[Movie] Warcraft (June 2016)

[Immitis]

Yeah, that makes sense, the whole movie I only really cared about the orcs, idgaf about what the humans were up to.

i think duncan just assumed that since they were human that we would relate with them automatically.

granted, he was entirely justified in having to make the orcs not look completely evil. evil demon worshiping orcs doesnt work if you want to eventually make them good in a film franchise without it looking like you jumped the shark so best to get that in asap.

i mainly play alliance, so i knew exactly why id want to root for the alliance because i inherently know more about the faction then the audience does.

without that though... they really do look like massive dicks, theyre only saving grace is the queen being kind to garona.

i could very easily see how someone who doesnt play wow could see gul'dan as the only really evil force in the film.

i really hope, that at the very least we see teron gore in the sequel.

[Romano]

The post credits sequence (and I know this will be controversial) is Gul'dan dragged into the Nether by the demons. He faces Kil'jaeden (though he is not named) who tells Gul'dan that he must be punished for losing the Horde, but that he still has work to do for the Legion. Gul'dan's soul is ripped from his body and hurled to Icecrown Citadel to be the Lich King. The franchise would then have two separate branches to continue down - Thrall's story, and Arthas'.

Gul'dan however was the catalyst that turned Illidan into a half-demon.
Making him the Lich king won;t work in this case.

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As for this general argument that the storytelling should be balanced between the Horde and the Alliance, in order to please the fans... I think this is simply wrong. I think any proper fan of the Warcraft universe will be capable of putting aside their (let's be honest) utterly silly factional emotions (whichever faction they may be) and recognize what is an actually interesting story. I think the movie's highest priority should be to tell interesting stories, regardless of which side is the subject of said stories.

I also agree.
Insisting on making both sides equally represented in every movie is both silly and impossible.
Some stories demand a central PoV character like the story of Thrall or Arthas.

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ETA: So the Orcs would be a challenge for twenty years, and you'd get to see one or two of the battles because Blackmoore is a commander but most of the Horde's decline would be off-screen. I want to see badass fel horde as well, but most viewers wouldn't care much about that. Telling Thrall's story asap (because it's just what the franchise needs to have a future) is more important than showing the badassery of the fel Horde imo.

I think you have it quite backwards.

First of all what gave you the idea that most viewers wouldnt care about massive armies of crazed orcs attacking and razing human lands?
That is the very concept of fantasy that attracts people: the epic battles agaisnt evil foes.
Plus, the 2nd movie has to follow narratively the 1st.
Otherwise as I said, it would be like skipping the Two Towers in Lotr.
You cant skip it since:

1) it shows the ACTUAL with much more spectacular battles, you don;t miss such an opportunity
2) introduces human,dwarven and elven kingdosm that will play a role later in the story and you need some info and emotional investment about them
3) introduces the paladin order that will play a role later in Arthas' story.
4) shows the actual ferocity of the orcs and their destruction, the effect they had on Aeroth, the effect the demon blood hadon them and how great their fall was. That will later tie in wit hthe whole "redemption" story.

These are things you can't skip

On the contrary, Thrall is a completely uknown irrelevant character for the general audience.
We know and like him because of the game but people would "who the fuck's this guy? where is the war ? the battles? ,wtf happened after the previous film ?"

The first film was about orcs invading and ended some casualties for the humans and the orcs still amassing their armies.
To jump to the story of an irrelevant (from storytelling and cinematic viewpoint) character is a very bad move.

[tangocash]

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/warcraft/
"Jones confirms that should a sequel take place, Thrall would be the lead character, in what he describes as a “Spartacus-style story”. “Film number two, if we ever got the chance, would very much be Thrall's emancipation,” says Jones. “Orgrim, who was kind of the back-up to Durotan, will have more of a teaching role."

Studio didn't want to use in game music.

Universal refused to make the logo Azeroth.

[Wikiy]

Universal refused to make the logo Azeroth.

Dicks.

/10char

[Soulwind]

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/warcraft/
"Jones confirms that should a sequel take place, Thrall would be the lead character, in what he describes as a “Spartacus-style story”. “Film number two, if we ever got the chance, would very much be Thrall's emancipation,” says Jones. “Orgrim, who was kind of the back-up to Durotan, will have more of a teaching role."

Studio didn't want to use in game music.

Universal refused to make the logo Azeroth.

I'm just wondering what's the Alliance counterpart to having Thrall as the Horde point of view. I'd say Turalyon, but that would require Lord of the Clans happening during the Second War, not afterwards. Any other ideas? I don't think they want to drop the two-sided aspect of the first film.

[Jotaux]

I'm just wondering what's the Alliance counterpart to having Thrall as the Horde point of view. I'd say Turalyon, but that would require Lord of the Clans happening during the Second War, not afterwards. Any other ideas? I don't think they want to drop the two-sided aspect of the first film.

Arthas becoming the Lich King.

[Romano]

I'm just wondering what's the Alliance counterpart to having Thrall as the Horde point of view. I'd say Turalyon, but that would require Lord of the Clans happening during the Second War, not afterwards. Any other ideas? I don't think they want to drop the two-sided aspect of the first film.

I don't think they need the 2-aspect in every film.
Thrall's story is a pretty personal one,so it makes sense to focus on him without interferences from others.

It made sense for them to tell the orcish perspective as well, to establish they arent all monsters, but they dont have to keep it for all movies otherwise they will become silly.
Arthas' story wouldnt work that way for example.

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Arthas becoming the Lich King.

This wouldnt work.
At all.

[Soulwind]

I don't think they need the 2-aspect in every film.
Thrall's story is a pretty personal one,so it makes sense to focus on him without interferences from others.

It made sense for them to tell the rocish perspective as well, to establish they arnet all monsters, but they dont ahev to keep it for all movies otherwise they will becoem silly.
Arthas' story wouldnt work that way for example.

I don't think you want the fans to say "oh, it's the Horde movie, I'm Alliance, so I'll skip that one" or "Blizzard focusing on orcs. Again".

[Romano]

I don't think you want the fans to say "oh, it's the Horde movie, I'm Alliance, so I'll skip that one" or "Blizzard focusing on orcs. Again".

I may sound rude but wahtever.
Screw that crowd.
Anyone taking "faction pride" to that level can may as well stay away.

This isnt the game, this is a movie with completely different needs and narratives.
If they can't understand it, they can stay home, they don't have to demand a lukewarm movie and ruin it for the rest of the audience.
I doubt those taking this so seriously are in any stretch of the imagination a substantial audience.


Also such a demand wouldnt make sense.
How do you make Thrall's or Arthas' story that way ?
You can't.
Both have a very personal journey that needs to focus extremely on their characters and trying to add a second perspective dilludes that.
Not to mention, it wouldnt even make sense.
Artha's story esepecially has no relevance to the Horde so you would just have 2 completely unrelated narratives.

It would be like trying to do The First Avenger and Iron man in 1 movie.
2 different stories of different characters that don't even have relevance within the context of the movie.
Similary the MCu may have standalone movies with heroes that some may not want to see.
They do them anyway for the rest ofthe audience who want to see them.

[Soulwind]

I may sound rude but wahtever.
Screw that crowd.
Anyone taking "faction pride" to that level can may as well stay away.

This isnt the game, this is a movie with completely different needs and narratives.
If they can't understand it, they can stay home, they don't have to demand a lukewarm movie and ruin it for the rest of the audience.
I doubt those taking this so seriously are in any stretch of the imagination a substantial audience.


Also such a demand wouldnt make sense.
How do you make Thrall's or Arthas' story that way ?
You can't.
Both have a very personal journey that needs to focus extremely on their characters and trying to add a second perspective dilludes that.
Not to mention, it wouldnt even make sense.
Artha's story esepecially has no relevance to the Horde so you would just have 2 completely unrelated narratives.

It would be like trying to do The First Avenger and Iron man in 1 movie.
2 different stories of different characters that don't even have relevance within the context of the movie.
Similary the MCu may have standalone movies with heroes that some may not want to see.
They do them anyway for the rest ofthe audience who want to see them.

Let's put it this way: Lothar and Khadgar deserve as much closure as Thrall and Orgrim. If the second movie skips the Second War, Lothar is dead and Khadgar is old. Unless the third movie happens between the first and second one, and that's just weird.

The first movie didn't just introduce the audience to Thrall, there are a lot of characters people will want to see more of, you can't just focus on one and forget about the others.

It would be like trying to do the Hobbit between the first and second LotR movies.

[tangocash]

It's not like they'd skip Lothar(they're not gonna just kill him off without screentime, he was a main character in the first, they're just gonna change lore so he's still alive at this time) and Khagdar, and doubt they'd skip Uther and paladins in general. I like how Jones says he hopes to release a 3hour+ cut on DVD and bluray.

Also I remember reading somewhere Jones would put sacking of Stormwind in the sequel.

You can tell from reading that article he knows his lore though, he knows all about how Alodi was originally an elf male and the "Warcraft comics, where he restructured the transfer ceremony used to link the Council of Tirisfal with the Spearhead, and fought the dreadlord Kathra'Natir, as we all remember."

[Wikiy]

I'm just wondering what's the Alliance counterpart to having Thrall as the Horde point of view. I'd say Turalyon, but that would require Lord of the Clans happening during the Second War, not afterwards. Any other ideas? I don't think they want to drop the two-sided aspect of the first film.

People have this wrong idea that Duncan wants things to be two-sided forever just because he was very clear with regards to the first movie that it's not a one-sided story where humans are the good guys and orcs the bad guys. It doesn't actually mean we wont follow the orcs if they're the more interesting side to follow. If the next movie was going to be two-sided, Duncan wouldn't have focused so hard on Thrall and said what he said in that interview.

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I don't think you want the fans to say "oh, it's the Horde movie, I'm Alliance, so I'll skip that one"

Those people actually exist? Jesus fucking Christ, what a waste of oxygen.

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...and doubt they'd skip Uther and paladins in general.

Why do people doubt stuff like this? I mean, when you're reading a book as a fan of the franchise, of course you'll go batshit crazy over the paladins' creation, but for a movie, such story elements have literally no value. All the value they have is for us to jizz in our pants from seeing holy magic. Anyone else would be: "Alright, so what?" at those scenes. You could say there's value in setting things up for Arthas, but this isn't Game of Thrones, it's not a show where you can afford to take up screen time for seemingly no reason just for something that's gonna happen down the road. We know they wont do that because they haven't done it with Grommash, who may yet be an important character in the next movie and would have benefitted from some exposition (other than being there in a few shots) in the first movie.

[Tempguy]

Those people actually exist? Jesus fucking Christ, what a waste of oxygen.

Why are people on the internet always like this? Who cares if someone isn't interested in an Orc'centric story? No reason to act like their very existence is a waste.

Fans can be the most vile of people.

[tangocash]

I loved the orcs too, and I don't mind Thrall being the lead character but you really think they'd skip Lothar and Khagdar when they've been already set up for a sequel? Lothar's just started the alliance and he's ready to kick some shit in. I find it unlikely they wouldn't include paladins in this one now that they've set up the world. The horde just added tauren in the sequel apparently, and boomsticks aren't gonna cut it.

[Immitis]

Why are people on the internet always like this? Who cares if someone isn't interested in an Orc'centric story? No reason to act like their very existence is a waste.

Fans can be the most vile of people.

yeah, i mean, i wanna see more warcraft no matter what it is. but there are plenty of people who dont give two fucks about one or the other factions story.

i know plenty of people who only play horde, or only play alliance. they have no interest at all in thralls story. as much as blizzard tried to prove otherwise in cata thrall is very much a horde character.

warcraft from the very beginning has always been about multiple sides. if this were mcu levels of security then id be like fine, have your orc story, your elf story, your human story. but it doesnt have that.

i wanna see more of each side

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i do find it interesting that it seems duncans plan has gone from a trilogy ending with thrall to putting thrall in the sequel right away.

i guess he just really wants to do warcraft 3 and knows warcraft might not be a trilogy at this point

[daywalker02]

I hope it does well in Australia and Zealand for Travis Fimmel who is Australian.

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Independence Day in China won't do all too well unlike in North America, presale numbers are low.

NYCSM2 will be a legit threat, with Asian actor in guest role

[Tornwar]

Sooo... according to this article, in an trivia interview with Duncan, he basically "confirms" that the sequel would focus on Thrall and have Orgrim in a teaching role:

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/warcraft/


Also a bit of an old interview with Toby Kebbell:

http://www.craveonline.com/entertain...raft#/slide/10

Says that he wanna audition for Thrall, talks about how he will be different to Durotan and that he wants him to be wilder and also have features that Draka had, not just being a copy of his father.
He also says that he find the Orgrim and Thrall relationship interesting. Back with Orgrim and Durotan, Durotan was the wise teaching character for Orgrim, but those roles would be oppersite with Orgrim and Thrall

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Sooo... according to this article, in an trivia interview with Duncan, he basically "confirms" that the sequel would focus on Thrall and have Orgrim in a teaching role:

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/warcraft/


Also a bit of an old interview with Toby Kebbell:

http://www.craveonline.com/entertain...raft#/slide/10

Says that he wanna audition for Thrall, talks about how he will be different to Durotan and that he wants him to be wilder and also have features that Draka had, not just being a copy of his father.
He also says that he find the Orgrim and Thrall relationship interesting. Back with Orgrim and Durotan, Durotan was the wise teaching character for Orgrim, but those roles would be oppersite with Orgrim and Thrall

I'm assuming that would mean combining the Second War with the Lord of the Clans plot? It'd result in highly disjointed storytelling if Duncan skipped over the stories of Lothar, Khadgar and Taria suddenly ended with the first movie, considering the build up for a direct sequel to resolve their stories.

From the sound of it, I suppose he'd extend the length of the Second War so it covers much of Thrall's childhood? Half the plot would be finishing the story Warcraft film #1 left off on and the other half would be Lord of the Clans.

[Tornwar]

I'm assuming that would mean combining the Second War with the Lord of the Clans plot? It'd result in highly disjointed storytelling if Duncan skipped over the stories of Lothar, Khadgar and Taria suddenly ended with the first movie, considering the build up for a direct sequel to resolve their stories.

From the sound of it, I suppose he'd extend the length of the Second War so it covers much of Thrall's childhood? Half the plot would be finishing the story Warcraft film #1 left off on and the other half would be Lord of the Clans.

I guess that the second war will take place many years after? If they want it to happen at the same time as Thrall growing up, at least being between 15-20 years old

[Val the Moofia Boss]

“If we get the chance to do another one, Taurens would come up – especially in this Spartacus story that we're talking about.” Jones again concedes there are “many restrictions” he has to work within. “But if I can be clever to find a way to get out of the restrictions, or make them work for me, then I'll do that. I'll pitch it to Blizzard and hopefully they'll see the benefits of doing it.”

Hm... as much as I am Tauren fanboy (look at my avatar and siginature!), this would be more difficult than implementing Trolls. Trolls at least, are native to both the Southern Eastern Kingdoms (Gurubashi), so the Horde during the Second War could recruit from or ally with them down there. Thrall's storyline takes place in Northern Eastern Kingdoms, where there are Amani trolls he could recruit from or ally with. Meanwhile, the Tauren are on the other side of the world, on a completely different continent. There were never tribes of Tauren on the Eastern Kingdoms. To pull this off, they'd need to go the Dawnchaser tribe route, and have Tauren migrate from Kalimdor (which was what happened in MoP, with the Dawnchaser tribe moving to Pandaria). I'd be fine with that explanation.

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Says that he wanna audition for Thrall

I WANT THIS SO MUCH! Please make it happen Duncan!

This would be immensely helpful, since not only does Toby know by heart what Thrall's father has been through, he will know how to play his son. He's already prepared for the role, and since it'd be Toby again, Thrall would share his father's resemblance.