Blizzard determined to only make Guardian and Resto viable??

[Vodkatwist]

Question from a non-expert druid player:
how the heck are you supposed to maintain uptime of rip, savage roar and rake when your energy bar is slow as hell?
I tested a bit on the dummy and I simply couldn't keep them up (well, if I renew them at 10+s was doable, but I don't think it's how it works). Sure, not taking savage roar and talenting ferocious' bite 100% refresh on rip could help, but I don't see it as optimal.

[Deleted]

Boomkins are some of the top dps with me in Beta, Feral damn near one shot me in BG.....your post is invalid.

Every single raid testing i've seen so far, boomies are low dps. Dont know who you are raiding with then and how bad they must be.

And as for feral, I am not talking about PvP.

- - - Updated - - -

Please continue to make assumptions about communities because they use things other than MMO-Champion to talk about their spec.

This comes up all the time. And I always get a good laugh about it.

Please give me a site which is not dead then.. I'd like to go there.

- - - Updated - - -

3 posts keyboard turner using major hyperbole without any numbers, parse, logs or sims to back up his claim.

Seems very legit.

I might not have logs or anything, but I just speak from what I read and see on raid testing. Also the little beta play I have done myself. Im sure you would be able to find logs or sims that back this up anyway, just because I have not included it, does not mean that its not out there.

Also, just because I dont have anymore posts before this, i dont think that makes my post invalid. Maybe im a MMO lurker who have gotten tired of seeing the development of the druid spec and decided it was time to log in and start a debate? :/

- - - Updated - - -

Yes. They're only doing it because they hate you, you personally.

I know....

[Arthael]

Question from a non-expert druid player:
how the heck are you supposed to maintain uptime of rip, savage roar and rake when your energy bar is slow as hell?
I tested a bit on the dummy and I simply couldn't keep them up (well, if I renew them at 10+s was doable, but I don't think it's how it works). Sure, not taking savage roar and talenting ferocious' bite 100% refresh on rip could help, but I don't see it as optimal.

Well that's the "balance" bit they are trying to sell.
Savage Roar makes your rotation harder, and you are forced to take either Sabertooth (so pretty much replace Rip for SR) or Elune's Guidance.
It practically nets higher DPS but at the cost of your brain killing itself due to how mundane and obscure it is.

Incarnation, on sims, parses lower BUT with more gear, it might pull ahead at the end of this tier w/ set bonus and legendary. This is pretty much because Shred will have a 100% crit rate within the Incarnation window, so if you orient your stuff to that and maximize the amount of shreds you can put out (with set bonus) inside the Incarnation window, it MIGHT pull ahead or at least be even.

But that's a long way out, unless balancing goes out, you are bottlenecked into SR for this tier.
SR/JW/MoC; SR/EG/BT; SR/ST/BT.
Best, imo, is SR/EG/BT - cause you can pre-load SR and refresh it every second time with EG.

[Deleted]

Every single raid testing i've seen so far, boomies are low dps. Dont know who you are raiding with then and how bad they must be.

Really? I had Beta for a week and used some easier to use talents, so i don't fuck up mechanics and I was still able to be at least in a medium spot.
I think low dps boomies in raid tests are using talents, that they aren't used to, so they fuck up their rotation.
If you get used to the playstyle your dps increases for a good ammount.

[RayenDark]

Question from a non-expert druid player:
how the heck are you supposed to maintain uptime of rip, savage roar and rake when your energy bar is slow as hell?
I tested a bit on the dummy and I simply couldn't keep them up (well, if I renew them at 10+s was doable, but I don't think it's how it works). Sure, not taking savage roar and talenting ferocious' bite 100% refresh on rip could help, but I don't see it as optimal.

If you're feeling energy starved try Soul of the Forrest or if there is an add Predator.

You pool energy. Feral is not a spam spec (Outside of Berserk). Generally you want to pull to 40-50 energy (Or more sometimes) before you act.

With a low 822 ilvl (drops have not been kind) I have no issues keeping up Rake, Rip and Roar. But I've also been maining a feral for a few years now.

[Deleted]

Well that's the "balance" bit they are trying to sell.
Savage Roar makes your rotation harder, and you are forced to take either Sabertooth (so pretty much replace Rip for SR) or Elune's Guidance.
It practically nets higher DPS but at the cost of your brain killing itself due to how mundane and obscure it is.

Incarnation, on sims, parses lower BUT with more gear, it might pull ahead at the end of this tier w/ set bonus and legendary. This is pretty much because Shred will have a 100% crit rate within the Incarnation window, so if you orient your stuff to that and maximize the amount of shreds you can put out (with set bonus) inside the Incarnation window, it MIGHT pull ahead or at least be even.

But that's a long way out, unless balancing goes out, you are bottlenecked into SR for this tier.
SR/JW/MoC; SR/EG/BT; SR/ST/BT.
Best, imo, is SR/EG/BT - cause you can pre-load SR and refresh it every second time with EG.

So then we have a useless "option" in SotF in that tier I guess? Really hope they manage to balance the talents correctly, however, based on their track record so far it might be too much to expect.

[Licketysplit77]

So yeah, as the title says, I wanna hear som thoughts from people on the matter of the two Druid DPS specs as I feel like they are going all the wrong ways..

Feral.... I dont even know what to say.. There is a reason you haven't seen a single feral in any raid testing videos and blizzard seems to not even care about changing anything about this spec.

Boomkin. So weak... Starfall?! jesus... What is up with all these bad changes man.. Feelsbadman

I have always played a Druid, and i want to play DPS. Mostly I wanted to play Feral but its so insanely bad and my other option is getting weaker by the day...


Also, 12 pages on the Feral forum thread here on MMO? clearly a sign that something is wrong (And dont tell me about fluiddruid and all those sites, because they are also dead)

RIP druid DPS

So because your not happy with the state of druid right now you are suggesting Blizzard a sabotaging their own game?
Dont be a Silly Billy
Most classes have a lot of pages of complaints and concerns, things are being addressed and changed on a regular basis. Give t time and judge the finished product.

[zurm]

That's nice, but the guy I quoted acted like it's only rotational things in the beta at this point when numbers have been relatively set with tweaks now.

This is absurd and wrong. Not sure where you get your info (my guess is nowhere, and you just made an assumption), but they've simply been focusing on squashing bugs right now, hence the very minimal balance changes we've been seeing. That doesn't mean they are done by any stretch, and they've already openly discussed major number revisions coming in a few places (such as tank damage in PvP). Number tuning is easy and not likely to cause bugs, so it's the VERY last thing they do prior to an xpac/major prepatch.

[Arthael]

So then we have a useless "option" in SotF in that tier I guess? Really hope they manage to balance the talents correctly, however, based on their track record so far it might be too much to expect.

I doubt there will ever be balance when it comes to passive v. active, as inherently having another button to manage means another chance at derping.
If SotF was equivalent to Inc/SR, why would you ever take Inc/SR?

[Flurryfang]

I have heard people be happy both with how Feral and Boomkin works. If they are on low dmg, then their numbers will be tweaked. Remember! Dmg is not final. They can, and WILL, change a lot of numbers before launch.

[Hekkipekki]

I have heard people be happy both with how Feral and Boomkin works. If they are on low dmg, then their numbers will be tweaked. Remember! Dmg is not final. They can, and WILL, change a lot of numbers before launch.

About balance druid. Alot of people are only fixed on the fact that they spec got the moving eclipse bar removed. But the result of that is a flawed system with the build/spender and how it meshes with the use of starsurge/starfall (stellar flare).
So it's not a complete view alot of people have on balance druid.

[Flurryfang]

About balance druid. Alot of people are only fixed on the fact that they spec got the moving eclipse bar removed. But the result of that is a flawed system with the build/spender and how it meshes with the use of starsurge/starfall (stellar flare).
So it's not a complete view alot of people have on balance druid.

I did not say all, i just said a lot Which is based on some guys directly on the beta, some guys from a couple of guilds in live and some dudes on this forum Some might still see some problems with spender/generater, and how it enteracts with the rest of the build. Im just saying, that i am also hearing happy voices about how the spec works right now in the beta, and that there is just a problem with haste and dmg numbers

[SteveRocks]

So yeah, as the title says, I wanna hear som thoughts from people on the matter of the two Druid DPS specs as I feel like they are going all the wrong ways..

Feral.... I dont even know what to say.. There is a reason you haven't seen a single feral in any raid testing videos and blizzard seems to not even care about changing anything about this spec.

Boomkin. So weak... Starfall?! jesus... What is up with all these bad changes man.. Feelsbadman

I have always played a Druid, and i want to play DPS. Mostly I wanted to play Feral but its so insanely bad and my other option is getting weaker by the day...


Also, 12 pages on the Feral forum thread here on MMO? clearly a sign that something is wrong (And dont tell me about fluiddruid and all those sites, because they are also dead)

RIP druid DPS

1. Your post is extremely vague. Specifically what do you not like about druid dps? Where do you think the problem is?
2. Tuning hasn't happened yet! Why are you getting all worked up about a class on Beta?!?! Beta means nothing jeez.

[Deleted]

I doubt there will ever be balance when it comes to passive v. active, as inherently having another button to manage means another chance at derping.
If SotF was equivalent to Inc/SR, why would you ever take Inc/SR?

Maybe SotF should be changed into something else then that promotes more active gameplay or just give it another niche like better AoE damage. Or just tune it to be equal by making it synergize better with other talent combination that has more active choices. Savage Roar would be there for the players that want to manage multiple buffs/DoTs and like that type of gameplay.

Even by picking all possible passive choices the difference in DPS should not be something ridiculous like 10%+, otherwise what is the point of those talents even existing in the first place if there is no real choice? That's just shitty design that tricks new players.

[teddabear]

Tuning hasn't happened yet! Why are you getting all worked up about a class on Beta?!?! Beta means nothing jeez.

Those who don't remember history are doomed to repeat it.

[Adramelch]

Even by picking all possible passive choices the difference in DPS should not be something ridiculous like 10%+, otherwise what is the point of those talents even existing in the first place if there is no real choice? That's just shitty design that tricks new players.

Because there's casual players (and raiders) that don't care about min-maxing and the just want to do a decent dps with their preferred playstyle (which often involves passive talents etc).

[theburned]

So yeah, as the title says, I wanna hear som thoughts from people on the matter of the two Druid DPS specs as I feel like they are going all the wrong ways..

Feral.... I dont even know what to say.. There is a reason you haven't seen a single feral in any raid testing videos and blizzard seems to not even care about changing anything about this spec.

Boomkin. So weak... Starfall?! jesus... What is up with all these bad changes man.. Feelsbadman

I have always played a Druid, and i want to play DPS. Mostly I wanted to play Feral but its so insanely bad and my other option is getting weaker by the day...


Also, 12 pages on the Feral forum thread here on MMO? clearly a sign that something is wrong (And dont tell me about fluiddruid and all those sites, because they are also dead)

RIP druid DPS

Boomkin is all about FoE, and starfall is merely a buff to your dots.

And as you say, there is basically no amount of data for feral, so why would they believe its weak if their testing/numbers says that its totally fine, and the community provides no numbers, there is 12 pages here and on the beta forums, very little feedback again. If this is the gauge of what speccs are not in good shape wouldn't the 100+ pages on the boomkin thread be more alarming?
12 pages is basically saying "everything is fine don't worry about us."

- - - Updated - - -

Those who don't remember history are doomed to repeat it.

ferals being shafted all the time is because there is so few people playing it in the first place so you are definitely right, turn up the volume to be a vocal minority, or just be a minority that noone cares about.

[Borawa]

Boomkin is all about FoE, and starfall is merely a buff to your dots.

Ya pretty much. Ive been taking feral affinity dotting stuff up starfalling and swiping. Shift out moon spells restarfall if you can reswipe.

[theburned]

Ya pretty much. Ive been taking feral affinity dotting stuff up starfalling and swiping. Shift out moon spells restarfall if you can reswipe.

I can definitely see this being possible, been pulling some solid numbers with feral affinity myself as a resto druid.

[Seikusa]

Sadly PVP is holding pve back and pve is holding pvp back.
They will almost never work two ways.