What I believe artifact weapons SHOULD have been.

[RedGamer030]

Only thing I would change are some of the choices - like Gorehowl for Arms Warrior, Ellemayne and Shalla'tor for Fury Warrior, Atiesh for Arcane Mage, etc. - you know, weapons that already have lore and story behind them instead of random weapons we never heard about until just now.

[Florena]

Only thing I would change are some of the choices - like Gorehowl for Arms Warrior, Ellemayne and Shalla'tor for Fury Warrior, Atiesh for Arcane Mage, etc. - you know, weapons that already have lore and story behind them instead of random weapons we never heard about until just now.

Well Atiesh probably was overlooked because it was already in the game from Vanilla WoW and may have been cheap to give every arcane mage a staff that took a lot of effort to get in the day and unlike a lot of other legendaries, you can't farm it anymore. Unless the pieces are on the BMAH but even then it'd be a fortune.

Gorehown I would agree with too, but it's also a weapon we can already get from Kharazhan. Though I DO think fury or arms should have been an axe tied to orc lore rather than all three being swords tied to humans or vrykul.

[LeftyDPS]

Don't discount that idea just because we're using lore artefacts now. This could be a system to test the waters before they throw their resources into far more customisable artefacts in the future. Think of this as being a test, just like the farm was for the garrison.

This I think is a good way of putting it. The likelihood is we will not have these weapons past one expansion, but the investment in them will mean just getting rid of them will annoy a lot of players.

As such, I fully expect next expansion us to use these to build even more powerful artifacts which have never been seen before.

[Magnagarde]

Very few of them are actually big name weapons in the story. Most artifacts seem to have been made up just for Legion. Sure, you have the Doomhammer and Ashbringer, and the fire mage sword that was in a novel or two.

Then you have things like garona's daggers, which while Garona is the quintessential rogue in Warcraft, before I don't recall her daggers being anything special. The Outlaw and Sub weapons were made up on the spot. The arcane and frost staffs are tied to lore characters, but weren't pre existing weapons with any weight to them. Off the top of my head only doomhammer, ashbringer and to a lesser extent the fire mage sword have had a role in the story prior. Most of these seem to be entirely new weapons. Tied to existing lore and characters, sure, but the bulk of them are new to the lore and haven't been mentioned before.

I know, you are completely right about Garona, Alleria and such characters' weapons in terms of being new, but its the fact that everyone gets it by default that ruins it. The fact that they haven't been mentioned before doesn't make up for the fact that there will be hundreds of thousands of them and that they will be the only ones in circulation.

[Florena]

I know, you are completely right about Garona, Alleria and such characters' weapons in terms of being new, but its the fact that everyone gets it by default that ruins it. The fact that they haven't been mentioned before doesn't make up for the fact that there will be hundreds of thousands of them and that they will be the only ones in circulation.

This is hardly a new issue though. There have been tons of named weapons before, even beyond legendaries. Sure it's to a new scale with everyone getting artifacts by default, but it's not really a new problem in terms of immersion or role playing. And even if they altered the lore and spun it as us making the artifacts instead that wouldn't suddenly free up more art resources, we'd likely still have a bunch of largely identical weapons with a few different skins and colorings that a lot of people will transmog over.

[Sylvaeres]

I'll be blunt, I don't like the idea of artifact weapons. I don't like the idea that everyone is going to be running around with the same weapons. I am aware there are different skins, but not more than 4-6 per weapon. Some will never get used because they are terrible, but even then the variation is going to be very, very limited. Not to mention that fact that it is just an awful lore travesty, in a world where we didn't need more destroyed lore.

What would have been a far better implementation of this system would have been the ability to forge our own new weapon, using essence or pieces of the current artifacts. We would be given the option during forging to adjust how the hilt looks, how the blade looks, how the handguard is designed, what type of weapon it is, a variety of colours, ect. Ultimately, we would have also been able to give it a name of our own choosing. Or at least, a template of options for names, like a list of prefixes and suffixes, and then connecting words if necessary (to prevent people from just calling it "Big black dildo"). They could have been implemented the exact same way, with a true feeling of custimization and the weapon having been forged for us.

I am a bit surprised that artifacts aren't getting the lashback that Garrisons got, but perhaps Garrisons didn't start getting hate until after people realized what they were. This system, in its current design, is going to end up the same way. Its going to be, ultimately, boring.

I disagree with everything you said there. I love the artifacts, and a few of the mages I've talked to all want to use different skins. DOn't speak for the majority when you are the minority

[Magnagarde]

This is hardly a new issue though. There have been tons of named weapons before, even beyond legendaries. Sure it's to a new scale with everyone getting artifacts by default, but it's not really a new problem in terms of immersion or role playing. And even if they altered the lore and spun it as us making the artifacts instead that wouldn't suddenly free up more art resources, we'd likely still have a bunch of largely identical weapons with a few different skins and colorings that a lot of people will transmog over.

Yeah. I think it would've been best to allow players to chose to "artifactialize" any weapon they wish. You have a weapon you like, you take it and turn it into your artifact. After that you get an artifact development tree like you gett them now and thats it. They should also allow you to change your artifact weapon for a huge amount of whatever, but also have to start again from scratch when it comes to development.

What this means is that, while there would still be a lot of weapons that are the same because players would pick the best looking ones, it would still be your own choice because you chose that weapon to be your artifact because you are your own character and personality. This way its just a forced default weapon that belonged to a well-known character that hundreds of thousands of other players also have.

[Mirishka]

Just because you wanted something else doesn't mean Artifact weapons are bad. Everyone ended up using the same weapons before anyway, at least this way the weapons we are all using are actually interesting and have some kind of progression behind them.

You made the post I wanted to make. Drats!

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I'll be blunt, I don't like the idea of artifact weapons. I don't like the idea that everyone is going to be running around with the same weapons. I am aware there are different skins, but not more than 4-6 per weapon. Some will never get used because they are terrible, but even then the variation is going to be very, very limited. Not to mention that fact that it is just an awful lore travesty, in a world where we didn't need more destroyed lore.

What would have been a far better implementation of this system would have been the ability to forge our own new weapon, using essence or pieces of the current artifacts. We would be given the option during forging to adjust how the hilt looks, how the blade looks, how the handguard is designed, what type of weapon it is, a variety of colours, ect. Ultimately, we would have also been able to give it a name of our own choosing. Or at least, a template of options for names, like a list of prefixes and suffixes, and then connecting words if necessary (to prevent people from just calling it "Big black dildo"). They could have been implemented the exact same way, with a true feeling of custimization and the weapon having been forged for us.

I am a bit surprised that artifacts aren't getting the lashback that Garrisons got, but perhaps Garrisons didn't start getting hate until after people realized what they were. This system, in its current design, is going to end up the same way. Its going to be, ultimately, boring.

Because every paladin having Ashbringer is totally different from thousands of warriors and paladins having Quel'Serrar in classic, right? Oh wait... it isn't.

[Florena]

Yeah. I think it would've been best to allow players to chose to "artifactialize" any weapon they wish. You have a weapon you like, you take it and turn it into your artifact. After that you get an artifact development tree like you gett them now and thats it. They should also allow you to change your artifact weapon for a huge amount of whatever, but also have to start again from scratch when it comes to development.

What this means is that there would still be a lot of weapons that are the same because players would pick the best looking ones, but it would still be your own choice because you chose that weapon to be your artifact. This way its just a forced default weapon.

If you do that though, that risks making them feel generic. While I can understand why some people don't like every paladin running around with Ashbringer, at the same time having story and lore tied to the artifacts makes them feel more epic and meaningful in terms of a weapon to help you push back the Legion. Sure there are lore issues when you take other players into account, but that's just an issue with the game overall and not specific to artifacts. Everyone gets the same farm, the same garrison position, the same legendaries, everyone does the same quests and kills the same raid bosses, everyone has the same position in the class order halls.

Looking at the grand scheme of things, I don't think it'd be worth the trade off stripping the lore away from the unique artifacts we have just to make it fit better into a multiplayer story, when the game's entire story as a whole doesn't do that anyway in any other area.

[Dread Pirate Phayde]

Even if we got to forge our own weapons there'd be a limited number of final looks so everyone would still end up running around with the same stuff. As it stands with xmog it at least opens us up to a decade worth of some variety, and at least we're able to xmog them, Blizz could just have easily made that not possible. And just because people disagree with you, it doesn't make them wrong and you right, just like it's their opinion that it's a cool idea, it's only your opinion that they're bad.

[Magnagarde]

If you do that though, that risks making them feel generic. While I can understand why some people don't like every paladin running around with Ashbringer, at the same time having story and lore tied to the artifacts makes them feel more epic and meaningful in terms of a weapon to help you push back the Legion. Sure there are lore issues when you take other players into account, but that's just an issue with the game overall and not specific to artifacts. Everyone gets the same farm, the same garrison position, the same legendaries, everyone does the same quests and kills the same raid bosses, everyone has the same position in the class order halls.

Looking at the grand scheme of things, I don't think it'd be worth the trade off stripping the lore away from the unique artifacts we have just to make it fit better into a multiplayer story, when the game's entire story as a whole doesn't do that anyway in any other area.

Everything you wrote is correct, but essentially its a huge lore paradox because every hero has the same weapon which is practically impossible. They went from timetravel to alternate realities in order to duplicate characters to a complete duplication of artifact weapons by the thousands.

This certainly is a paradox and a story killer.

[Florena]

Everything you wrote is correct, but essentially its a huge lore paradox because every hero has the same weapon which is practically impossible. They went from timetravel to alternate realities in order to duplicate characters to a complete duplication of artifact weapons by the thousands.

This certainly is a paradox and a story killer.

When looking at the story from a multiplayer standpoint, yes, but it's written from a single player stand point where YOU are the big important hero. And if this was an issue specific to artifacts then I would agree with you that maybe we should make them more generic and not have all these people getting the same named lore weapons, but as I showed above, this is an issue that seeps into every facet of the game, so if they're going to do artifacts why not go all out with it when there's still a thousand other areas where lore and gameplay don't mesh regardless? Just how many champions did Khadgar make rings for? Just how many champions helped defeat Deathwing? The only thing different about artifacts is, like garrisons before them, they're mandatory. That's the only thing that sets artifacts apart from thousands of people having illidan's warglaives.

[Magnagarde]

When looking at the story from a multiplayer standpoint, yes, but it's written from a single player stand point where YOU are the big important hero. And if this was an issue specific to artifacts then I would agree with you that maybe we should make them more generic and not have all these people getting the same named lore weapons, but as I showed above, this is an issue that seeps into every facet of the game, so if they're going to do artifacts why not go all out with it when there's still a thousand other areas where lore and gameplay don't mesh regardless? Just how many champions did Khadgar make rings for? Just how many champions helped defeat Deathwing? The only thing different about artifacts is, like garrisons before them, they're mandatory. That's the only thing that sets artifacts apart from thousands of people having illidan's warglaives.

I know, as I said, you're making good points and its all right. Its just that it wasn't done at this scale and it wasn't given this much importance untill Legion. Sure, there was a 2% chance to get that legendary bow from Kil'jaeden in TBC and there are lots of people with Sulfuras or Thunderfury, but those were never the focal point of an entire expansion and not something you are mandated to use/see/upgrade/talk about wherever and whenever. They were achievement symbols and were owned by a small few. While this paradox didn't poke you into the eyeballs in previous expansions, now it literally forces itself onto everything.

You're completely right about it, but the way I feel about it is that it went overboard with this expansion. Like really overboard. Others probably like it, I don't know.

[Flurryfang]

I'll be blunt, I don't like the idea of artifact weapons. I don't like the idea that everyone is going to be running around with the same weapons. I am aware there are different skins, but not more than 4-6 per weapon. Some will never get used because they are terrible, but even then the variation is going to be very, very limited. Not to mention that fact that it is just an awful lore travesty, in a world where we didn't need more destroyed lore.

What would have been a far better implementation of this system would have been the ability to forge our own new weapon, using essence or pieces of the current artifacts. We would be given the option during forging to adjust how the hilt looks, how the blade looks, how the handguard is designed, what type of weapon it is, a variety of colours, ect. Ultimately, we would have also been able to give it a name of our own choosing. Or at least, a template of options for names, like a list of prefixes and suffixes, and then connecting words if necessary (to prevent people from just calling it "Big black dildo"). They could have been implemented the exact same way, with a true feeling of custimization and the weapon having been forged for us.

I am a bit surprised that artifacts aren't getting the lashback that Garrisons got, but perhaps Garrisons didn't start getting hate until after people realized what they were. This system, in its current design, is going to end up the same way. Its going to be, ultimately, boring.

.... You know the weapen would either look like shit or it would still look the same. Making a "make your own weapon" system requires A LOT of work, for very little reward. Not to surprise you here, but many players don't really care about what their weapon looks like.
Its not supposed to be a program like Garrisons, its supposed to be like the improved abilities, which we got through leveling in WoD. The weapons will work as a powerscaling system, which powers us up during the first months of Legion.

Also, i would get tired real fast of making new weapens each time i had to make an alt. Something, which is hyping me up for making more alts, is actually, that these premade weapens are more awesome, then something i could make by myself. I am not a designer and neither is the large majority of players.

Transmorg is getting a completly new overhall, making it much easier to transmorg into the items, which you want. The weapon is not gonna look like it does for long, so don't worry and just transmorg it on the first day. You might say, that it is on the badness-lvl of the Garrison, and i would say that you are very very wrong!.

[Calfredd]

That's still the same as BiS weapons, though. Sure, you can use different weapons as it stands now but you're only hindering yourself in-so-doing.

Oh no I'm not playing any classes that use daggers either now or will in Legion. I was just sort of using it as an example. It is true I dislike most daggers in-game though.

[Florena]

I know, as I said, you're making good points and its all right. Its just that it wasn't done at this scale and it wasn't given this much importance untill Legion. Sure, there was a 2% chance to get that legendary bow from Kil'jaeden in TBC and there are lots of people with Sulfuras or Thunderfury, but those were never the focal point of an entire expansion and not something you are mandated to use/see/upgrade/talk about wherever and whenever. They were achievement symbols and were owned by a small few. While this paradox didn't poke you into the eyeballs in previous expansions, now it literally forces itself onto everything.

You're completely right about it, but the way I feel about it is that it went overboard with this expansion. Like really overboard. Others probably like it, I don't know.

I can see where you're coming from and why people would be bothered by it, I guess I'm just used to looking the other way when game mechanics clash with lore after years of RPing and working my way around things like this, just a difference of opinion I guess.

[Deleted]

I think custom Artifacts would have been cooler for RP-Servers.

[Deleted]

I thought this topic is about what weapons that didn't make it as Artifacts and should have.

Ok now it is. I will start:

Gorehowl for Arm Warrior.

[Florena]

I think custom Artifacts would have been cooler for RP-Servers.

Yeah but us RPers are a minority, blizz isn't going to make key expansion features around catering to RPers over the general playerbase.

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I thought this topic is about what weapons that didn't make it as Artifacts and should have.

Ok now it is. I will start:

Gorehowl for Arm Warrior.

While I think it's a shame not one of the warrior weapons was orc related, Gorehowl itself is already in the game, both regular and a corrupted form.

[Deleted]

Yeah but us RPers are a minority, blizz isn't going to make key expansion features around catering to RPers over the general playerbase.

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While I think it's a shame not one of the warrior weapons was orc related, Gorehowl itself is already in the game, both regular and a corrupted form.

Bleh, so is Ashbringer.