1. #19561
    How much did movie made in USA to this day>?

  2. #19562
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Chosenone1 View Post
    How much did movie made in USA to this day>?
    as of june 20 it has made 39,300 000 million domestic.

  3. #19563
    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    I was thinking that maybe the second film could skip straight to Thrall's story. There's already been a lot of narrative streamlining and the ending of the film seem to set that up. Plus it would be a much tighter and easy to understand story - following Thrall growing up as a gladiator and becoming a Warchief. From there they could give us an Arthas spin off while also continuing Thrall's journey - having him ally with Jaina and travel to Kalimdor in the third film.
    That seems way too rushed and leaves a whole lot of things out.
    It would be like going from Fellowship of the Ring straight to Return of the King.
    They need to show the Alliance, the human kigndoms, the elves, the dwarves, establish the world and politics show the paladins, have the war play out with the casualties and victories culminating in the deafeat of the Horde and THEN they can show THrall's story.

  4. #19564
    Quote Originally Posted by Chosenone1 View Post
    How much did movie made in USA to this day>?
    $39,3M

    /10 char

  5. #19565
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    the thing is. they cant just have a time skip and the orcs in camps. and if you try to half and half you're just going to get shitty versions of each game.

    i would rather they either do warcraft 2, or a side story in current times, you know, smaller scale, maybe even base it partially on that set of young adult novels coming out.

    even if we dont get a third movie with thrall i just feel like thats the only way to do either story justice and id rather get 1 more good movie and no more movies than a bad movie

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    granted, if they could pull it off, id take back everything i said
    No time skip is required imo. It would require some fairly large alterations from the original lore, but let's be honest - they already streamlined a lot and people are still confused. So I'm not opposed to that so long as the broad story and the themes remain. This would be my outline:

    The film starts with Thrall drifting down the river from the end of the first film, perhaps with some narration by Drek'thar recapping the defeat of the Orcs at the Dark Portal, leaving them weakened and scattered. Thrall is found by Blackmoore and the first hour of the film focuses on his captivity and training as a gladiator. If critics complained that the first film had too many characters, this segment would basically have four major characters - Thrall, Taretha, the Sergeant and Adelas Blackmoore, divided between Thrall training with Sergeant, his friendship/romance with Taretha, his stockholm like relationship with Blackmoore, and later Blackmoore's advances on Taretha. When Thrall finds the meaning of the wolf on the blanket he was found with - via another Orc gladiator, he endeavours to escape and find his clan. Taretha helps him to escape.

    By this point about 20 years have passed since the events of the first film, give or take. The Orcs have been mostly defeated. Thrall finds the Frostwolf remnant, lead by Orgrim and Drek'thar. Both serve as mentors to Thrall and Drek'thar gives some exposition via flashbacks about Shamanism and how Gul'dan's fel magic cut off the Orc's connection to the elements. A human raid comes upon their camp and they are captured and put into internment camps. Thrall finds the Orcs despondent and apathetic. Among the Orcs captured are Grommash and Gul'dan (who is in disgrace but still feared enough that the Orcs have left him alive). With Drek'thar's help, Thrall rekindles the Orc's connection to the elements and liberates the Orcs. Orgrim becomes Warchief and they lead the Horde against the humans, attacking other internment camps.

    The Alliance amasses its forces against The Horde, with Lothar arriving in Durnholde with a Legion. He is in a much smaller role in this film and it isn't vital to know his backstory - he's mostly just a sympathetic human commander who gives us a POV in the human camp, who people who saw the first film will know (however I think it's important after the poor critical performance that this sequel can be watched without having seen the first). Meanwhile the Orcs ally with the Trolls who have similar shamanistic powers.

    Gul'dan seeks to manipulate the young Thrall. He is in direct communication with his demonic masters who we know more about now through Drek'thar's flashbacks. Gul'dan makes a desperate bid to re-take control of the Horde by summoning demons, but Thrall and the others defeat the demons, who flee back into the Nether, dragging Gul'dan screaming with them.

    With all internecine conflict dealt with, the Orcs march on Dunrholde. Adelas has Taretha murdered which sparks off the final battle. Lothar and Doomhammer duel and mutually kill each other. Grommash is not a major character yet but he gets to show off his fighting skills and takes out Sergeant. The final battle is of course between Thrall and Blackmoore. He kills Blackmoore and in his grief uses the elements to destroy Durnholde. After the battle he comes across the injured and dying Doomhammer. They have a few last words together and Orgrim passes Thrall his hammer. Thrall takes charge of the Horde and we end on a hopeful note that they can carve a living out for themselves in Azeroth.

    The post credits sequence (and I know this will be controversial) is Gul'dan dragged into the Nether by the demons. He faces Kil'jaeden (though he is not named) who tells Gul'dan that he must be punished for losing the Horde, but that he still has work to do for the Legion. Gul'dan's soul is ripped from his body and hurled to Icecrown Citadel to be the Lich King. The franchise would then have two separate branches to continue down - Thrall's story, and Arthas'.

  6. #19566
    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    The post credits sequence (and I know this will be controversial) is Gul'dan dragged into the Nether by the demons. He faces Kil'jaeden (though he is not named) who tells Gul'dan that he must be punished for losing the Horde, but that he still has work to do for the Legion. Gul'dan's soul is ripped from his body and hurled to Icecrown Citadel to be the Lich King. The franchise would then have two separate branches to continue down - Thrall's story, and Arthas'.
    While I see too much Horde-centered the rest of your post (don't take me wrong, I would love it, I'm a Hordy-fanboy) I like this change in particular. Less characters would make the story less confusing. Merging Gul'dan and Ner'zhul for the WCU seems like a smart move to me. Although I know, as you say, it will be extremely controversial for die-hard "lorelists". Also, as I stated before, I don't think they should cut down entirely Alleria and Turalyon. They are Alliance players fan favorite characters and I think they deserve a part of the story too.

  7. #19567
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Vitrino View Post
    While I see too much Horde-centered the rest of your post (don't take me wrong, I would love it, I'm a Hordy-fanboy) I like this change in particular. Less characters would make the story less confusing. Merging Gul'dan and Ner'zhul for the WCU seems like a smart move to me. Although I know, as you say, it will be extremely controversial for die-hard "lorelists". Also, as I stated before, I don't think they should cut down entirely Alleria and Turalyon. They are Alliance players fan favorite characters and I think they deserve a part of the story too.
    They are cool characters, but I think that if enough money is made for a sequel, lessons need to be learned from the mistakes of the first film. One of the big complaints was that the film was entirely too much fanservice. Alleria and Turalyon ultimately serve very little narrative purpose. They disappeared with barely a mention of them for over 20 years. Even assuming the WCU ever takes off, it will be years and years before WoW:Legion is adapted in any form. Alleria and Turalyon are fanservice characters. It's like the MCU: There are hundreds of characters, a lot of them - even really cool ones are never going to see the big screen.

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    That's also why I think a Horde centric story would be the best. Of those critics who actually gave the movie the time of day, most agreed that the Orcs where the best part of the film. Why not capitalise on that? If the problem with the first film was thart it was too confusing and the human characters where boring, why not hve a sequel focusing on the Orcs with a more straightforward story. And we have a book ready to be adapted for that. Meanwhile Arthas' story could be told next, giving us a human focused story.

    As a side note, Blackmoore has so much potential as a villain. Abusive, unstable, his interactions with Taretha would be positively vile. But he would have a twisted fondness for Thrall, ho would have a stockholm syndrome relationship with him. He'd be incredibly compelling.

  8. #19568
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vitrino View Post
    While I see too much Horde-centered the rest of your post (don't take me wrong, I would love it, I'm a Hordy-fanboy) I like this change in particular. Less characters would make the story less confusing. Merging Gul'dan and Ner'zhul for the WCU seems like a smart move to me.
    Completely agreed with this. It would make Gul'Dan an even more interesting character.

    As for this general argument that the storytelling should be balanced between the Horde and the Alliance, in order to please the fans... I think this is simply wrong. I think any proper fan of the Warcraft universe will be capable of putting aside their (let's be honest) utterly silly factional emotions (whichever faction they may be) and recognize what is an actually interesting story. I think the movie's highest priority should be to tell interesting stories, regardless of which side is the subject of said stories.

    To be a bit more specific, now. Khadgar and Medivh are good examples of interesting human characters. Arthas and Uther as well. Lothar and Turalyon, in my opinion, were utterly boring in the original Warcraft universe. Alleria was somewhat interesting, but I simply couldn't buy her being in love with someone as boring as Turalyon (I'm basing that on the kind of person Alleria is). So, while I'm not against Alleria and Turalyon being there, they should heavily be revamped for the movie, their arc in the books is simply uninteresting.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    That's also why I think a Horde centric story would be the best. Of those critics who actually gave the movie the time of day, most agreed that the Orcs where the best part of the film. Why not capitalise on that? If the problem with the first film was thart it was too confusing and the human characters where boring, why not hve a sequel focusing on the Orcs with a more straightforward story. And we have a book ready to be adapted for that. Meanwhile Arthas' story could be told next, giving us a human focused story.
    Yeah, exactly this. We all own Arthas and Thrall equally, regardless of whether we're Alliance or Horde. I think any Warcraft fan should feel joy at seeing either on on the screen, and if not, they will get the one they love.

  9. #19569
    i just dont think you can have "the orcs were defeated" as a narration.

    these are the guys who with a fraction of their army defeated stormwind (even if it didnt burn, the orcs won)

    them getting beaten needs to be shown and it needs to be shown as a struggle and with losses on both sides otherwise you make the orcs look weak.

    this is the burning legion were talking about. its fine to show the horde and alliance as equals post demon blood but in my opinion its integral not just for the current story but for later stories to show just how horrific the orcs were and how it was only because of the might of azeroth uniting and their own foolishness and infighting that caused their downfall.
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

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  10. #19570
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    i just dont think you can have "the orcs were defeated" as a narration.

    these are the guys who with a fraction of their army defeated stormwind (even if it didnt burn, the orcs won)
    Ah. See, this is the problem. The last battle was between, as you say, a fraction of their army and, as you may not realize, 3 out of a total of 30 remaining human legions (20 already having been defeated). Not pulling this out of my ass, Llane says this as they're preparing for the battle.

  11. #19571
    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    They are cool characters, but I think that if enough money is made for a sequel, lessons need to be learned from the mistakes of the first film. One of the big complaints was that the film was entirely too much fanservice. Alleria and Turalyon ultimately serve very little narrative purpose. They disappeared with barely a mention of them for over 20 years. Even assuming the WCU ever takes off, it will be years and years before WoW:Legion is adapted in any form. Alleria and Turalyon are fanservice characters. It's like the MCU: There are hundreds of characters, a lot of them - even really cool ones are never going to see the big screen.

    - - - Updated - - -

    That's also why I think a Horde centric story would be the best. Of those critics who actually gave the movie the time of day, most agreed that the Orcs where the best part of the film. Why not capitalise on that? If the problem with the first film was thart it was too confusing and the human characters where boring, why not hve a sequel focusing on the Orcs with a more straightforward story. And we have a book ready to be adapted for that. Meanwhile Arthas' story could be told next, giving us a human focused story.

    As a side note, Blackmoore has so much potential as a villain. Abusive, unstable, his interactions with Taretha would be positively vile. But he would have a twisted fondness for Thrall, ho would have a stockholm syndrome relationship with him. He'd be incredibly compelling.
    I completely see it. And I'll love it the way you've put it. I was just playing the devil's advocate role (talking from an Alliance player POV, which I'm not).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Completely agreed with this. It would make Gul'Dan an even more interesting character.

    As for this general argument that the storytelling should be balanced between the Horde and the Alliance, in order to please the fans... I think this is simply wrong. I think any proper fan of the Warcraft universe will be capable of putting aside their (let's be honest) utterly silly factional emotions (whichever faction they may be) and recognize what is an actually interesting story. I think the movie's highest priority should be to tell interesting stories, regardless of which side is the subject of said stories.

    To be a bit more specific, now. Khadgar and Medivh are good examples of interesting human characters. Arthas and Uther as well. Lothar and Turalyon, in my opinion, were utterly boring in the original Warcraft universe. Alleria was somewhat interesting, but I simply couldn't buy her being in love with someone as boring as Turalyon (I'm basing that on the kind of person Alleria is). So, while I'm not against Alleria and Turalyon being there, they should heavily be revamped for the movie, their arc in the books is simply uninteresting.

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    Yeah, exactly this. We all own Arthas and Thrall equally, regardless of whether we're Alliance or Horde. I think any Warcraft fan should feel joy at seeing either on on the screen, and if not, they will get the one they love.
    The same thing I answered to Prota. I really agree with both of you.

  12. #19572
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Ah. See, this is the problem. The last battle was between, as you say, a fraction of their army and, as you may not realize, 3 out of a total of 30 remaining human legions (20 already having been defeated). Not pulling this out of my ass, Llane says this as they're preparing for the battle.
    exactly. had they shown the orcs and humans being equally matched, it be no problem. llanes dead, so the rest come in and just fucking 1 shot them.

    but when you show like 1% of an army nearly wiping out an entire kingdom and ways for them to get more people being easily thought of you just cant do that without the story looking like a joke.

    and personally. warcraft 2 has one of the coolest stories and characters.

    are you guys seriously telling me you dont want to see death knights and shit straight up rekting faces.

    we BARELY got any magic this movie but what we saw was amazing. i wanna see straight up mages vs warlocks, pallies vs necromancers, rangers pouncing around and shit.

    warcraft 2 is when the WAR really gets put in warcraft and its the first time they actually really started thinking of the lore of the universe outside of it being a warhammer clone
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  13. #19573
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    i just dont think you can have "the orcs were defeated" as a narration.

    these are the guys who with a fraction of their army defeated stormwind (even if it didnt burn, the orcs won)

    them getting beaten needs to be shown and it needs to be shown as a struggle and with losses on both sides otherwise you make the orcs look weak.

    this is the burning legion were talking about. its fine to show the horde and alliance as equals post demon blood but in my opinion its integral not just for the current story but for later stories to show just how horrific the orcs were and how it was only because of the might of azeroth uniting and their own foolishness and infighting that caused their downfall.
    We saw the horrific-ness of the Orcs on fel in the first film. And yes we don't get as much of that as we'd probably like going with my plan, and it is a little unfortunate, but I think ultimately it is a price to be paid for streamlining the story. I think doing a broad scoped, direct sequel to the first film would kill any chances that this franchise might have left for a future. For the franchise to survive the next instalment imo needs to be smaller in focus and it needs to be a quasi-reboot so that fresh audience members can be drawn in without having seen the original. One of the main centrepieces of the second war (Doomhammer killing Blackhand at Blackrock Mountain) has already been gutted in film canon.

    Additionally Thrall's story would be told over a period of like 20 years. So we could see hints (or even outright see) the conflict between Orcs and Humans as the Orcs are slowly broken down. Maybe Blackmoore comes back to Durnholde after losing a fight with an Orc warband, takes things out on Thrall. One good scene of the Orcs beating the humans in battle would demonstrate a lot of what you're suggesting.

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    Additionally they form the Alliance at the end of the film. So it's now the somewhat battered fragment of the Orc army, versus the seven kingdoms, the Dwarves, the Elves and the Kirin Tor. It's not bad writing for that to quickly result in the Orc's defeat.

  14. #19574
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    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    exactly. had they shown the orcs and humans being equally matched, it be no problem. llanes dead, so the rest come in and just fucking 1 shot them.

    but when you show like 1% of an army nearly wiping out an entire kingdom and ways for them to get more people being easily thought of you just cant do that without the story looking like a joke.
    I think you completely missed the point. The human force at the portal - that's 10% of the remaining human army.

  15. #19575
    and you know, thinking about it.

    i think the way theyre gonna streamline warcraft 2 is take out the dragon bits, make it mostly about magic.

    because if you notice in the movie, other than lothar really the only thing that was able to stand up to the might of the orcs was magic and technology.

    if they hadnt had those guns the ending scene wouldve been over as soon as the frostwolves were revealed to be slaughtered.

    i think the main premise of warcraft 2 is gonna be the foundation of the silver hand. theyre gonna take the knights that we do have and magic them up to make them 1v1 orcs.

    i think the stories gonna go

    first scene, lothar and co evacuating stormwind as the regrouped orcs are about to attack. city burning, people screaming getting on boats. preferrably with atleast a nice chunk of people missing the boat and getting really fucked up to drive home the orcs brutality and how this is a race against time.

    humans go full magic and unite with the races, the dwarfs and gnomes providing guns and airships as well the founding of the silver hand. the horde basically getting its arse kicked once the alliance has regrouped but not defeated.

    then, the orcs, pushed back decide to go further than just giving the fel. this is where we will see the shadow council formed and their alliance with the trolls. the horde will come in halfway through the movie and start reky becky faces. if they wanna go full warcraft coolness show the goblins being greedy shit and selling them tech. if duncan wants, maybe he'll even put the demon blood in here, maybe this is when they'll drink it kind of like how grom drank it again as soon as he couldnt win without it.

    things start to look bleak for the alliance, theyre losing even with their magic and barely holding their ground, THEN we have gul'dan betray the horde. and they start bickering, infighting, maybe one of the trolls irritate an orc and due to the fel/demon blood essentially making them roid hulks an orc flips out and kills one pulling out troll support from the horde as well. again if they wanna go full warcraft, have the goblins see the tide turning and fuck over the horde

    another final battle with the alliance fully united, commited and really play up the family bond the frostwolves had but this time for the alliance.

    ending scene is a montage of the orcs getting put in cages, in my opinion the perfect scene would be of thrall, in human clothes and chains seeing orcs in chains who had just been purchased as he sees his own kind for the first time while at the same time you can hear the arguing and bickering of the leaders in lordaeron over how they differ on how to treat the orcs, would be really cool to show greymane yelling and leaving the alliance to play up that once again theyre gonna fall apart.

    cut out all the shit about dragons, all the draenor stuff, dont make it take place all over azeroth. have the battle take place mostly in.. idk arathi highlands or something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    I think you completely missed the point. The human force at the portal - that's 10% of the remaining human army.
    no, i got that. i remember the line from the movie. its the reason llane was so worried about lothars plan but lothar was basically like you know, if we dont do this big push now we arent gonna have an army at all to make a push

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    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    We saw the horrific-ness of the Orcs on fel in the first film. And yes we don't get as much of that as we'd probably like going with my plan, and it is a little unfortunate, but I think ultimately it is a price to be paid for streamlining the story. I think doing a broad scoped, direct sequel to the first film would kill any chances that this franchise might have left for a future. For the franchise to survive the next instalment imo needs to be smaller in focus and it needs to be a quasi-reboot so that fresh audience members can be drawn in without having seen the original. One of the main centrepieces of the second war (Doomhammer killing Blackhand at Blackrock Mountain) has already been gutted in film canon.

    Additionally Thrall's story would be told over a period of like 20 years. So we could see hints (or even outright see) the conflict between Orcs and Humans as the Orcs are slowly broken down. Maybe Blackmoore comes back to Durnholde after losing a fight with an Orc warband, takes things out on Thrall. One good scene of the Orcs beating the humans in battle would demonstrate a lot of what you're suggesting.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Additionally they form the Alliance at the end of the film. So it's now the somewhat battered fragment of the Orc army, versus the seven kingdoms, the Dwarves, the Elves and the Kirin Tor. It's not bad writing for that to quickly result in the Orc's defeat.
    i just dont feel like the weight is there without it being a massive struggle.

    the alliance and horde fighting in modern times already makes little sense. take away the 2nd war and outside of stormwind nobody has a reason to hate the orcs. it also makes the burning legion look pretty weak.

    this was their army? how was this supposed to conquer azeroth if they were beaten as soon as 1 king died?
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  16. #19576
    Deleted
    That sounds great for fans. But the sheer fanservice of the film is what has made things so uncertain for the franchise's future. To do a direct continuation of the first film would be a huge mistake imo. Most of the audience would not have seen it, so not matter how streamlined the sequel is, if it relies on knowledge of the first film it runs into the exact same problem. My proposal allows new audience members to be bought in, as it requires no more prior knowledge other than that there was a war between Orcs and humans which the orcs are losing. Plus Gul'dan's backstory whih would be mostly brand new and explained by Drek'thar.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    i just dont feel like the weight is there without it being a massive struggle.

    the alliance and horde fighting in modern times already makes little sense. take away the 2nd war and outside of stormwind nobody has a reason to hate the orcs. it also makes the burning legion look pretty weak.

    this was their army? how was this supposed to conquer azeroth if they were beaten as soon as 1 king died?
    But the whole point is that that army wasn't supposed to conquer Azeroth. They were supposed to bring more Orcs through. One warband very nearly conquered the kingdom of Stormwind. And is still mostly intact as of the end of film one. But now it's the remaining Orcs against the whole Alliance. Who would have plenty of reason to hate the Orcs because they'd be spending 20 years fighting the Orcs (who would probably be using guerilla warfare). By the time Thrall escapes captivity, the orcs are mostly defeated. But he liberates the internment camps, allies with the trolls and reconnects the Horde with the elements, taking the Alliance by surprise.

    ETA: So the Orcs would be a challenge for twenty years, and you'd get to see one or two of the battles because Blackmoore is a commander but most of the Horde's decline would be off-screen. I want to see badass fel horde as well, but most viewers wouldn't care much about that. Telling Thrall's story asap (because it's just what the franchise needs to have a future) is more important than showing the badassery of the fel Horde imo.
    Last edited by mmoce35ea8b457; 2016-06-22 at 07:43 PM.

  17. #19577
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    I think is an hilarious mistake going for an Orc centric story when the very last scene of the movie is about humans and the birth of their Alliance. And no, Thrall's baby found by humans don't count as actual last scene, is the equivalent of a post-credit scene. The last scene connected to the major plot of the movie is Lothar shouting "For the Alliance!" at Llane's funeral.

    If you think going on with the Second War is "fan service" I think you have all missed the point. If anything, it's you as fans that elaborate these thoughts based on your personal knowledge of the Warcraft lore. I can guarantee you than most of the audience will want to see the story continue from where it actually finished, not jumping around and making things twice more nonsensical than already are to the average joe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keyblader View Post
    It's a general rule though that if you play horde you are a bad person irl. It's just a scientific fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Heladys View Post
    The game didn't give me any good reason to hate the horde. Forums did that.

  18. #19578
    Quote Originally Posted by Protar View Post
    That sounds great for fans. But the sheer fanservice of the film is what has made things so uncertain for the franchise's future. To do a direct continuation of the first film would be a huge mistake imo. Most of the audience would not have seen it, so not matter how streamlined the sequel is, if it relies on knowledge of the first film it runs into the exact same problem. My proposal allows new audience members to be bought in, as it requires no more prior knowledge other than that there was a war between Orcs and humans which the orcs are losing. Plus Gul'dan's backstory whih would be mostly brand new and explained by Drek'thar.

    - - - Updated - - -



    But the whole point is that that army wasn't supposed to conquer Azeroth. They were supposed to bring more Orcs through. One warband very nearly conquered the kingdom of Stormwind. And is still mostly intact as of the end of film one. But now it's the remaining Orcs against the whole Alliance. Who would have plenty of reason to hate the Orcs because they'd be spending 20 years fighting the Orcs (who would probably be using guerilla warfare). By the time Thrall escapes captivity, the orcs are mostly defeated. But he liberates the internment camps, allies with the trolls and reconnects the Horde with the elements, taking the Alliance by surprise.

    ETA: So the Orcs would be a challenge for twenty years, and you'd get to see one or two of the battles because Blackmoore is a commander but most of the Horde's decline would be off-screen. I want to see badass fel horde as well, but most viewers wouldn't care much about that. Telling Thrall's story asap (because it's just what the franchise needs to have a future) is more important than showing the badassery of the fel Horde imo.
    what about all the orcs on the other side of the portal? were just supposed to assume gul'dan left them to die when thats his key to victory.

    all gul'dan needs to open that portal is a little more life without medivhs help. he just didnt have enough bodies to keep it open longterm without medivh/sargeras help.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    I think is an hilarious mistake going for an Orc centric story when the very last scene of the movie is about humans and the birth of their Alliance. And no, Thrall's baby found by humans don't count as actual last scene, is the equivalent of a post-credit scene. The last scene connected to the major plot of the movie is Lothar shouting "For the Alliance!" at Llane's funeral.

    If you think going on with the Second War is "fan service" I think you have all missed the point. If anything, it's you as fans that elaborate these thoughts based on your personal knowledge of the Warcraft lore. I can guarantee you than most of the audience will want to see the story continue from where it actually finished, not jumping around and making things twice more nonsensical than already are to the average joe.
    personally i think the key to success is fleshing out the alliance and making us care about them as well.

    now that the orcs have been established as having a good side its perfectly fine at this point to have a few of them go full on evil.

    thats my main problem with the first movie. if you arent already a fan of warcraft you have no reason to care about the alliance, because frankly, the alliance seem like douches.

    khadgar is abandoned by his family, medivh is possesed by something evil, alodi makes the kirin tor look incompetent, the elves are douchey towards the humans. even lothar while being likeable is still a jerk.
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  19. #19579
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Zulkhan View Post
    I think is an hilarious mistake going for an Orc centric story when the very last scene of the movie is about humans and the birth of their Alliance. And no, Thrall's baby found by humans don't count as actual last scene, is the equivalent of a post-credit scene. The last scene connected to the major plot of the movie is Lothar shouting "For the Alliance!" at Llane's funeral.

    If you think going on with the Second War is "fan service" I think you have all missed the point. If anything, it's you as fans that elaborate these thoughts based on your personal knowledge of the Warcraft lore. I can guarantee you than most of the audience will want to see the story continue from where it actually finished, not jumping around and making things twice more nonsensical than already are to the average joe.
    Most of the audience didn't see the film. It makes much more sense to start with a relatively clean slate rather than basically committing to the small viewership the first film built up.

  20. #19580
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    personally i think the key to success is fleshing out the alliance and making us care about them as well.

    now that the orcs have been established as having a good side its perfectly fine at this point to have a few of them go full on evil.

    thats my main problem with the first movie. if you arent already a fan of warcraft you have no reason to care about the alliance, because frankly, the alliance seem like douches.

    khadgar is abandoned by his family, medivh is possesed by something evil, alodi makes the kirin tor look incompetent, the elves are douchey towards the humans. even lothar while being likeable is still a jerk.

    Yeah, that makes sense, the whole movie I only really cared about the orcs, idgaf about what the humans were up to.

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