What's the skill in those turrets, what do you need to do for it? You don't even have to aim. The thing is a freaking aimbot mini Bastion, with decent armor. Of course we could destroy one, but by the time we did, the second turret or lovely bird Bastion killed us. I don't make this topic just after one experience, I'm noticing this for quite some days and games now. They really need to do something about that automatic soulless no skill turret. It's like a bot, it shouldn't be in games.

Why I was talking about abuse in my post above is because we were winning this game pretty hard. Unfortunate you see this most of the time, when people are losing they always start to roll the same heroes and abuse them (Bastion, Torbjorn and Junkrat). I don't say Junkrat is OP, but with him spamming grenades all the time it really is impossible to even touch the ground. The floor is like lava, the little child game. Mine fields in North Korea are easier to walk through, blindfolded. But the most annoying thing: raping Bastion. Really, can we please forbid the following two things: Bastion camping as a turret on a payload, and Bastion camping near the spawnpoint at the beginning of a game. I find this the definition of cowardly. It reminds me of the CoD noobtubers and the huntards (not every hunter is, you know the ones I mean) from WoW. They need to find a passive mechanic ingame that automaticly counters this.

Long story short: this is not playing like it's intended to be. I also probaly forgot to mention some important points, likely because I'm very agitated right now. I'm interested what you guys or girls find of this.

Love,
Raptar

Did anyone on the team switch to genji/tracer, possibly multiples of each, get in the back line and force them to either fight them or deal with your guys push up the street?
Not "uncounterable", just annoying.

[Coronius]

I don't see any orange, but I'm assuming he means the purple one.

The thing about Torbjörn is that his turret isn't going anywhere, so you know what to expect and when. I'd recommend one or two competent Junkrats, or any of the snipers/Pharah.

[Shadow Fox]

I don't see any orange, but I'm assuming he means the purple one.

The thing about Torbjörn is that his turret isn't going anywhere, so you know what to expect and when. I'd recommend one or two competent Junkrats, or any of the snipers/Pharah.

The Turret also has a limited range for it's autodetection. You can out range it as Blackwidow to destroy it. Genji can work, too. Hanzo can if you can get the lead right.

[enragedgorilla]

Am I the only one seeing that Bastion dot that's supposed to be orange as purple ?

Pinkish purple, yeah. Glad I wasn't the only one.

[Sesshomaru]

All I can think of, is:

"NOBODY EXPECTS THE MECHANIC INQUISITION!"

(It's a spoof of the old classic Monty Pyton Spanish Inquisition)

[Toppy]

The Turret also has a limited range for it's autodetection. You can out range it as Blackwidow to destroy it. Genji can work, too. Hanzo can if you can get the lead right.

In this case due to the rounded corner, cant snipe the turrets. Likewise room clearing heroes would die before getting a chance due to concentrated firepower, and a genji's deflect isnt nearly potent enough to deal with more than one.

This thread mentions many ways to counter this sort of setup as if it were one person. This is three setting it up. The amount of concentrated firepower and the terrain make it impossible for counters to work. Unless you marched a couple Reinhardts in. But thats also assuming the other team doesnt have anyone else.

The game does have a few unwinnable scenarios based on team synergy. And this would be well and good if there were ways for the otherside to cope.

[Cairhiin]

You don't need LoS with Junkrat. Just stack Junkrats.

[jackofwind]

In this case due to the rounded corner, cant snipe the turrets. Likewise room clearing heroes would die before getting a chance due to concentrated firepower, and a genji's deflect isnt nearly potent enough to deal with more than one.

This thread mentions many ways to counter this sort of setup as if it were one person. This is three setting it up. The amount of concentrated firepower and the terrain make it impossible for counters to work. Unless you marched a couple Reinhardts in. But thats also assuming the other team doesnt have anyone else.

The game does have a few unwinnable scenarios based on team synergy. And this would be well and good if there were ways for the otherside to cope.

One competent Junkrat ruins that entire setup. He doesn't even need to be visible to the enemy team, just bounce grenades off the walls.

[Raptar]

Don't worry guys, it indeed is purple. The first time I made it orange, but it wasn't the right colour with that background, so made it purple. Didn't really thought about it while posting.

However, I played Genji that game and without wanting to sound arrogant, I did a pretty good job. To say that my teammates were doing a bad job can be intended that I'm lacking self reflection. That also can be, but trust me, not in this one.

I literally raped the Bastion multiple times with the deflect ability. Eventually I could take the payload to 0.96m with using my ultimate, but the turrets fcked me up. The thing was, my teammates were standing back the whole time, just waiting anxious behind the corner. I tried to make a tactic via the chat, but people just don't respond. The teamplay in quick play mode really is low, calling it low even is too much. Again, I was very agitated.

Buuuuuut, if you were there with me in the game, you would have understand me better. Sometimes it's just impossible to put something in a "verbal jacket". Like now.

In this case due to the rounded corner, cant snipe the turrets. Likewise room clearing heroes would die before getting a chance due to concentrated firepower, and a genji's deflect isnt nearly potent enough to deal with more than one.

This thread mentions many ways to counter this sort of setup as if it were one person. This is three setting it up. The amount of concentrated firepower and the terrain make it impossible for counters to work. Unless you marched a couple Reinhardts in. But thats also assuming the other team doesnt have anyone else.

The game does have a few unwinnable scenarios based on team synergy. And this would be well and good if there were ways for the otherside to cope.

You pretty much put the finger on the right spot. It was impossible to sniper one of the turrets, since they weren't in line of sight (only if you were close). When there was one in line of sight, the other one could always fck you up.

Then again it is counterable, but you indeed need more then one person for it. Like Toppy says perfectly .

Edit: added a quote.

[Nyoken]

Get a good pharah and a junkrat in on those pesky turrets, can easily get above them on the bridge there without them hitting u, in turn you're able to hit them

[jackofwind]

/snip.

Should get better at Junkrat. He's literally built for safely eradicating fortified positions.