Are MMO-Champ LFR players the majority of LFR players?

[Stanzilla]

Do you think that improving gameplay is a priority for players in Raid Finder? I don't. A lot of people play for fun and don't think of it as a self-improvement seminar. You're not wrong but neither are they.

Where I disagree is that you seem to believe that your personal goals and priorities--learning fights and improving gameplay--are correct for everyone. They aren't. And they are not lesser human beings for not sharing your priorities.

It's not the goal but it would be a nice side effect. I mean they already tried it with proving grounds and it did not really work out that great. The biggest challenge for the class balance team is the difference in player skill, that's why they dumbed down class gameplay and moved the difficulty to boss fights, since those can actually have difficulty settings, classes don't. So it would be in their interest du educate players more and help them improve instead of just showing them a slideshow of the lore of a dungeon and tank and spank fights for every single boss.

[BiggestNoob]

It's not the goal but it would be a nice side effect. I mean they already tried it with proving grounds and it did not really work out that great. The biggest challenge for the class balance team is the difference in player skill, that's why they dumbed down class gameplay and moved the difficulty to boss fights, since those can actually have difficulty settings, classes don't. So it would be in their interest du educate players more and help them improve instead of just showing them a slideshow of the lore of a dungeon and tank and spank fights for every single boss.

The psychological concept of flow generally contradicts the claim that people who are low skill who enjoy trivial tasks exist. A survey of a few hundred thousand armories agrees with this (LFR is rarely done by players who are easily seen as low-skilled).

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._skill.svg.png

There's the psychologically rewarding part that involves doing something that's difficult for you and overcoming it, and meditative/zen in doing something that's well below your skill level. Neither of these is really possible in content that you can't really fail when your performance doesn't really matter. Basically, LFR is closer to a movie than it is to a game. Watching mythic boss kills/streams would be more engaging than LFR since there's a difficulty you can see being overcome, so it's in a really awkward position.

[Foj]

If you spend a little time learning how to play I think you'll find that normal feels easier than LFR once you reach a fairly mediocre execution level.

So people who give a shit tell me.

[Khorm]

It's funny when LFR players come into premade groups for things. They think they're immune to any kind of responsibility or proper decorum and then are shocked when they are easily removed by the group leader.

[Deleted]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._skill.svg.png

I don't know where you found this but it has so many caveats. The biggest of all is that some people are more apathetic than others so even if they are less skilled they might still have apathy! But, those concepts in general do have a place if you filter them for the individual properly, I don't claim they are worthless, just that they are tailored to each person individually for the potency of each stage and they are not tied equally to skill or desire for each.

[Foj]

It's funny when LFR players come into premade groups for things. They think they're immune to any kind of responsibility or proper decorum and then are shocked when they are easily removed by the group leader.

It's true, people log in and fire up old episodes of Gunsmoke on their 2nd monitor and eat Hot Pockets and wait for the loot, because the last thing that people want to do when they play a game, is play a game.

[Ulfric Trumpcloak]

I dont like lfr, so obviously i dont do it. I have absolutely 0 reason to hate it, nobody forces you to do it, so why people hate it is beyond me. Its simply an option for the more casual players to experience raids.

[Deleted]

Kinda thinking the same her, because with 500 000 registered users and 35 000 considered active we would ofc not be a majority, even if we all posted here only about doing LFR AND would agree on the subject

Not necessarily because a representative sample is the main method to do polls. Of course, we might not be a representative sample. I won't say the usual "we are more hard core" but we definitely have a lot of users here that simply don't play the game anymore (especially in the general forum).

[Deleted]

I dont like lfr, so obviously i dont do it. I have absolutely 0 reason to hate it, nobody forces you to do it, so why people hate it is beyond me. Its simply an option for the more casual players to experience raids.

Before i get flamed let me say I'm glad lfr is here and I'm looking forward to it in legion.

But this idea that there is NO reason for people to hate lfr AT ALL, they can simply not do it, doesn't work out.
Lfr affects a lot of other raiding and social interactions in the game, if it were removed that would have big implications for the percieved quality of raiding overall as well as the rest of the game.
Would those implications be good or bad? Probably the former for some and the latter for others, but it's not going away so we'll never know anyway

[Osmeric]

Blizzard needs to buckle down, spend the real bucks making some legitimate non-raid content, and re-establish the RPG in the MMO.

This will inevitably mean raid content is reduced on the difficulty modes that remain. The team cannot make $$$ appear out of thin air, and the problem has only gotten more serious as the sub numbers have shrunk.

LFR may eventually go away; if so, it will be cause budgets have shrunk so much they can't make raids at all.

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Battlegrounds, Mythic raiding, Arenas, Rated battlegrounds, Pet battle, and leveling(at launch). A lot of things for players to compete over, I think most players aim for the challenge but end up failing.

Exactly right. "Overcoming challenge" cannot be the reward of a game that has actual challenge, as most players will fail to get the reward that would justify (to them) playing the game at all. It's like a ponzi scheme, where most investors cannot win.

[Deleted]

Ive been thinking about this alot as it pops up every couple of months so here goes.

I've tried to look at it from a casual who doesn't have the time to commit to a regular raids and the raiders.

Legendary/trinkets/tier set bonus

These 3 things are the main reason why most raiders look at lfr negatively because they feel forced to do content that they dont want to do. There should be no surprise that doing content that one group of people dont want to do with another group that do your going to get a toxic outcome.

But if you remove them or negate them so that raiders dont feel forced into doing lfr all the negative feelings will vanish for example. Not adding legendary that involve lfr this will cut the majority of raiders free from doing lfr and what im glad to see legion has done.

Trinkets and tier set bonus arnt as strong as they have been in the passed what will lesson the need to do lfr to get a power advantage in progress and with the the addition of normal mode high end raiders can funnel gear into there toons for progression basically cancelling out the need to do lfr and if you add in the fact lfr is released a month after normal mode gets released i think you can agree why do lfr at all ?

So whats left is the symbol of tier gear some people like me arnt forced to do lfr but go through it to get the re coloures sets as im a transmog addict and sometimes the recolour looks better than the normal/hc version. You also have the entitle group that feel only real raiders should have tier looks but this has causes a negative affect for the people who lfr was designed for.

In legion i feel all or atleast most of the problems have been removed. Raiders arnt forced to do content thats not designed for them just so they can complete there legendary quest. They have normal modes to farm for gear if they are wanting to push progression. Plus with them bring back tier sets the vast amount of people who enjoyed doing lfr for those transmog looks get something to do again.

[kamuimac]

that their opinion is relevant to the LFR scene.

their opinion is as relevant to lfr scene as mythic raiders opinion to mythic raiding scene - its just opinions share on forums - you may agree with it you may disagree with it but at the end of day its nothing more or less then simple opinion //shrug.

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I don't know where you found this but it has so many caveats. The biggest of all is that some people are more apathetic than others so even if they are less skilled they might still have apathy! But, those concepts in general do have a place if you filter them for the individual properly, I don't claim they are worthless, just that they are tailored to each person individually for the potency of each stage and they are not tied equally to skill or desire for each.

i dont understand where the myth of "apathy" of lfr crowd comes from - most of people who are afk in there are not lfr raiders only mythic raiders on their 15th alt onwhich they farm shit for god only know what reason - those who enjoy lfr dont afk only participate in it as its their only for of raiding in game - if im bored i dont log in the game i do something else.

[Deadite]

i dont understand where the myth of "apathy" of lfr crowd comes from -

It comes from the people who are too snooty to do LFR but miraculously think they know everything about it. AFK folk are quickly kicked in any LFR i have ever done and i have done alot.

[Osmeric]

These 3 things are the main reason why most raiders look at lfr negatively because they feel forced to do content that they dont want to do. There should be no surprise that doing content that one group of people dont want to do with another group that do your going to get a toxic outcome.

But if you remove them or negate them so that raiders dont feel forced into doing lfr all the negative feelings will vanish for example.

Or, Blizzard could just stop caring about their so sad hurt feelings.

[roahn the warlock]

Or, Blizzard could just stop caring about their so sad hurt feelings.

Could easily flip that the other way, invalid argument is invalid.

[Osmeric]

Could easily flip that the other way, invalid argument is invalid.

Not really, since Blizzard's capacity to stop caring depends on numbers. The windbags who complain about this are likely to be a small minority; the LFR raiders who quit over garbage rewards are likely much more numerous.

[Mad_Murdock]

It's true, people log in and fire up old episodes of Gunsmoke on their 2nd monitor and eat Hot Pockets and wait for the loot, because the last thing that people want to do when they play a game, is play a game.

OK, I'm gonna stop you right there. NO ONE and I mean NO ONE is firing up old episodes of Gunsmoke AND eating hot pockets. NO ONE!

And then you throw in Playing WoW to that. No sorry, I'll believe in unicorns first.

[roahn the warlock]

Not really, since Blizzard's capacity to stop caring depends on numbers. The windbags who complain about this are likely to be a small minority; the LFR raiders who quit over garbage rewards are likely much more numerous.

I guess you literally missed the point of the thread, and the discussion being had, just so you could come in here and bash raiders. Well put. I can see you are capable of discussion.

[Deathquoi]

Because it indirectly affects the entire game.

It really doesn't. That's only true in your head where someone getting shiny, albeit inferior, epics for doing watered down versions of the content you enjoy is somehow a problem for you.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

I don't know why there are ANY LFR players at all, here or otherwise.
It's like choosing to stay in elementary school.
Surely at some point you want to actually go play the game the way its intended right?
Normal should be easy enough for anyone.
Guess those are the same people acting like Mythic 5 mans are too difficult for them.