[7.0] New Paladin Abilities and Talents

[Crackalackin]

So eh, does ES/JV get reasonable at 110? 360k crits on the PTR seem kind of stupid when I have 288k health.

Kind of disappointing how the level 45/75 tiers are almost useless on any kind of boss fight.

Edit: ES as well, ES->BoW+CS>Judge>HoJ>JV. Just did 700k to a mob in a 2 second window.

[Biral Sunherald]

So eh, does ES/JV get reasonable at 110? 360k crits on the PTR seem kind of stupid when I have 288k health.

Kind of disappointing how the level 45/75 tiers are almost useless on any kind of boss fight.

Edit: ES as well, ES->BoW+CS>Judge>HoJ>JV. Just did 700k to a mob in a 2 second window.

That's ES's purpose, to really ramp up the burst damage. When our Judge window was 6/6 and we specced tFoJ, you would build to 3 HP, use ES, build to 5, Judge, then TV->CS->TV and ES would go off right before the first TV. It's huge burst damage and, if it were to be maintained, one would need to stick to that rotation. In doing so, it fills our rotation with downtime and some times when BoJ is up and we're at 4HP, giving us the choice to waste a HP, wait for CS, or go ahead and Judge before ES hits.

TL;DR: ES tries to change our rotation and succeeds; however, it does so by making the rotation clunky as !@#$.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Seeing two threads about Ret pop up in the PTR forum made me giggle. Teehee


It's still not good but not nearly as bad as it could of been. Meh...best to keep giving feedback as usual.

[Taeldorian]

@Nemmar No, the two second window allows you to get 3 without procs. Just did it a few minutes ago. I can squeeze it in with a second left it seems from testing repeatedly.

[Ashelorh]

So... i finally tried the spec on the PTR... and i must admit. I feel a bit angry at the alpha testers for having been way way too lenient on this in the beggining.

There's been a ton of feedback. It's been ignored. Blame Blizzard, not the testers.

[Dauntless86]

Some of us tried calling it a pile of crap, but people who couldn't even test it kept saying it'll be alright with 'tweaks' etc etc

If it makes you feel better I repeatedly summited feedback in the alpha that the spec was 'a degenerative mess.' But I guess all that Equality publicity was just louder.

Even if it were viable it's not fun, the spec has been shot in the foot ( and maybe the brain).

"Viable means f@#%-all if the spec's not fun" has been the bottom line issue since Beta opened. They can do as much number tuning as they like. HP combined with a damage window is hot garbage.

[Deleted]

@Nemmar No, the two second window allows you to get 3 without procs. Just did it a few minutes ago. I can squeeze it in with a second left it seems from testing repeatedly.

I tested on a PTR premade with 2 or 3% haste. It might be that with another 10% you can squeeze it in there. Once i can copy my Paladin i will test again. But even if we get 3 in there, the rotation is still an unnaceptable mess of downtime and strikes that don't line up.

[Ulthane]

Or Judgement could put the buff on us, and this artificial impairment wouldn't exist to begin with?
Or am I out of my mind with such high demands?

I would imagine that is too high of a demand for them ._.

[Snegovik]

I would imagine that is too high of a demand for them ._.

It is not too high, it is simply un acceptable, @Storm the Sorrow you should know better Ret can never be a viable spec, it alw has to be average or shit =) stop asking for Miracles, Santa does not exist =)

[Aeluron Lightsong]

It is not too high, it is simply un acceptable, @Storm the Sorrow you should know better Ret can never be a viable spec, it alw has to be average or shit =) stop asking for Miracles, Santa does not exist =)

I think Ret was usually viable in most cases. Super high end..............NOPE GIT GUD SON.


Seriously though Blizz disappointed me. First time to




*Sniffle*

[Snegovik]

I think Ret was usually viable in most cases. Super high end..............NOPE GIT GUD SON.


Seriously though Blizz disappointed me. First time to




*Sniffle*

i was talking from PvP pov, hence mentioning Storm, since both of us are PvP brothers in arms =). Even in wrath when Rets were at our best, we were not best dps class in arena, i remb Arms or Prot wars with full Armo pen, or Destro/Elem/Hpal who could global a Ret from procs alone without popping any cds (till this day i remb when facing that comp as Cupid, all 3 of my team, had to pillar hump till our CDs came up so that we wouldnt get globaled on open)

To me being viable is an ability to compete in grand finals @ Blizzcon. Paladin is only dps class that never got even to Semi-Finals =((

[Aeluron Lightsong]

i was talking from PvP pov, hence mentioning Storm, since both of us are PvP brothers in arms =). Even in wrath when Rets were at our best, we were not best dps class in arena, i remb Arms or Prot wars with full Armo pen, or Destro/Elem/Hpal who could global a Ret from procs alone without popping any cds (till this day i remb when facing that comp as Cupid, all 3 of my team, had to pillar hump till our CDs came up so that we wouldnt get globaled on open)

To me being viable is an ability to compete in grand finals @ Blizzcon. Paladin is only dps class that never got even to Semi-Finals =((

Armor penetration as a stat. Oh those were the days >.> Anyways I don't disagree Ret in Legion will be not good for Arena. I'd give away Hand of Hinderance for some Hand of Freedom thing that increases movement speed anyday.

[Snegovik]

Armor penetration as a stat. Oh those were the days >.> Anyways I don't disagree Ret in Legion will be not good for Arena. I'd give away Hand of Hinderance for some Hand of Freedom thing that increases movement speed anyday.

Do you Remb how Rets would go OOM and we could not heal or cast SS =) we had to seal dance to get our mana back from our attacks. Even though Ret was not complex, but it had nice depth to it: get HP or Mana from our attacks based on judgement debuff on target, dispel magic, freedom out of stuns... def miss wrath Ret.

[Taeldorian]

I tested on a PTR premade with 2 or 3% haste. It might be that with another 10% you can squeeze it in there. Once i can copy my Paladin i will test again. But even if we get 3 in there, the rotation is still an unnaceptable mess of downtime and strikes that don't line up.

Oh yeah for sure, not saying its good, just saying the 2 seconds isnt entirely useless. Its good they seem to be listening, maybe theyre just testing shit out and seeing if it works, not sure.

[Chaosinciter]

So just got to copy over my paladin from live (not very well geared only some misc pvp items and normal HFC stuff) ilvl 702 sitting at about 14% haste, 36% mastery and 27% crit. CS is at a 2.66 sec CD (with tFoJ) BoJ is 10.6 Judgment is at 10.6 as well and while im running into the occasional gap (not by much though) i'm very easily able to fit 3 TV's into a judgment window (can almost get 4 if i have a DP proc and a tFoJ proc to work with) without overcapping on HP. I can definitely see where it'll get clunky at lower levels of haste though. Our generator damage though is very weak and something i'd hope they change at a later point, dont like the idea of TV being such a high contributor to our damage to where everything else feels just bad.

Going to mess around with ES as well though i can see that already being a pain

Edit 1: i just want to say i absolutely love this transmog system cause it finally allows me to use my Grand Marshall / High Warlord weapons on another character instead of only my warrior, hopefully this stays cause it just makes me sooo happy lol.

Edit 2: Surprisingly enough ES actually wasn't that hard to work into the rotation and get it to land properly specially with the 2 additional seconds on Judgment duration, while resources were a bit more scarce at times, at the current haste i had it actually felt ok to use and didnt jumble things up to bad.

[Celebhil]

I got a copy in as well....im not near BiS yet, but i was a bit disappointed to find that my mastery is only at about 53%, but at 16% haste theres little wait time on the rotation with firesofjustice. ....aoe wasn't that impressive.

[Snegovik]

So just got to copy over my paladin from live (not very well geared only some misc pvp items and normal HFC stuff) ilvl 702 sitting at about 14% haste, 36% mastery and 27% crit. CS is at a 2.66 sec CD (with tFoJ) BoJ is 10.6 Judgment is at 10.6 as well and while im running into the occasional gap (not by much though) i'm very easily able to fit 3 TV's into a judgment window (can almost get 4 if i have a DP proc and a tFoJ proc to work with) without overcapping on HP. I can definitely see where it'll get clunky at lower levels of haste though. Our generator damage though is very weak and something i'd hope they change at a later point, dont like the idea of TV being such a high contributor to our damage to where everything else feels just bad.

Going to mess around with ES as well though i can see that already being a pain

Edit 1: i just want to say i absolutely love this transmog system cause it finally allows me to use my Grand Marshall / High Warlord weapons on another character instead of only my warrior, hopefully this stays cause it just makes me sooo happy lol.

Edit 2: Surprisingly enough ES actually wasn't that hard to work into the rotation and get it to land properly specially with the 2 additional seconds on Judgment duration, while resources were a bit more scarce at times, at the current haste i had it actually felt ok to use and didnt jumble things up to bad.

Hey mate can u plz test for me if we can use pvp elite sets lets say from wars/dks on Rets in xmog system? thx in advance

[Chaosinciter]

Hey mate can u plz test for me if we can use pvp elite sets lets say from wars/dks on Rets in xmog system? thx in advance

Anything class specific we cannot, but the stuff that is a look-alike we can, so if you got like the offset pieces you can use those.

[Celebhil]

@Sneg, no; set items are restricted to the class it specifically belongs to.

[Snegovik]

@Sneg, no; set items are restricted to the class it specifically belongs to.

=( i hoped for a sec that they changed it and i can xmog my Ret into WOD s1 elite war set..sigh oh well, thx anyways =)

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thx for confirmation