Anyone else not "feeling" it?

[Sylreick]

Thoroughly agree with everything you said, you probably put it better than I could.



I laughed really hard at this...but it might be true one day.

Also yes, I was thinking of spongebob when I made the title.

Hey, if FFXIV can make controller support, I see no reason why WoW couldn't. They're definitely down to around the amount those classes use. Easier if you use macros.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Did you try the PTR ? I tried rogue, and it's an amazing refresh. If you want less active gameplay, you pick the passive, and if you're more into active gameplay, you take all the active. On Sub, when I picked all the active, I barely had the time to use all the spells. It's exactly what WoW needed to refresh its gameplay, choices. Now that gameplay feels exciting and varied upon your choices again, you could repeat the same dungeons over and over, it will not get boring as quick as before.

That's kinda funny. Sub Rogues on live are very fun.

Hey, if FFXIV can make controller support, I see no reason why WoW couldn't. They're definitely down to around the amount those classes use. Easier if you use macros.

Doubt that will happen. There's so much stuff you can put on the action bar.

[Brubear]

While I can understand the sentiments that the the mechanical feel of specs may be completely different than what you have grown to love, the class identity, especially at the spec level, is as strong as I've ever seen it. Rather than just having each class have an over-arcing them, you now have the class fantasy with each spec representing a different aspect of that fantasy. They've done a good job of making each spec feel different from each other while still being a part of the overall class fantasy.

The result is that people who have played a certain class/spec for a decade may feel that it's lost a lot of it's heart, but that's because they tried to more clearly define each spec so a lot of the shared abilities that you viewed as being part of your spec are gone. However, I think that after awhile it'll pan out.

I say this as someone who has played a protection paladin since early Vanilla. Man, you want to talk about your class/spec identity changing. WoD was the first time that the spec didn't seem to be completely overhauled.

[Deleted]

I Have not played beta but these leveling quests must be bloody amazing considering what I've heard of the cut backs of 1) there is now no overall story progressing throughout the expansion (each zone has it's own now) 2) Only 4 leveling zones??? (Wod had 6) and each zone is apparently 2 hours.

I though the goal of Legion was to introduce a questing system where players could chose a unique levelling path. How is having to do the same 4 zones (just in a different order) accomplish or improve this. Also the story has now suffered because the zones now cant be designed in a order.

Sounds to me like we have lost content, story and replay value for the sake of doing 4 leveling zones in any order we want.

[rhorle]

I Have not played beta but these leveling quests must be bloody amazing considering what I've heard of the cut backs of 1) there is now no overall story progressing throughout the expansion (each zone has it's own now) 2) Only 4 leveling zones??? (Wod had 6) and each zone is apparently 2 hours.

There is an overall story. It is the entire reason why the individual zone stories exist. You have to get the Pillars of creation and the individual zones end their story with the Pillar of Creation for that zone. Also WoD had five leveling zones. Frostfire and Shadowmoon valley were faction specific and didn't contain any leveling for the other faction.

The unique leveling path exists because you can choose the order you consume the zones. If you don't accept that then Blizzard could never had made anything that would fit your logic because content is finite. And procedural generated content wouldn't work for the overall setup that Legion has.

[Deleted]

There is an overall story. It is the entire reason why the individual zone stories exist. You have to get the Pillars of creation and the individual zones end their story with the Pillar of Creation for that zone. Also WoD had five leveling zones. Frostfire and Shadowmoon valley were faction specific and didn't contain any leveling for the other faction.

The unique leveling path exists because you can choose the order you consume the zones. If you don't accept that then Blizzard could never had made anything that would fit your logic because content is finite. And procedural generated content wouldn't work for the overall setup that Legion has.

I'm sorry but this doesn't convince me that they designed the questing to benefit the players. I really don't see why they couldn't of done 7 to 8 zones with an overall story that allowed compulsory story zones mixed with optional zones (they did it in TBC and WOTLK). Also throw in a wpvp zone (NOT Ashran) that could allow a pvp community to fight and gank to their hearts content in a place where it doesn't disrupt pve players.

4 zones to me is incredibly half assed, and this is compared to WoD let alone the more popular expansions.

[rhorle]

I'm sorry but this doesn't convince me that they designed the questing to benefit the players. I really don't see why they couldn't of done 7 to 8 zones with an overall story that allowed compulsory story zones mixed with optional zones (they did it in TBC and WOTLK). Also throw in a wpvp zone (NOT Ashran) that could allow a pvp community to fight and gank to their hearts content in a place where it doesn't disrupt pve players.

Optional leveling zones are not a good use of resources. You have 4 leveling zones and 1 max level zone in current legion design. The stories for each zone are compulsory for the overall story. You just can complete it in any order. World PvP zones are also a waste of resources, and TBC and Wotlk had PvP objectives rather then an entire zone. At level cap their will be world PvP objectives which defeats the point of a set zone.

You might not be convinced but there is negative to the zone design of Legion. The story is still there. It is as great as any other expansion. You can pick the order you do the zones while leveling up.

[Nihilan]

I Have not played beta but these leveling quests must be bloody amazing considering what I've heard of the cut backs of 1) there is now no overall story progressing throughout the expansion (each zone has it's own now) 2) Only 4 leveling zones??? (Wod had 6) and each zone is apparently 2 hours.

I though the goal of Legion was to introduce a questing system where players could chose a unique levelling path. How is having to do the same 4 zones (just in a different order) accomplish or improve this. Also the story has now suffered because the zones now cant be designed in a order.

Sounds to me like we have lost content, story and replay value for the sake of doing 4 leveling zones in any order we want.

Your first playthrough will take you about 20 hours /played to hit L110. Assuming that you stick to actual leveling and not spending 15hours in trade chat. On your second playthrough when you know the ropes, it might take only 16-17 hours. If of course you are a masochist and attempt to level as a healer, it will probably take 25-30 hours for the first playthrough.

The only unique content is the artifact quests, class hall campaigns, and profession quests.

[Hexxidecimal]

I'm sorry but this doesn't convince me that they designed the questing to benefit the players. I really don't see why they couldn't of done 7 to 8 zones with an overall story that allowed compulsory story zones mixed with optional zones (they did it in TBC and WOTLK). Also throw in a wpvp zone (NOT Ashran) that could allow a pvp community to fight and gank to their hearts content in a place where it doesn't disrupt pve players.

4 zones to me is incredibly half assed, and this is compared to WoD let alone the more popular expansions.

I'm sorry but this doesn't convince me that they designed the questing to benefit the players. I really don't see why they couldn't of done 7 to 8 zones with an overall story that allowed compulsory story zones mixed with optional zones (they did it in TBC and WOTLK). Also throw in a wpvp zone (NOT Ashran) that could allow a pvp community to fight and gank to their hearts content in a place where it doesn't disrupt pve players.

4 zones to me is incredibly half assed, and this is compared to WoD let alone the more popular expansions.

There are a few things to consider, and honestly I haven't played much of the beta so I can't really speak to it much, someone else will have to confirm if any of this is the case.

First we are getting wrapped up a ton in the number of zones without considering number of quests, quality of quests and story and size. Additionally there seem to be quite a number of quests wrapped up in your Order Hall (not to mention a few in your artifact weapon/s) that give additional content unique to whatever class you are playing. It seems as if some of these take you to older sections of the game, which in my humble opinion is a brilliant way to utilize old iconic zones and locations.

PvP wise, I agree.

At 7-8 zones, I have to believe that some zones would simply suffer from lack of attention and interesting content. If the quality of the 4 leveling zones we have is very high, I'll take that over 7-8 zones all with middling quest structure and story. I enjoyed the narrative feel of WoD, I think more set pieces and cut scenes could/should have been added but overall I liked the feeling of slowly pushing back the enemy. I got that same feeling from WotLK but overall I felt WoD was better because of the loss of few characters in WoD and the purposeful quests to build up a base of operations in each region. That being said I wasn't fond of the basic setting and enemies for WoD. Since it was never our time line it was hard to fully connect to the loss of Ganar or Other Velen but I did enjoy the tools the utilized to tell the story. I would gladly sacrafice (not that I have a choice in the matter) extra zones for more development time in fleshing out the story for fewer zones, with more, interactive story driven quests, set pieces, cut scenes and world changing consequences! Which from what I have heard of the story line seems like might be the case here

[Nihilan]

Also

Each zone has a small area or two that will ffa flag you upon entry. These areas are for pvp world quests. Such quests are distinguished by being marked with a crossed swords icon on the map rather than the typical excalation point for normal world quests.

[Deleted]

OP: I am 100% with you. I find myself unable to enjoy a single second of Legion due to the complete mess my class has become, I've had alpha since the first wave and it has never clicked a single time since then. Friends keep pestering me to come back and play with them, and I honestly wish to play with them again since these were some of my best gaming experiences but I can't see myself going through this complete nonsense so I have to keep declining.

I really feel sad for some of the other wow teams at blizz who actually do quality work (especially art and encounter design teams) and have to put up with... this.

[Rilas13]

I thought this was going to be more of a I'm just not feeling the hype like I used to thread. Which I was going to say makes sense, I think a lot of people that do still play this game have been in for the long haul. I would say most people that join today don't last long. But it is a decade old game that can only reinvent the flame so many times.

That being said I am more hyped for this then I have been for the game since LK. I am in the beta, and agree with my friend that this feels like the second coming.

But again its also a decade old game and there are plenty of people that have probably lost interest and there is nothing wrong with that.

Now with all of that off topic out of the way, I think the above changes are necessary. A lot of things were so static in WoD, and with a game sitting at such an old age, if it doesn't innovate, it dies.

[Alopex Major]

I haven't been feeling it since before alpha started. I guess we'll see if I'm right. So far I'm two for two!

[F1reheart]

OP: I am 100% with you. I find myself unable to enjoy a single second of Legion due to the complete mess my class has become, I've had alpha since the first wave and it has never clicked a single time since then. Friends keep pestering me to come back and play with them, and I honestly wish to play with them again since these were some of my best gaming experiences but I can't see myself going through this complete nonsense so I have to keep declining.

I really feel sad for some of the other wow teams at blizz who actually do quality work (especially art and encounter design teams) and have to put up with... this.

Yikes...sad to see even you go. You did some of the first solos of wrath bosses right? If anyone knows anything about classes I think it'd be you lol. Maybe they'll change direction, maybe it'll be a "selling point" of the next xpac where they do massive dev blogs about how they messed classes up and how they're going to fix them.

[Spunt]

At least warlocks specs feel pretty distinct. Affliction feels like a real dot spec instead of a 'sometime' dot spec, with dot dmg being tied into a filler spell. Really love that you can just dot everything up again and run around healing and laughing as your pet tanks everything. Reminds me a lot of aff BC where questing was only going to an area and tab dotting anything that moves and winning.

[lanesia24]

This is not a "I quit" or "I unsubscribe" thread. I would've posted this on wow forums but I feel like it would eventually turn into that, so I came here for an actual discussion.

Legion is shaping up to be a very good xpac, I'd say 90% of it's content is well designed and will be incredibly fun to play. The story and questing is fantastic, with Suramar being an amazing zone, and all the new tech is quite cool. However a lot of this is marred by the quality of class mechanics, feel, and gameplay. It honestly does drag down most of the experience for me.

Prune 2.0 was far more severe than the first one, and really took away class identity for a lot of classes I love. The two most prominent examples would be fury warrior and frost DK. I'm gonna nitpick at a few things here to convey a general idea, try not to focus on the "nitpicking", but rather the problem that all these things create.

Fury lacks any stances, rage management, utility, or significant burst outside bladestorm. Blizzard has said they wanted fury to be more consistent damage, whereas arms is bursty. This to me is completely backwards, and mix that with the lack of class-defining abilities and any real mechanic to think about, it'll feel "watered down", and ruin the rest of your experience. Also, pooling ALL of your rage into one ability reminds me of the 2005 blizzcon panel for classes. They said something like "It wasn't fun because you were just using your abilities like a metronome, there wasn't a lot of choice or any reason to NOT hit those buttons so we added a rage bar". Legion effectively removes the need to worry about rage, by having only one ability that costs rage.

Frost overall "works" in a dps-rotation sense, as does fury. But really that's all it feels like its built around, a raid boss rotation fixed around a frost theme. Runes are condensed into 1, blood/unholy abilities removed, necromany-themed abilities effectively gone. Not even something cool like stealing souls, similar to what Arthas does.

What I'm trying to get it as Blizzard decided to completely rework classes, but instead reworked specs, which really ruined class identity. I don't feel like a warrior without stances and rage management, imo they should design around a class first then have a spec buff a certain part of that class. There's no reason to not have any sort of necromancy or control over souls as a frost *death knight*.

I could keep ranting and nitpicking for days, you might disagree with some points, but what it comes down to is classes are your gateway into the world. If they don't feel right, and if they aren't engaging enough to keep the player interested, then everything else in the game becomes just as boring. There have been plenty of threads against the prune, with MASSIVE amounts of upvotes and posts, but it doesn't seem like they're changing direction for Legion.

Does anyone else feel like this? Or am I just being really stubborn with change?

I have to disagree on Fury. Fury is a lot of fun on the beta and I don't really miss stances. I think some people just get attached to meaningless gameplay mechanics that used to be relevant like 4 expansions ago and really haven't been relevant for a long time. Fury doesnt really lack for burst either from my experience. The damage is more consistent sure but you can definitely burst when you need to.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Yikes...sad to see even you go. You did some of the first solos of wrath bosses right? If anyone knows anything about classes I think it'd be you lol. Maybe they'll change direction, maybe it'll be a "selling point" of the next xpac where they do massive dev blogs about how they messed classes up and how they're going to fix them.

Far as I know, Unholy got a lot of love(Deservingly so). Can't speak for Blood. My class is meh this expansion so I understand where he is coming from but with that said the expansion looks great. Class design needs more tweaks IMO.

[wowaccounttom]

prune sucks
legion still seems pretty good with the exception of everyone running around with the same artifact level weapons

[lanesia24]

I'm sorry but this doesn't convince me that they designed the questing to benefit the players. I really don't see why they couldn't of done 7 to 8 zones with an overall story that allowed compulsory story zones mixed with optional zones (they did it in TBC and WOTLK). Also throw in a wpvp zone (NOT Ashran) that could allow a pvp community to fight and gank to their hearts content in a place where it doesn't disrupt pve players.

4 zones to me is incredibly half assed, and this is compared to WoD let alone the more popular expansions.

The 4 zones are great and they will all be usable at max level as opposed to most other expansions where you really had only 1 max level zone. I mean that's what I like about this approach more than the other way is because instead of only really having one destination for end game content now you can be out all over the world doing things and really most expansions that had 7-8 zones those zones were really only relevant during the leveling process and then you mostly skipped over them outside of some rare/treasure hunting or profession type stuff.

[Beloren]

This is not a "I quit" or "I unsubscribe" thread. I would've posted this on wow forums but I feel like it would eventually turn into that, so I came here for an actual discussion.

Legion is shaping up to be a very good xpac, I'd say 90% of it's content is well designed and will be incredibly fun to play. The story and questing is fantastic, with Suramar being an amazing zone, and all the new tech is quite cool. However a lot of this is marred by the quality of class mechanics, feel, and gameplay. It honestly does drag down most of the experience for me.

Prune 2.0 was far more severe than the first one, and really took away class identity for a lot of classes I love. The two most prominent examples would be fury warrior and frost DK. I'm gonna nitpick at a few things here to convey a general idea, try not to focus on the "nitpicking", but rather the problem that all these things create.

tbh.. I just feel it's been cleared out so it can grow a bit better than it was before, it's reset a lot of things it's cleaner, it's also a lot of fun, it definitely is simpler though , but the idea of talents was to add complexity, who knows, it's simple enough to allow us to have new abilities in the next expansion.