BREXIT - leave or remain?

[Kalis]

This is about politics not the treaty and politics are ugly, I would think that the ugly fear mongering brexit campaign on both sides would have shown you that.

No, this is about trade and the EU will not intentionally handicap its member states to punish an ex-member. The UK and EU can reach a deal that is acceptable to both, because the EU will act in its own self interest and want to keep a major trading partner on its border on good terms.

The UK will not receive all the benefits of membership, but the UK does not want all of them, so being a member will remain attractive to existing members.

The EU will not try to flex its muscles, because it will end up destroying the EU.

[Slant]

Alright, we've got 10 years to negotiate our new trade deals with the EU before we even leave, that sounds great. What was your point again?

LOL, what do you think Argentina would say if the UK wanted a trade agreement? Here's a preview "Nah, we'll wait and see whether or not you gain access to the EU market first". It'll essentially freeze your trade capability until further notice. But hey, 10 years living in uncertainty, that's nothing, eh?

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So... Silly question, but can they re-vote to stay in at some point? I think a nice long period of England in a recession might prove a bit of a motivator to rejoin

Um, in a democracy you usually don't get to do a do-over. They'll be able to make a vote on rejoining, but that would actually start a formal applicatoin process and would take years and YEARS until its conclusion. This "out" vote is pretty fucking final. No going backsies now.

[Deleted]

LOL, what do you think Argentina would say if the UK wanted a trade agreement? Here's a preview "Nah, we'll wait and see whether or not you gain access to the EU market first". It'll essentially freeze your trade capability until further notice. But hey, 10 years living in uncertainty, that's nothing, eh?

Well according to you it'll take us 10 years to leave, so thats 10 years of continuing trading with the EU. So we don't lose anything and we don't gain anything for a decade.

And I don't think Argentina and the UK will be trading anytime soon, for obvious reasons.

[Deleted]

Nope, we have 2 years.

After those two years are up and UK and EU don't come to a conclusions, you're automatically out. Since this is a first time situations, there is a big chance, that won't come true.

We'll see. All divorces are mean and dirty.

[Jotaux]

So I'm not really informed on the whole BREXIT thing, is it correct that the younger generation voted to stay and as it trickled down to the older people they voted to leave?

[RickJamesLich]

Sounds like a revolution is going down in the UK, soon enough America may be having one as well.

[Deleted]

And I don't think Argentina and the UK will be trading anytime soon, for obvious reasons.

Give them their islands back and they might be willing to trade with you.

[ranzino]

AFAIK it's 2 years or nothing. If you cannot negotiate something, you lost it and leave the EU without new agreements.

[Slant]

But Slant just said that it would take 10 years, and he's the expert on the EU.

I've taken that number from a British professor, the video was posted here and he seemed quite competent on the subject. But I've had favourable estimates in major European papers say at least 6 years beyond those 2 years overture. This divorce? It's going to hurt. And it's going to take a long time.

[Deleted]

WTF takes so long? Are they such goddamn slackers? It could be done within 1-2 months if you put some effort into it.
How long did the accession of Crimea into the Russian Federation take? Maybe 2 weeks?

They want to stay in and cause as much damage as possible before they leave. You see until they official declare to leave, they can stay in the EU and receive handouts,snowflake treatment and continue complaining about not being handed everything on a Silver Platter.

That is why people like Juncker are telling the UK to hurry it up and leave. Because they can see that while the UK is still in it they will cause as much damage as possible.

[Deleted]

So I'm not really informed on the whole BREXIT thing, is it correct that the younger generation voted to stay and as it trickled down to the older people they voted to leave?

Thats what polls stated last week, but we haven't seen the actual information of the vote yet.

[Deleted]

For what it's worth..
Perfect summary
http://www.politico.eu/article/how-b...it-referendum/
For now, at this moment, the UK is still a EU member. And that won't change until the UK notifies. Not when the EU feels like it.
Formalities are a thing among nations.

Michael Gove can think whatever he wants, the language is undefined, the EU can deem itself notified whenever it fucking well likes.

[Eviscero]

UK vs. EU. Are people still not able to make that comparison? Keep telling yourself that shit about the 5th largest economy if it helps you sleep at night, but you're missing the point nonetheless...

No, you're missing the point; the second point I made, which you missed because you stopped reading at '5th largest economy.' The EU is weakened by this choice, it's solidity is in question and other members might start thinking seriously about leaving as well. Heard US investor this morning speculating on the next member to put up a leave referendum. Spexit, Frexit, Grexit were all coined.

[Deleted]

This is a rather important moment, a symbolic end to a grand experiment in supranational cooperation and economic integration

Remember the date

[Kalador]

Sounds like a revolution is going down in the UK, soon enough America may be having one as well.

Don't worry to much, no revolution is happening, real revolution are not backed by rich asshole and ''elite''.

[Draco-Onis]

No, this is about trade and the EU will not intentionally handicap its member states to punish an ex-member. The UK and EU can reach a deal that is acceptable to both, because the EU will act in its own self interest and want to keep a major trading partner on its border on good terms.

The UK will not receive all the benefits of membership, but the UK does not want all of them, so being a member will remain attractive to existing members.

The EU will not try to flex its muscles, because it will end up destroying the EU.

The UK has no negotiating power they will have to accept EU's terms, the only leverage you are suggesting they have is to commit suicide.

[Deleted]

Give them their islands back and they might be willing to trade with you.

They can have the Falklands back when they stop giving them stupid names.

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I've taken that number from a British professor, the video was posted here and he seemed quite competent on the subject. But I've had favourable estimates in major European papers say at least 6 years beyond those 2 years overture. This divorce? It's going to hurt. And it's going to take a long time.

So its 10, its 6, its 2.

Just say you don't know, its easier.

[Eviscero]

This is a rather important moment, a symbolic end to a grand experiment in supranational cooperation and economic integration

Remember the date

Very true and well put.

[Slant]

Well according to you it'll take us 10 years to leave, so thats 10 years of continuing trading with the EU. So we don't lose anything and we don't gain anything for a decade.

And I don't think Argentina and the UK will be trading anytime soon, for obvious reasons.

That's 10 years of people not investing in the UK, because they don't know what they're investing in. Are you even aware that German companies are already just maintaining existing investments? They outright said they froze all plans to invest into the UK for the time being. Expect this to happen from all sides. Would you invest in a country going out of the EU if you didn't know how their relationship to arguably one of the two biggest markets on the planet is going to look like? As I pointed out earlier, all bets are off... I sure as heck would put my money in more secure areas until the UK has figured out what it wants to do.

And investments is what keeps an economy greased. You're going to feel this before the negotiations are over, and this is nothing the EU has any control over. This is an automatism of economy that nobody can steer. It'll happen.

[Deletedaccount1]

http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/..._is_not_a.html