[BETA] Destruction Warlock Discussion

[Deleted]

I still hate Mana Tap. I also hate manually applying Immolate to everything before using anything else because Cataclysm still has a 1 minute CD... Why even take FnB when we spend 50% of the time Immolating, we never even get any Incinerates off :\

if you're immolating multiple targets for aoe when you have FnB then you're doing it wrong as you dont get the 60ish% dmg reduction from CR or the dmg reduction you get from the live version of FnB and with the 15% dmg buff(can be increased to somethig like 30% through relics) to incinerate and cast time reduction from artifact traits, not to mention incinerate got like a 40ish% buff in legion(basically think mist lvl incinerate aoe but with greatly increase dmg), you shouldnt need to cast immolate at all for aoe and if you feel hellbound to cast immolate eventho you dont need to, you can still use wreak havoc for it.

as for mana tap, i completely agree, its a crappy talent but it does have its merit(on demand extra dmg for a relatively big cost) even if it dooes feel a bit expensive for such a small gain but the cost can luckily be worked around as its based off current mana but its still additional gcds(i assume) that needs to be used, if it was off gcd i would be very happy.

[Baconeggcheese]

The more awkward thing is that if we're expected to sustain RoF for aoe we need to cast conflag during aoe. I guess backdraft is the idea there?

edit: jk I got it.

[Gaidax]

It's not, you are missing something. RoF will always be better than F&B Incinerate provided things stay in it.

[Baconeggcheese]

It's not, you are missing something. RoF will always be better than F&B Incinerate provided things stay in it.

Wait no, I'm retarded. My brain woke up.

[Deleted]

It's not, you are missing something. RoF will always be better than F&B Incinerate provided things stay in it.

uhm, unless im missing something, thats only the lord of flames version, if we look at FnB incinerate and RoF without buffs from talents/traits they deal the same dmg afaik and incinerate get more buffs than RoF but like i said, i might be missing something.

[Baconeggcheese]

uhm, unless im missing something, thats only the lord of flames version, if we look at FnB incinerate and RoF without buffs from talents/traits they deal the same dmg afaik and incinerate get more buffs than RoF but like i said, i might be missing something.

RoF does 400% sp per target, incinerate does 200% sp per target. RoF is just straight up double the dpct.

Fire and the flames helps incinerate a lil bit, but yeah.

[Deleted]

RoF does 400% sp per target, incinerate does 200% sp per target. RoF is just straight up double the dpct.

Fire and the flames helps incinerate a lil bit, but yeah.

i get that, but RoF is 400% sp over 8 secs, where as incinerate is 200% sp over 2 sec but yeah, you're correct that it deals more dmg pr. cast time but in terms of pure dps, FnB incinerate is superior, especially when you add a 15% dmg buff and a 10%+30% cast time reduction but tbh, its a moot point coz you'll do both whenever you can anyway, i would wish it was still instant tho.

btw does destro still have that passive that reduces the recharge timer of conflag based on haste?

[Baconeggcheese]

btw does destro still have that passive that reduces the recharge timer of conflag based on haste?

Last I checked yes.

[Entricks]

FnB incinerate is superior, especially when you add a 15% dmg buff and a 10%+30% cast time reduction

Rain of Fire can stack on itself now, plus it procs Sacrifice way more so the AoE potential is much higher than Incin. Plus taking FnB is useless on bosses. Sure if you don't have shards you Incin, but that's the reason we need to Immolate everything, so we can get more shards for more Rain of Fires. Not being able to spread Immolate properly is the reason the aoe is so clunky and inconsistent right now. A reduction in Cataclysm's CD or Immolate working off FnB would solve that problem.

[Baconeggcheese]

Rain of Fire can stack on itself now,

Oh? Is that changed on the beta? Haven't tested it in a while.

[Avikur]

Just out of interest which talents have people been finding best for questing/solo stuff (rares etc)?

[Deleted]

Just out of interest which talents have people been finding best for questing/solo stuff (rares etc)?

http://legion.wowhead.com/talent-cal...struction/MGHz


I tried Supremacy but the Infernal felt much squishier than the Voidwalker.

[Tehterokkar]

http://legion.wowhead.com/talent-cal...struction/MGHz


I tried Supremacy but the Infernal felt much squishier than the Voidwalker.

Infernal squishy? I can pull 4-5 mobs and my Infernal doesn't even lose his absorb.

[Gaidax]

It depends, Infernal is squishier than Voidwalker, but for sure tougher than any other demon and does quite a bit more damage too.

But yeah, things like soloing 3 man World Quests sometimes do require that survivability edge Voidwalker has over Infernal.

[Deleted]

Rain of Fire can stack on itself now, plus it procs Sacrifice way more so the AoE potential is much higher than Incin. Plus taking FnB is useless on bosses. Sure if you don't have shards you Incin, but that's the reason we need to Immolate everything, so we can get more shards for more Rain of Fires. Not being able to spread Immolate properly is the reason the aoe is so clunky and inconsistent right now. A reduction in Cataclysm's CD or Immolate working off FnB would solve that problem.

well i said for pure dps but if you're correct the yeah RoF will be very important for aoe. now if they would only add immolate to FnB or lower the cd of cataclysm, id be 1 happy camper.

[Dastey]

I am gonna level in a group of 5 but even if I was solo I would go something like this:

Tier 1: Backdraft or Shadowburn (probably shadowburn in a group)
Tier 2: Reverse Entropy
Tier 3: Demon Skin
Tier 4: Fire and Brimstone
Tier 5: Burning Rush
Tier 6: Grimoire of Sacrifice (I simply don't believe pets are worthwhile when leveling in 740+ gear)
Tier 7: Soul Conduit

Let me know what you think

[Deleted]

I am gonna level in a group of 5 but even if I was solo I would go something like this:

Tier 1: Backdraft or Shadowburn (probably shadowburn in a group)
Tier 2: Reverse Entropy
Tier 3: Demon Skin
Tier 4: Burning Rush
Tier 5: Grimoire of Sacrifice (I simply don't believe pets are worthwhile when leveling in 740+ gear)
Tier 6: Soul Conduit

Let me know what you think

Your pets are pretty decent tanks though. Mostly due to avoidance + Demon Skin, and not getting hit means no spell pushback. Infernal also does constant AoE (Not much, but it is something), and it has an AoE stun with 1 min cd. If the enemy mob is using some sort of AoE, your pets can tank it forever (The cheese is real).

I'd swap Entropy for Cataclysm, and Soul Conduit for Wreak Havoc. Being able to apply immolate to a lot of targets is great for shard generation, and being able to double your damage output (Roughly) on demand, as soon as there are 2 targets, is amazing. Especially with Shadowburn, since you can swap around havoc as needed, while burning targets down purely with shadowburn spam.

Any highend destro locks who'd care to tell me why I should use Chaos Bolt over Shadowburn? This is mostly from the perspective of wanting to be able to do other things than single target DPS, as well as taking Wreak Havoc since switching target while burning down a boss is simply too good to pass for me.

[bio347]

Any highend destro locks who'd care to tell me why I should use Chaos Bolt over Shadowburn? This is mostly from the perspective of wanting to be able to do other things than single target DPS, as well as taking Wreak Havoc since switching target while burning down a boss is simply too good to pass for me.

It does more damage.

[Deleted]

Any source on this? What kind of situation does it do more damage? Anything other than your word to go on?

[Kirroth]

Let me know what you think

Depends how you want to level. If you're rounding stuff up to AoE down, especially as a group, I'd take Cataclysm. If you're going solo and doing focused single target burns, Channel Demonfire plus Shadowburn might be a good choice.

- - - Updated - - -

Any source on this? What kind of situation does it do more damage? Anything other than your word to go on?

Basic math?

Shadowburn does 340% spellpower damage, so two does 680%, with a chance for 1020% or even 1360% if you get one or two crits. For the same Soul Shard cost a Chaos Bolt does 360% damage. Only it's always a crit, so that's actually 720% damage. Higher than two Shadowburns, but the Shadowburns have a decent chance to crit and do more, right? Wrong.

First of all, Chaos Bolt gets a damage buff from your Crit chance, which is a big boost. Then we start piling on the damage buffs from your artifact traits. Chaotic Instability adds 7.5% damage to Chaos Bolt. Flames of the Pit is another 4% damage, since Chaos Bolt is semi-chaos damage and counts as fire. Soulsnatcher has a chance to refund Soul Shards from Chaos Bolt, but not from a Shadowburn. On top of those, you'll eventually have legendary items like Magistrike Restraints or Feretory of Souls that (again) benefit Chaos Bolt and not Shadowburn.

I'm not saying Shadowburn is useless. Far from it. But its strength is in the utility effects, like being instant cast and getting a bonus SS on a kill. For pure DPS numbers it's always going to be a loss.