Why do hunters seem to be extremely dissatisfied with MM?

[Deleted]

I always expected people are mad because MM was a raid/dungeon/pvp spec, and not a leveling one. And even more so in Legion.

[Sencha]

RPPM scales with haste, so we'll also get more and more powerful as you get better gear. We also have a CD, Trueshot, that guarantees Hunter's Mark procs. If you want/if tuning allows you can take the talent Sentinel to generate Hunter's Mark on demand every 20 seconds too (and it has 2 charges). And if you take Sidewinders (which it seems like we will for now at least) it automatically applies the Vulnerable debuff to every target it hits. Waiting for RPPM procs doesn't seem like it will be that big a problem.

Trueshot : 3min CD
Sentinel (2 charges), pure aoe talent. Also means no Patient Sniper : 20sec CD
Sidewinders (2 charges) : 12sec CD

Just tested on ptr yesterday so I'm probably doing it wrong but do we need to estimate when the next autoshot RPPM proc will happen, not to waste a sidewinder charge just before it?

But then if you're out of focus and don't want to waste that sidewinder charge, what do you do?

[Thursley]

I can't tell you the exact way to execute it because I haven't had the opportunity to test it out either. My point was that the tools we've been given seem comparable to what mages had for a similar mechanic.

As for Sidewinder remember that its CD is also reduced by haste, and the 5 RPPM means most Sidewinders will apply Hunter's Mark. If it isn't up you can use Sidewinders anyway and still apply the Vulnerable debuff (normally it's Marked Shot that applies Vulnerable remember), so even if you don't get a Hunter's Mark proc for every Sidewinder you still get the big buff to Aimed Shot damage. I don't know when we'll want to do that versus delaying Sidewinder. If the system isn't entirely straightforward, sounds good to me, it means we'll be making meaningful decisions about our abilities. As long as they get the balancing right.

[Sencha]

I can't tell you the exact way to execute it because I haven't had the opportunity to test it out either. My point was that the tools we've been given seem comparable to what mages had for a similar mechanic.

As for Sidewinder remember that its CD is also reduced by haste, and the 5 RPPM means most Sidewinders will apply Hunter's Mark. If it isn't up you can use Sidewinders anyway and still apply the Vulnerable debuff (normally it's Marked Shot that applies Vulnerable remember), so even if you don't get a Hunter's Mark proc for every Sidewinder you still get the big buff to Aimed Shot damage. I don't know when we'll want to do that versus delaying Sidewinder. If the system isn't entirely straightforward, sounds good to me, it means we'll be making meaningful decisions about our abilities. As long as they get the balancing right.

Ok I think I need to practice a little bit more. I also noticed there is a passive that makes Windburst applies vulnerability as well. At least MM feels better than BM.

Thanks for your answers.

[Brocksley]

I haven't been able to get a feel of the spec yet. It doesn't seem fluid like it does in WoD. If you don't take sidewinders it's even worse. Perhaps I'll get used to it and like it, but I just don't feel it yet.

[Deleted]

Simple
That stacking debuff...If there is something whaty i hate in MM is this
Also focus control is very hard i`m going from periods where i have overfocus and no procs to periods with alot of procs and focus starving because of mark mechanic
Trueshot is complete crap i almosnt dint notice any serious damage increase who i should have for 3 min buff (yea we have trait but will takes ages to get to it)

[xalenthas]

I always expected people are mad because MM was a raid/dungeon/pvp spec, and not a leveling one. And even more so in Legion.

Actually I have found levelling MM far easier than BM on beta, have far more control and pet lives a lot longer.

[Shadow Fox]

A lot of the classes seem... detached with smooth playstyles, or synergy with their abilities.

The large reason for this, is because a lot of the synergy abilities need to be unlocked from the Artifact traits.

Making judgments on a playstyle, fluidity of a rotation, synergy between abilities prior to 110 mostly irrelevant and inaccurate. Which sucks in a few ways for Beta testers... Because they get burned out with how badly some specs play and perform before they get all of the abilities unlocked.

It isn't just limited to Hunters.
Though, Cat Druids still have an insane amount downtime like they do in Draenor...

[Freerunz]

Making judgments on a playstyle, fluidity of a rotation, synergy between abilities prior to 110 mostly irrelevant and inaccurate. Which sucks in a few ways for Beta testers... Because they get burned out with how badly some specs play and perform before they get all of the abilities unlocked.

Looks like you dont know about heroic\mythich raid tests with high ilvl+ full artifact or pvp server with 110 lvl and full artifact traits.

[TOM_RUS]

Because it's piece of crap? Also it's not just MM, whole class is ruined in legion.

[Scarletlion]

Simple. Only 2 words; ''aimed shot''.

It's dead. I don't really care if you have to stand still to cast but it's damage is a joke now.

[chinkeetoes]

Simple. Only 2 words; ''aimed shot''.

It's dead. I don't really care if you have to stand still to cast but it's damage is a joke now.

If damage is the only issue that's easy to fix then :P

[shade3891]

Anyone actually like playing with the "normal" weakness debuff and stacking it three times? :S
I really hate it!

[Freerunz]

Anyone actually like playing with the "normal" weakness debuff and stacking it three times? :S
I really hate it!

Whats the point to play without Patient Sniper when sentinel and explosive shot is much weaker.

[shade3891]

If only Trick Shot and Patient Sniper switched places.

[Scalio]

Anyone actually like playing with the "normal" weakness debuff and stacking it three times? :S
I really hate it!

I actually prefer the normal Vulnerable over Patient Sniper, but that's wrongthink in these here parts. With Sentinel you can stack up Vulnerable pretty quickly, plus it doesn't put you into combat so you can put Sentinel on the target before you attack it. Patient Sniper seems to be in the wrong place in the talent tree because it doesn't have good alternatives. But tuning is still ongoing.

My problems with the spec and class in general are more to do with stuff like: I don't have Freezing Trap as MM (or BM), Aspect of the Turtle is just an all-round inferior version of Deterrence, Aspect of the Cheetah is a 3 minute cooldown, Camouflage is a talent, I don't have Tranquilizing Shot. I liked bringing even a little extra to groups apart from just DPS.

[Sastank]

The changes I dislike most to hunters in general are: AIS not castable while moving. AOTP is gone. AOTC is a shit CD. Deterrence is a CD without charges. Traps are gone unless you're SV. No Kill Shot..

[Norahe]

The changes I dislike most to hunters in general are: AIS not castable while moving. AOTP is gone. AOTC is a shit CD. Deterrence is a CD without charges. Traps are gone unless you're SV. No Kill Shot..

And one of our 3 shots is RNG-based

[Sastank]

And one of our 3 shots is RNG-based

That doesn't bother me as much as being gutted mobility wise because of some fucking "Fantasy" shit. Come on already. At least give us a trade off. But nah. Having NO execute anymore for what? Nothing. They must be living in a fantasy to think that's a good change.

[Norahe]

That doesn't bother me as much as being gutted mobility wise because of some fucking "Fantasy" shit. Come on already. At least give us a trade off. But nah. Having NO execute anymore for what? Nothing. They must be living in a fantasy to think that's a good change.

It feels so dull when playing the spec... If you don't have luck you juste have two buttons to hit. And if taking sidewinders, one of them can be on CD :'(

I miss kill shot too. It added a little enjoyable extra to both gameplay and efficiency