2023-24 NHL Season Thread.

[Armourboy]

Playing on a bad team cost Weber more than one Norris.

[VanillaO]

5.85M a year for a guy who hasn't topped 30 pts since before the lockout-shortened season? Don't think he's finding his form again. (To be fair, he was on pace for like 50 or so points in that shortened season). I know he was phenomenal in their first Cup, and pretty good in their 2nd, but that's still got to be one of the worst contracts in the league.

[Greeney]

Playing on a bad team cost Weber more than one Norris.

I think so too, and I wouldn't be surprised if Karlsson got it during one of those years.

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Norris isnt most valuable defenseman though its the defenseman that demonstrates the best ability at the position all around. He shouldent lose points because the team he plays on sucks hot dick, that doesn't seem fair to me. That type of criteria is more in line with the Hart and Jack Adams trophy. The way I see it the Norris by definition goes to the guy who had the best season on both sides of the game and that imo (by a narrow margin mind you) was Karlsson. Its an individual award that shouldent be determined by the team someone plays on. This isnt basketball where 1 superstar makes the difference between a playoff team and missing the post season. A superstar almost never wills their team to the playoffs on their own unless its a goalie (aka price last year). NHL is one of the most team dependant sports.

Yeah, you're right, that is the wording of the award, but everyone looks at it as the most valuable defenseman who plays hockey. Just frustrating seeing an award like that go to an offensive player over a defensive one when the award is for defense. Say what you want about a superstar never willing a team into the playoffs, but take Tavares off the Islanders, Doughty off of the Kings, or Ovechkin off of the Caps and they're not even close to how good they are; take Karlsson off of the Senators and they still do about as well as they did this season with just a couple more losses.

[Zeoni]

We lost Giordano last year during his Norris calibre season and still made the playoffs. Cherry picking here obviously but one player doesn't make or break a team and if they do, the team wasn't good to begin with. The award is voted on by the writers association too and Karlsson has won it twice already and theres nothing that looks like it will change this year. Its a debate between Doughtys elite level defending and good offense or Karlssons elite level offense and good defense. Normally i do agree about the award going to offensive D men being dumb but to me its hard to just ignore 82 points from a D man. Thats valuable as heck. He had 21 more points than the nearest guy on his team. Scoring at that clip is impressive for elite level forwards let alone d. It's not like he was a defensive slouch either logging 30+ minutes every game after Christmas.

[Armourboy]

I just think it's pretty freaking stupid when you got guys like Weber who have never gotten one and Karlsson is working on his third. The writers are fucking idiots.

[Reg]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Laidlaw

I definitely know the name as a fan of the Rangers, but I have never had the pleasure of meeting the man. There are so many people in this business that I never get to meet, even though we are repeatedly in the same arenas.

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Draft is in 11 days. Hurray something to look forward to.

At least you have something to look forward to, my Rangers and their lack of a first rounder make this draft kind of ruins it for me. This draft doesn't seem to have the depth that would allow for a significant late round pick to have an affect.

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Kopitar got the "C" today, they took it away from Brown, maybe he[Brown] can focus on not being so shitty now.

Kopitar deserves the C. He's been a great leader for the Kings. And like you said, this might give Brown a small reprieve from the leadership role to get back to playing at a level we have all seen him play at.

[Zeoni]

Yep 21 in this years draft is a bit of a hard pick because most of the talent will have dried up at that point and you're really relying on a players career panning out but some good players could fall there. Blue shirts could really use some of the D that would be available in the top 10 but I don't know if they have the assets. I'd heard Stepan might be available to a western conference team but that's just rumours that float around. It looks more and more like Yandle is leaving, McD and Klein are great imo but the rest of that core could use some work. I like a lot of the pieces you guys have, if only BDR would play to his potential then you'd have a much scarier squad. The Eric Staal move was alright if he wasn't aging but it was just a rental obviously, doubt he'd be resigned. I love Buchnevich as a prospect in the system and I think Skjei should probably be replacing Girardi soon. Trading away Duclair is gonna hurt, I think he would have been the middle 6 winger to be a catalyst in your forward core but Yandle had been good during his time in New York. Slight retool is expected for the Rangers and I think their window is closing a bit with Hank getting older and older as well as the D core breaking down outside the top pairing. Interesting times ahead, I could see them returning to dominance if some of their later round picks and prospects panned out though.

[Rennadrel]

I just think it's pretty freaking stupid when you got guys like Weber who have never gotten one and Karlsson is working on his third. The writers are fucking idiots.

I think that is part of it too. Year to year the same player can't be winning the same award, especially when his team can't make the playoffs in a pretty bad Atlantic division and a weak Eastern Conference. I mean, look at how bad the Leafs and Habs were in that division. Boston was sub par, so was New Jersey. Sure, other teams stepped up this year, but there is no excuse why Ottawa couldn't get into the playoffs this year.

[Reg]

snip

What I am hoping to see is Yandle signed using the cap space we get from Boyle either retiring or not being signed by the Rangers. I'd like to move either Staal or Girardi. That way our defense is MacTruck, Optimus Klein, Yandle, Staal or Girardi, Skjei and McIlrath. I'd still love to get a first line center because Stepan is not it, and Brassard fits in the second line. And as much as I like Nash's play, there is too much money tied up in him to not be the 40 goal scorer he was 2 seasons ago. Rumor has it he gave the Rangers 10 teams he would be willing to be traded to, so who knows. For the right deal, I'd be fine with Nash going.

Our window is definitely closing, maybe 1-2 years for a real shot with Hank.

Oh, and we don't have the 21st. We sent that to Arizona with Duclair for Yandle. We don't have a pick until the third round.

[Nazrark]

There is a bonus to drafting D though. If they don't seem that good in the draft now. It's because it takes awhile for them to become great D-men. Not as long as goalies. But you usually have to wait to 22-23 before you know what you got with them. If they can play in the NHL before then. Then they are great players and you should get them in.

[Zeoni]

What I am hoping to see is Yandle signed using the cap space we get from Boyle either retiring or not being signed by the Rangers. I'd like to move either Staal or Girardi. That way our defense is MacTruck, Optimus Klein, Yandle, Staal or Girardi, Skjei and McIlrath. I'd still love to get a first line center because Stepan is not it, and Brassard fits in the second line. And as much as I like Nash's play, there is too much money tied up in him to not be the 40 goal scorer he was 2 seasons ago. Rumor has it he gave the Rangers 10 teams he would be willing to be traded to, so who knows. For the right deal, I'd be fine with Nash going.

Our window is definitely closing, maybe 1-2 years for a real shot with Hank.

Oh, and we don't have the 21st. We sent that to Arizona with Duclair for Yandle. We don't have a pick until the third round.

I know, I meant if you had not traded the pick you'd be picking at 20 (I messed up my initial post by 1 pick) which is no man's land in this draft.

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There is a bonus to drafting D though. If they don't seem that good in the draft now. It's because it takes awhile for them to become great D-men. Not as long as goalies. But you usually have to wait to 22-23 before you know what you got with them. If they can play in the NHL before then. Then they are great players and you should get them in.

Yep, only freaks with amazing hockey IQ can play defense in the NHL before age 20. Aaron Ekblad was one, Noah Hanifin played last year too. There is no D man in this draft who is currently slated to play in the NHL for the 2016-2017 season. I woulden't be surprised to see it take them until the 2018-2019 season to be getting top 4 minutes as far as the big 3 go this year. No one is projected to be a top pairing guy either, you'd be lucky if 2/3 (Chychurn/Juolevi/Sergachev) even end up being top 4 by the end of their career. Players with exceptional skating and above average iq can make the NHL on teams with lesser bluelines but learning to process the game at that level takes so much time. Gap control, ice vision, defensive zone position are all things that need experience and seasoning to get better at. It's so hard to judge how good a D man is going to be if he's not exceptional during his draft age. So many guys don't hit their stride until 23 years old.

[Tradewind]

Yep, only freaks with amazing hockey IQ can play defense in the NHL before age 20. Aaron Ekblad was one, Noah Hanifin played last year too. There is no D man in this draft who is currently slated to play in the NHL for the 2016-2017 season. I woulden't be surprised to see it take them until the 2018-2019 season to be getting top 4 minutes as far as the big 3 go this year. No one is projected to be a top pairing guy either, you'd be lucky if 2/3 (Chychurn/Juolevi/Sergachev) even end up being top 4 by the end of their career. Players with exceptional skating and above average iq can make the NHL on teams with lesser bluelines but learning to process the game at that level takes so much time. Gap control, ice vision, defensive zone position are all things that need experience and seasoning to get better at. It's so hard to judge how good a D man is going to be if he's not exceptional during his draft age. So many guys don't hit their stride until 23 years old.

Case in point, Brodie!

[draynay]

Yep, only freaks with amazing hockey IQ can play defense in the NHL before age 20. Aaron Ekblad was one, Noah Hanifin played last year too. There is no D man in this draft who is currently slated to play in the NHL for the 2016-2017 season. I woulden't be surprised to see it take them until the 2018-2019 season to be getting top 4 minutes as far as the big 3 go this year. No one is projected to be a top pairing guy either, you'd be lucky if 2/3 (Chychurn/Juolevi/Sergachev) even end up being top 4 by the end of their career. Players with exceptional skating and above average iq can make the NHL on teams with lesser bluelines but learning to process the game at that level takes so much time. Gap control, ice vision, defensive zone position are all things that need experience and seasoning to get better at. It's so hard to judge how good a D man is going to be if he's not exceptional during his draft age. So many guys don't hit their stride until 23 years old.

The Kings are well representative of this philosophy too: Alex Martinez and Jake Muzzin were 4th and 5th round picks who didn't become NHL regulars until age 23, Doughty was 2nd overall and played immediately.

[Rennadrel]

I know, I meant if you had not traded the pick you'd be picking at 20 (I messed up my initial post by 1 pick) which is no man's land in this draft.

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Yep, only freaks with amazing hockey IQ can play defense in the NHL before age 20. Aaron Ekblad was one, Noah Hanifin played last year too. There is no D man in this draft who is currently slated to play in the NHL for the 2016-2017 season. I woulden't be surprised to see it take them until the 2018-2019 season to be getting top 4 minutes as far as the big 3 go this year. No one is projected to be a top pairing guy either, you'd be lucky if 2/3 (Chychurn/Juolevi/Sergachev) even end up being top 4 by the end of their career. Players with exceptional skating and above average iq can make the NHL on teams with lesser bluelines but learning to process the game at that level takes so much time. Gap control, ice vision, defensive zone position are all things that need experience and seasoning to get better at. It's so hard to judge how good a D man is going to be if he's not exceptional during his draft age. So many guys don't hit their stride until 23 years old.

Despite being a -14 on a pretty mediocre Leafs team, Reilly has certainly been getting better, he took some good strides this year. If he can start putting up points in the next couple of years when they start building a good offensive core, he will get a lot of talk.

[Greeney]

Despite being a -14 on a pretty mediocre Leafs team, Reilly has certainly been getting better, he took some good strides this year. If he can start putting up points in the next couple of years when they start building a good offensive core, he will get a lot of talk.

I remember when Burke drafted him and said they would have taken him first I was floored. I didn't think yakupov would be great but Murray, Reinhart, and Galchenyu. Of the top 10 in that draft I wouldn't want anyone as much as Reilly besides maybe Galchenyuk.

[Rennadrel]

I remember when Burke drafted him and said they would have taken him first I was floored. I didn't think yakupov would be great but Murray, Reinhart, and Galchenyu. Of the top 10 in that draft I wouldn't want anyone as much as Reilly besides maybe Galchenyuk.

Yeah, wasn't the most stellar of drafts when you look back at it. Griffin Reinhart hasn't panned into much, Galchenyuk is honestly one of the few great players to come out of that draft. Burke might be arrogant, but I think he saw the right things in Reilly and that it was a good pick. I bet the Oilers are eating their shoes wishing that they had traded away that first overall pick. Shame, Yakupov could be good, but he is basically just a third string player on a team with no support around him, just a bunch of small guys getting pushed off the puck by bigger and better players. I think if they were to throw him into a situation where he could be a 2nd line guy and has players who have size and speed on his line, he could be good, but I doubt he gets out of Edmonton via a trade.

[Zeoni]

I remember when Burke drafted him and said they would have taken him first I was floored. I didn't think yakupov would be great but Murray, Reinhart, and Galchenyu. Of the top 10 in that draft I wouldn't want anyone as much as Reilly besides maybe Galchenyuk.

Dude I thought Reinhart was going to be so good, I was actually jealous the Flames coulden't get in on him. I also saw Reilly play a lot in juniors because we had Hitmen season tickets that year and it was obvious he was going to be a really damn good player. Everytime he was on the ice they had insane pressure and everytime he had the puck it was insane how much he could do with it. I'm not surprised to see him doing well already. He's probably top 3 player from that draft in retrospect. Forsberg > Galchenyuk > Reilly/Lindholm imo but that's just right now.

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Despite being a -14 on a pretty mediocre Leafs team, Reilly has certainly been getting better, he took some good strides this year. If he can start putting up points in the next couple of years when they start building a good offensive core, he will get a lot of talk.

+/- is such a bad stat for judging defenseman especially playing on a roster like the Leafs had. Considering how god awful Bernier was this season and all things considered, -14 is like being +10 on a good team. Leafs didn't produce enough offense for Reilly to have a good +/- but I think the stat is best taken with a grain of salt with all things considered. Possession #s, shot attempts against, and time on ice are better ways for judging how good or bad a defenseman is. But I agree, give it 2-3 years and he'll be in talks with the rest of the elite D in the league imo.

[Greeney]

Forsberg was another one I thought we may have picked up at the time. Crazy how far he dropped and how little he was traded for. I don't watch Nashville as much as other teams but I feel like he's a bit too streaky and not consistent enough. Lindholm is amazing and I hope we can somehow make a trade work with Anaheim for him.

[Zeoni]

Veseys rights traded to Buffalo for a 3rd. At least at the end of the day Nashville managed something out of it.

Leafs get Freddy Andersen for 30th oa and a 2nd in 2017

[Nazrark]

I am loving draft week this year. I am getting excited to see what happens. You're going to want to hear this.

Yeah they traded Martin Erat for Forsberg. Which might have been Erat's last year in the NHL.