Attunements are Back! - Very good change

[Kolvarg]

Honestly I think it's a stupid change, but that's me. Yes I did the attunements in BC. All these attunements are is a roadblock to do something. They don't accomplish anything other than gate it for some people. People aren't going to do because it's fun. They will do it because they want what is behind the gate. Attunements while sounding nice is nothing but irritation to most end users. It's like requiring proving grounds to do heroics. It wasn't hard or impossible, just another stupid thing to do to get to Point B that wasn't necessary to start with.

"All content is is a roadblock to something. They don't accomplish anything other than gate it for some people. People aren't going to do dungeons, or raids, or pvp, because it's fun. They wil do it because they want the gear that is behind the gate. Remove content, just give us the gear directly!"

Yes I know, not exactly the same thing, but certainly the same logic.

[thilicen]

It would actually be more impressive (yeah, you know) if you could at least post these threads when the topics are still fresh.

[Aucald]

You are whining about the Karazhan key attunement? I thought that attunement was fun and easy. You didn't even have to step foot into a heroic dungeon to do it either (aka no revered rep req to get attuned to Karazhan).

Make raid attunements like Karazhan, make them account wide, and thats a winning formula!

Whining? No, the old Karazhan attunement was pretty cool the first time I did it on my main. Having to do it over and over again, or help others do it, started to get kind of annoying fast, though. The legacy attunements quickly became barriers to entry for anyone who weren't present for the first weeks of a given content block, which is why the developers first added catch-up mechanics to them and then did away with altogether. The Legion model works a bit better because it's part of the given event curve in any sense, meaning most people will collect them as a matter of course.

[Peachpies]

As long as the attunements require skill and not time/money, then I'm all up for it to keep donalds out of pugs.

All that is required is time

[TheTaurenOrc]

But I thought exclusive content for the elite was a bad thing!?!?

[Cien]

I shall bookmark this, just like the "Hooray, finally hard heroics" in Cata and come back to you. Just clarify my position on attunements: I did them in TBC and the way they were done it was atrocious when your raid guild lost members and had to go back to previous tiers to attune new members. I am okay with attunements being personal (solo - or solved in your 5 man) and not depending on a shit ton of people helping you. And if they are as complex as in TBC, they better be accountwide.

don't be so dramatic, even BWL and MC were quite easy to do considering everyone wanted to run BRD and UBRS

[Lucetia]

"All content is is a roadblock to something. They don't accomplish anything other than gate it for some people. People aren't going to do dungeons, or raids, or pvp, because it's fun. They wil do it because they want the gear that is behind the gate. Remove content, just give us the gear directly!"

Yes I know, not exactly the same thing, but certainly the same logic.

Eh, that's just taking what I said and putting a twist on it :P My whole point was that people aren't going to do attunements because they enjoy them. They just want to do the dungeons behind them. Attunements in this case don't serve any purpose. You don't do anything special, you don't gain anything special. It's just completing content and moving on.

Dungeons, raids or pvp are actually extra activities where you do things different and are actual activities that are repeatable and give a reward each time.

My post was in no way of correlating the fact of "Give us gear!", but nice twisting attempt

[Jaylock]

Still required 2 keys to enter normal or a rogue and Black Morass required Escape from Durnholde to be complete. Sounds like a pain in the ass just for a 10 man raid tbh.

http://wow.gamepedia.com/The_Master%27s_Key

See this is the mentality of the "gimmie gimmie gimmie!" generation.

If its not dealt to you on a free silver platter with epics hanging off it, you consider it a "pain in the ass"

Doing content, to do other content.

A journey.

The whole idea of one must be worthy to enter these gates.... Or better yet, one must pass a set of challenges before they can enter these gates...

Even games like Zelda, Mario Brother, Final Fantasy had attunements... You couldn't kill bowser before completing levels before him. You couldn't kill Gannon before killing other bosses in other dungeons before him...

Why is this concept all of a sudden foreign when it comes to an MMO?

- - - Updated - - -

Whining? No, the old Karazhan attunement was pretty cool the first time I did it on my main. Having to do it over and over again, or help others do it, started to get kind of annoying fast, though. The legacy attunements quickly became barriers to entry for anyone who weren't present for the first weeks of a given content block, which is why the developers first added catch-up mechanics to them and then did away with altogether. The Legion model works a bit better because it's part of the given event curve in any sense, meaning most people will collect them as a matter of course.

You see? Even you thought the attunement was fun / pretty cool when you first did it. Make a similar attunement process account wide, and we have a winning formula.

[Deleted]

Fwiw, the only complex attunements that stayed for any period of time were the TK/Hyjal ones... and the thing about those was that most of it was solo.

The SSC Attunement was killing Nightbane(10man) and Gruul (25 man)
The TK Attunement was doing the Shadowmoon Valley Chain(mostly solo with a 5 man group part at the end)-->3 trials in 5 man heroic dungeon(Shattered Halls, Arcatraz, Shadow Labyrinth,Streamvaults) and killing Magtheridon(25 man)
The Hyjal Attunement was you killing Lady Vashj in SSC(25 man) and Kael'thas in TK (25 man)
The BT Attunement was you killing Fathom Lord Karethress in SSC(25 man), Al'ar in TK(25 man) and the Lich in Hyjal(25 man)+ like 5 or so solo quests.

The SSC and TK Attunements were removed when BT was released. The BT and Hyjal Attunements were removed when Sunwell was released.


I hate the "process" to attune to Arcway and Court of Stars. There's really nothing interesting about it, just a boring/repetitive grind that's capped. I also think the dungeons themselves are rather underwhelming. I really don't see what Blizzard sees in Court of Stars for example.

[Jaylock]

But I thought exclusive content for the elite was a bad thing!?!?

The legion attunements and the requirement to have to form your own group hardly constitutes "exclusive content for the elite."

In fact, this is small group content for the very casual playerbase.

- - - Updated - - -

The SSC Attunement was killing Nightbane(10man) and Gruul (25 man)
The TK Attunement was doing the Shadowmoon Valley Chain(mostly solo with a 5 man group part at the end)-->3 trials in 5 man heroic dungeon(Shattered Halls, Arcatraz, Shadow Labyrinth,Streamvaults) and killing Magtheridon(25 man)
The Hyjal Attunement was you killing Lady Vashj in SSC(25 man) and Kael'thas in TK (25 man)
The BT Attunement was you killing Fathom Lord Karethress in SSC(25 man), Al'ar in TK(25 man) and the Lich in Hyjal(25 man)+ like 5 or so solo quests.

The SSC and TK Attunements were removed when BT was released. The BT and Hyjal Attunements were removed when Sunwell was released.

And thats how it ought to be, but make them account wide. And straight up remove them as the next tier comes out.

[Nevardcire]

people who complain about the wow attunements make me laugh. they only took a little bit of time to acquire, that's about it. anyone who complains about any of the attunements in wow has no idea what a time sink or effort is. ever grind out a vex thal key? ever run through planar progression? how about GoD progression? ever camp a mob for days on end, only to have him spawn and not drop the item you needed for your epic weapon? or have the mob stolen on you by some jerk with better gear? personally, i welcome having to do attunements because to me, that shows that the people who are there want to be there. even though it's just a little more requirement on the player's part, it's at least SOMETHING that indicates that the person has taken the time to put in more effort to be where they are

[kary]

The SSC Attunement was killing Nightbane(10man) and Gruul (25 man)
The TK Attunement was doing the Shadowmoon Valley Chain(mostly solo with a 5 man group part at the end)-->3 trials in 5 man heroic dungeon(Shattered Halls, Arcatraz, Shadow Labyrinth,Streamvaults) and killing Magtheridon(25 man)
The Hyjal Attunement was you killing Lady Vashj in SSC(25 man) and Kael'thas in TK (25 man)
The BT Attunement was you killing Fathom Lord Karethress in SSC(25 man), Al'ar in TK(25 man) and the Lich in Hyjal(25 man)+ like 5 or so solo quests.

The SSC and TK Attunements were removed when BT was released. The BT and Hyjal Attunements were removed when Sunwell was released.

Okay, let me rephrase then.
Noone but bleeding edge guilds were blocked by TK/SSC attunements. Noone.

[Nakotsu]

This is one change that i'm super excited about, and I hope it continues to grow as people get used to attunements again.

For me, and many people I know, they LOVE this change because it brings back a sense of accomplishment, and goals to achieve which rewards you with more content. More content is always welcomed. I loved every time I was able to get my rep with TBC factions up to revered because it meant more content was opened up to me!

The two new dungeons in in Legion are a great step in setting up more attunements in future patchs and expansions. I also love the fact that these two dungeons are mythic only, hence taking them out of the auto queue for LFD. Only those who really want to be there, will actually be there because:

a) they got themselves attuned, and

b) they joined or formed a group to venture into them.

Having rewards for those who want to put in a little more effort than press a UI button I think is LONG overdue, and it seems as though the community at large is in support of this decision, case in point:

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20745115631

(community upvotes and support for the change)

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20745136057

(downvotes, combating one of the few special little guys who cried over this)


Overall A+ on Blizzards part. Just another reason why Legion (and hopefully future expansions) will be awesome

Regarding the Attunement process for the 2 dungeons:

In the next beta build, both Arcway and Court of Stars will only be available as Mythic dungeons, unlocked at an appropriate point midway through the main Suramar questline. And in hopefully the build after that, you'll see a few extra items spicing up the loot tables of those dungeons as an extra attraction once they're unlocked. Their Normal and Heroic versions were already far less likely to be seen, due to queue mechanics, and this change is aimed at clarifying the role of these dungeons as endgame unlocked content.

It's crucial to remember that while the label "Mythic" may conjure up visions of hardcore raiding and may seem intimidating for those who haven't yet tried them, the main difference between Heroic and Mythic dungeons lies in the expected item level (810 vs. 830ish) and the fact that there is no random matchmaking available for the latter. An organized group of 5 players with experience and gear from Heroic dungeons should find success when venturing into Mythic. Higher levels of Mythic, accessed via Keystones, are where the major challenges lie.

I dont think you understand what they are saying its not a attunement its just you need to do a certain area in order for it to unlock And no attunements were a bloody pain in the __________________ thats why they were removed more then likely this will too as time goes on.

[Jaylock]

Honestly I think it's a stupid change, but that's me. Yes I did the attunements in BC. All these attunements are is a roadblock to do something. They don't accomplish anything other than gate it for some people. People aren't going to do because it's fun. They will do it because they want what is behind the gate. Attunements while sounding nice is nothing but irritation to most end users. It's like requiring proving grounds to do heroics. It wasn't hard or impossible, just another stupid thing to do to get to Point B that wasn't necessary to start with.

I disagree with you. I quite enjoy the journey and figuring out what i need to do next to be able to enter the next tier of content.

Its like, what fun is a roadtrip if you are just instantly teleported to each sight along your way? You get to chat with your friends, make jokes, see things you otherwise wouldn't have ever saw if you were teleported to your destination.

[Lucetia]

I disagree with you. I quite enjoy the journey and figuring out what i need to do next to be able to enter the next tier of content.

Its like, what fun is a roadtrip if you are just instantly teleported to each sight along your way? You get to chat with your friends, make jokes, see things you otherwise wouldn't have ever saw if you were teleported to your destination.

Except there was absolutely nothing in my post you quoted about being teleported or of the sort.

[Jaylock]

I dont think you understand what they are saying its not a attunement its just you need to do a certain area in order for it to unlock And no attunements were a bloody pain in the __________________ thats why they were removed more then likely this will too as time goes on.

In a completely optional max level zone, with little to no item power being given.

Yeah id call that an attunement. Attunements back in the day consisted of quest chains, and killing bosses in dungeons / raids. So yeah from that perspective they were more involved in TBC for example, but at least this is the first real step back towards making more content unlockable in the future.

Theres just something about having the right key to open a treasure chest and getting all the spoils inside!

- - - Updated - - -

Except there was absolutely nothing in my post you quoted about being teleported or of the sort.

Oh i see.. you took me literally.. let me make it easier for you to understand:

Teleport in my analogy is comparable to having 0 attunement and just being able to walk straight into the max level raid without having to do anything first to get there.

[Derpleton]

I just want more dungeons like this, similar to how in BC we had multiple dungeons using the same aesthetics, I would love to see multiple dungeons located in one area but having one or more of them being unlockable.

[Pull My Finger]

Harder dungeons are always good.

Attunements are completely "whatever". Whether they're in the game or not is completely uninteresting. If they're there, they don't add anything to the game, but they're not bothersome either. If they're not there, nothing is taken away from the game. Much ado about nothing.

Dungeons not being queueable is the stupidest idea since drinking battery acid.

[Deleted]

I didn't play before Wrath, so I never experienced attunements myself. I am curious to see how this all plays out.

I'm open to the idea of having to work to access gated problem. At the beginning of the expansion, anyway. I'm unsure if it'll just feel more like a chore six months into the expansion, and deter me from levelling and gearing alts.

[purebalance]

This is one change that i'm super excited about, and I hope it continues to grow as people get used to attunements again.

For me, and many people I know, they LOVE this change because it brings back a sense of accomplishment, and goals to achieve which rewards you with more content. More content is always welcomed. I loved every time I was able to get my rep with TBC factions up to revered because it meant more content was opened up to me!

The two new dungeons in in Legion are a great step in setting up more attunements in future patchs and expansions. I also love the fact that these two dungeons are mythic only, hence taking them out of the auto queue for LFD. Only those who really want to be there, will actually be there because:

a) they got themselves attuned, and

b) they joined or formed a group to venture into them.

Having rewards for those who want to put in a little more effort than press a UI button I think is LONG overdue, and it seems as though the community at large is in support of this decision, case in point:

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20745115631

(community upvotes and support for the change)

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20745136057

(downvotes, combating one of the few special little guys who cried over this)


Overall A+ on Blizzards part. Just another reason why Legion (and hopefully future expansions) will be awesome

Regarding the Attunement process for the 2 dungeons:

In the next beta build, both Arcway and Court of Stars will only be available as Mythic dungeons, unlocked at an appropriate point midway through the main Suramar questline. And in hopefully the build after that, you'll see a few extra items spicing up the loot tables of those dungeons as an extra attraction once they're unlocked. Their Normal and Heroic versions were already far less likely to be seen, due to queue mechanics, and this change is aimed at clarifying the role of these dungeons as endgame unlocked content.

It's crucial to remember that while the label "Mythic" may conjure up visions of hardcore raiding and may seem intimidating for those who haven't yet tried them, the main difference between Heroic and Mythic dungeons lies in the expected item level (810 vs. 830ish) and the fact that there is no random matchmaking available for the latter. An organized group of 5 players with experience and gear from Heroic dungeons should find success when venturing into Mythic. Higher levels of Mythic, accessed via Keystones, are where the major challenges lie.

They aren't really the traditional attunements though or so it seems. It's seems like basically it's just locked until you complete up to X line. This is more similar to like requiring normal before heroic tbh.

The attunements I liked were where you had to gather specific items from raids/dungeons/the world to enter on top of the actual quests.