BREXIT - leave or remain?

[Elegiac]

In a Technocracy there can be no Solidarity, Technocracy is the opposite of Solidarity. The working class knew that the Technocrats did not have their interests at heart.

Apparently a 'democracy' in which a referendum brings the near perfect split of the nation to the forefront of discussion is 'solidarity'.

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So willingly and democratically leaving over a period of a few years is now "Threatening the UE"?

It is, yes, because of the precedent it sets.

[Zoranon]

Where does it say that?
There is no clarity whatsoever on the 'notification'.

There is no requirement on it being, official, in writing, or direct to them.
So yeah, the PM saying that the vote must be respected can certainly count.

There are long-standing diplomatic conventions on the meaning of words such as notification. And resignation speech is not it.

[Elegiac]

Well if you rule by taking in account only the interests, but not the wishes of your citizens, you will end up in some form of despotism eventually. Power corrupts and all that.

Hence why I have not advocated for the abolition of representative legislative bodies.

[Mehrunes]

Turkey will join the EU in my life-time, unless they choose not too. That's something many Leave campaigners were also worried about, but if you're going to showcase the legitimate reasons why it can't happen, I can't refute that, because you're right, as of right now at least. But many people, even in your own country, and all over the world don't often vote on facts, but snippets of information that is fed to them.

With the pace their accession is going (and Erdogan is going to slow it down), unless UK citizens are going to live for another 374 years I kinda doubt it. And that's a long time to get educated.

[Kalis]

Le Penn will be the first to speak out against the UK if it suits her populist demographic. You are taking a big gamble here on the good will, the good will of people who are already saying "out is out".

The EU will reform now, to keep others inside and not in the way that you think it will. This again does not bode well for the UK. If the EU appears to be more effective more serving it's member states, the opinion changes fast.

We'll see but i find you're banking on something that won't exist a year from now and the talks will last at least 2.

It is not goodwill, it is the self serving interest of the EU.

Trade deals are designed to serve the interests of both parties, the more successful the UK is the more business it can do with EU member states, the EU is not going to deliberately cripple itself in order to punish the UK, that would be retarded.

[Wildtree]

So have you guys picked a break up song?

I'm thinking Phil Collins - Against all odds
maybe Nelly - Just a dream for the hip young kids?

More like...

[Zoranon]

Hence why I have not advocated for the abolition of representative legislative bodies.

If legislative bodies are not abolished, then chance are, the people will sooner or later elect a government that will destroy your dream system, what then?

[Jakisuaki]

and you know they are BREXIT voters how? did they also type in I'm a leave voter? couldn't it be remain voters asking what happens now that we lost? but of coarse not because that is counter to your narrative that all the leave voters are a bunch of ignorant rubes

It literally says "Top questions on the european union in the UK since Brexit results officially announced".

It's irrelevant whether they voted leave or out, the point is that no one did their research before voting out, which is laughably stupid.

[Slant]

Where does it say that?
There is no clarity whatsoever on the 'notification'.

There is no requirement on it being, official, in writing, or direct to them.
So yeah, the PM saying that the vote must be respected can certainly count.

Yes, the member states notifies. You can argue all you like, but any half assed lawyer will tell you that this basically means, the UK gets to start the clock, nobody else. How they do it is up to them, since it's unspecified. It's expected to be a formal letter, because that's how it's done. But technically, they could just drop the head of a dead horse in the lap of Juncker and tell him to fuck off if that's what they want.

That's how it is. The EU already dismissed your speculation. It's not going to happen.

[Mihalik]

-Or the EU is a real construction based on the will of the people and the beliefs that trade is beneficient to everyone. And then they wont have a problem maintaining most of the trade agreements that were already made.

The point your missing is that your argument goes like this...

-I wanna do whatever I wanna do! Fuck the consequences that it will have on all of ya! Now kneel before MY DEMOCRACY, and AFTER I fucked you all, I demand you to give me free stuff and you not to be angry! Cuz if you get angry and don't give me free stuff than YOU are tyrannical.

It is literally the case of 16 something million who voted for exit now demanding 500 million people in the EEA to bow to their will.

How the fuck is that "democratic"?

[unfilteredJW]

how dare those uncleansed uneducated ignorant rubes make their own decisions don't they know you need to let us ivory tower educated enlighten liberal elitist make the decisions for you

Why should I value something that comes from ignorance?

[Theodarzna]

Apparently a 'democracy' in which a referendum brings the near perfect split of the nation to the forefront of discussion is 'solidarity'.

Technocrats do not always have the peoples interests at heart. A great example is the immigration issue. If you hire maids, then you tend to be very much in the "Bring all the migrants in!" camp, if you happen to work as a maid then your against it because you know that makes your life, your job, that much more precarious. This is why Sir Richard Branson can support bringing in all the migrants from North Africa and the Middle East, he will never personally have to live in those neighborhoods and endure the negative side effects, and he gets a cheaper maid, AND property values stay high as housing is needed, AND he gets to feel good like he was some noble hero who helped people, it just happens to also profit people of his class and benefit them and not cost them anything. This is a policy the technocrats were okay with, but it obviously was a tad self serving on their end to be for it.

Why should those on the bottom rung of society support a class of people or rule by people who have proven they don't give a fuck about them?

[Slant]

What's so good about our deal with the EU? We buy more of your stuff than we sell. We give you lots of money, get nothing in return.

That you have to ask that question tells me two things: 1. You voted Out and 2. Why you voted out. Not why you think you voted out, why you actually voted out. But since the vote's over, I really can't be arsed to teach EU shit to you. Go look it up.

[Deleted]

People are already saying they have a double feeling about this, one thing they don't like it as the EU is weaker as a whole on the other side, they aren't sad the UK is leaving for the reasons you just mentioned.

Verhofstad just said that on the news, i doubt he's the only one also.

Exactly, but how much weaker the EU gets is up to the EU.

They now have the opportunity to keep the lucrative UK market, while having none of the hang ups of having the "whining special snowflake" be a member of the EU. The only way the EU can become weaker is by choosing to damage itself further and cutting itself off from that market prematurely.

[Elegiac]

If the UK was such a pain, and such a whiner and slowing down the EU so much, then the EU should be happy that we've left. Surely?

To be trite, the net benefits of union worth putting up with it.

You don't seem to grasp that this mirrors exactly what goes on in the US currently and historically. There are the economic powerhouses, like California, dead weight like Wyoming, and complainers like Texas. But the United States as a body benefits everyone in the end, and that is worth preserving.

[Deleted]

when news like this comes out. stuff gets hilarious and sad.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/t...g-to-leave-it/

"Even though I voted to leave, this morning I woke up and I just — the reality did actually hit me," one woman told the news channel ITV News. "If I'd had the opportunity to vote again, it would be to stay

Gee, thanks, lady for crashing my stocks and my 401K. I’m not even British, but I’d like to buy a plane ticket just to go over there and slap her.

We've been talking about kicking people "out". What about, if we just sticked to kicking ?

[Mehrunes]

Because doing so would make the European Union look undemocratic, something that is already being criticised for by many political parties among current member states.

It may make EU look bad, but how is that related to democracy? Trade deals aren't up to the citizens.

[Elegiac]

Why should those on the bottom rung of society support a class of people or rule by people who have proven they don't give a fuck about them?

Because the stability afforded by said class of people who may be indifferent still benefits them if only incidentally.

[Deleted]

That you have to ask that question tells me two things: 1. You voted Out and 2. Why you voted out. Not why you think you voted out, why you actually voted out. But since the vote's over, I really can't be arsed to teach EU shit to you. Go look it up.

So basically no advantage with the EU?

[Theodarzna]

It may make EU look bad, but how is that related to democracy? Trade deals aren't up to the citizens.

Considering deals like TTIP are hardly about Trade, and the idea that such things that will become law should have not citizen input doesn't exactly make said institutions seem democratic.