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  1. #1
    High Overlord Specialistul's Avatar
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    Thumbs up WoD time travel / alternate universe vs Legion start ( maybe with spoilers )

    Hello friends. I always get confused when time travel and alternate universes are part of the story, so, can someone tell me or redirect me to a video or other source of information as to what happened right after MoP ended, I did some quests about a dragon of the bronze dragonflight that helped Garrosh escape judgement? ( please correct me if I am wrong ) but then come the events in WoD ( I was a returning player mid-time in WoD and really enjoyed it , I ended up raiding hardcore witch I did not plan , I had planned out to be casual ) , so here is where I don't understand because I did the intro quests and scenario of Legion on PTR today and like I was saying in chat hey , guys, why is Prophet Velen here, why is he not dead, did he not die trying to stop the spell cast by Ner`Zhul ? etc.... help me understand.

    Best Regards,

    Specialistul

  2. #2
    The thing to keep in mind is that WoD was both in the past, 30 years or so, AND an alternate timeline, so nothing that happened there affects the past of the main timeline. The Velen that died wasn't the Velen we've known since BC, it was the Velen of a different universe. Our Velen is still very much alive.

    It all happened because Wrathion and a bronze dragon hatched an idea to use Garrosh to form an army of orcs across multiple timelines and unite them to fight the Legion. That plan backfired however, when Garrosh killed said dragon and convinced Grom to form the Iron Horde instead. Then they connect the past of alternate draenor to the present of our Azeroth via the dark portal and then WOD happens.

  3. #3
    Warchief Benomatic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    The thing to keep in mind is that WoD was both in the past, 30 years or so, AND an alternate timeline, so nothing that happened there affects the past of the main timeline. The Velen that died wasn't the Velen we've known since BC, it was the Velen of a different universe. Our Velen is still very much alive.

    It all happened because Wrathion and a bronze dragon hatched an idea to use Garrosh to form an army of orcs across multiple timelines and unite them to fight the Legion. That plan backfired however, when Garrosh killed said dragon and convinced Grom to form the Iron Horde instead. Then they connect the past of alternate draenor to the present of our Azeroth via the dark portal and then WOD happens.
    Yep pretty much this ^

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    The thing to keep in mind is that WoD was both in the past, 30 years or so, AND an alternate timeline, so nothing that happened there affects the past of the main timeline. The Velen that died wasn't the Velen we've known since BC, it was the Velen of a different universe. Our Velen is still very much alive.

    It all happened because Wrathion and a bronze dragon hatched an idea to use Garrosh to form an army of orcs across multiple timelines and unite them to fight the Legion. That plan backfired however, when Garrosh killed said dragon and convinced Grom to form the Iron Horde instead. Then they connect the past of alternate draenor to the present of our Azeroth via the dark portal and then WOD happens.
    great explanation!

  5. #5
    It's easier when understanding the story to just assume that we're continuing from where Pandaria left off. Some orc guy called Gul'dan is back now I guess, because time travel.

  6. #6
    Herald of the Titans Gracin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    It all happened because Wrathion and a bronze dragon hatched an idea to use Garrosh to form an army of orcs across multiple timelines and unite them to fight the Legion.
    Was it confirmed somewhere that Wrathion was involved in the plot? I know the events of WoD only happened because Garrosh and Kairoz teamed up, but I don't remember anything about Wrathion being involved.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Gracin View Post
    Was it confirmed somewhere that Wrathion was involved in the plot? I know the events of WoD only happened because Garrosh and Kairoz teamed up, but I don't remember anything about Wrathion being involved.
    Wrathion was involved in springing Garrosh out of prison in War Crimes. We never see the two together, but it seems he had his fingers in the pot to some degree at least.

  8. #8
    Herald of the Titans Gracin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    Wrathion was involved in springing Garrosh out of prison in War Crimes. We never see the two together, but it seems he had his fingers in the pot to some degree at least.
    Gotcha, I haven't taken the time to read any of the books so every now and again I miss something.

  9. #9
    You can basically forget everything that happened in Warlords of Draenor except that Garrosh dies in Mak'gora against Thrall and the alternate universe Gul'dan is sent to our Azeroth to open the Legion portal at the Tomb of Sargeras.

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    High Overlord Specialistul's Avatar
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    OK , so , should we not be in the alternate universe Garrosh created? did he not change the future with his actions ?

    P.S so at the end of HFC that is where Gul'Dan is sent and not killed by Archimonde

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialistul View Post
    OK , so , should we not be in the alternate universe Garrosh created? did he not change the future with his actions ?

    P.S so at the end of HFC that is where Gul'Dan is sent and not killed by Archimonde
    No, as I explained above, Garrosh didn't travel into OUR past, he traveled back to an alternate timeline, so he didn't change our history. Nothing in WOD changes our history. However, all timelines connect to the same twisting Nether, so Archimonde was able to send Gul'dan to our world through the nether.

  12. #12
    High Overlord Specialistul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    No, as I explained above, Garrosh didn't travel into OUR past, he traveled back to an alternate timeline, so he didn't change our history. Nothing in WOD changes our history. However, all timelines connect to the same twisting Nether, so Archimonde was able to send Gul'dan to our world through the nether.
    so if WoD did not happen, or happend in an alternate universe why should these 2 event be accounted for in the present and current timeline ?

  13. #13
    Legendary!
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    The Velen you saw die was Alternate Universe Velen. Our Velen from what I know didn't even enter the portal.

  14. #14
    The Lightbringer Lady Atia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Specialistul View Post
    OK , so , should we not be in the alternate universe Garrosh created? did he not change the future with his actions ?

    P.S so at the end of HFC that is where Gul'Dan is sent and not killed by Archimonde
    Nope. Nozdormu used his powers to seal off our timeline with the destruction of Deathwing. You can't change our past anymore, only the future (that sounds confusing .... timewalking mess >.<).

    #TEAMGIRAFFE

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialistul View Post
    so if WoD did not happen, or happend in an alternate universe why should these 2 event be accounted for in the present and current timeline ?
    Guldan takes the portal Archimonde created, in Hellfire Citadel, to our timeline to revive Illidan, I believe. I think the portal was supposed to be for a mass invasion of our timeline. Guldan escapes while we battle Archimonde and he revives Illidan as a last ditch attempt to summon the Legion another way.. I think..
    Last edited by Daymanmb; 2016-06-25 at 08:12 AM.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialistul View Post
    so if WoD did not happen, or happend in an alternate universe why should these 2 event be accounted for in the present and current timeline ?
    It's kind of complicated and doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me honestly, but I'll try and elaborate.

    There are many alternate timelines in WoW's setting. However, there is only ONE Twisting Nether. Alll timelines/dimensions connect to the same Twisting Nether. Likewise, this means there is only one Burning Legion. The Archimonde we fight in WoD IS the same Archimonde from Warcraft 3 for example. The Mannoroth we fight is the same Mannoroth from WC 3. When demons die, their souls all go back to the Twisthing Nether where their bodies can regenerate. Demons only truly die if killed in the Twisting Nether.

    Because WoD takes place in an alternate timeline that we travel to via the Dark Portal, nothing that happens there affects our past. But because both timelines connect to the same Twisting Nether, Archimonde was able to send Gul'dan into our timeline. Or at least send him to the Nehter and then Gul'dan traveled to our timeline later, we're not really sure. Think of the Twisting Nether as a chaotic nexus between all regular realities and timelines that can potentially be used as a bridge between them.

  17. #17
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gracin View Post
    Was it confirmed somewhere that Wrathion was involved in the plot? I know the events of WoD only happened because Garrosh and Kairoz teamed up, but I don't remember anything about Wrathion being involved.
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    Wrathion was involved in springing Garrosh out of prison in War Crimes. We never see the two together, but it seems he had his fingers in the pot to some degree at least.
    The part about creating the Infinite Horde was just Kairoz:
    Originally Posted by Micky Neilson
    The Infinite Dragonflight reappearing. As far as everyone was aware, the Hour of Twilight didn't happen, Nozdormu beat evil Nozdormu, and we thought that storyline had ended. But this apparently means it hasn't? Can you go into that or is this something that is super-duper top secret?
    Well, I can speak to the story side of things. I can't speak to the game design part of it. But I can talk about the fact that with Kairoz, for instance, he's still a believer in what the Infinite Dragonflight was even if it's not around. He still has his own viewpoints—and Christie, you can feel to jump in as well—but it's really about Kairoz's viewpoint more so than the Infinite Dragonflight itself or anything with Nozdormu.

    At the end of War Crimes, Wrathion confronts Anduin and knocks him out, saying "I'm the Black Dragonflight now. Protecting Azeroth is my responsibility." And he seems very obsessed with stopping the Burning Legion even if it means wiping out an entire faction to create a super army that is capable of fighting off the Legion. Is Kairoz abusing the relationship to try to make an Infinite Dragonflight again? Or... How does sending Garrosh to an alternate timeline help Wrathion's goals in our timeline? Or is Wrathion off to the side for this expansion and this is something else?
    They're not connected, but Kairoz does find a way to connect them. And that's something that is explored in the Hellscream short story. It's more at this point—once we start getting into the Hellscream short story and everything else—it's really more about Kairoz and his plan than it is Wrathion at that point. (Source)

    Quote Originally Posted by Specialistul View Post
    OK , so , should we not be in the alternate universe Garrosh created? did he not change the future with his actions ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena Emberlin View Post
    No, as I explained above, Garrosh didn't travel into OUR past, he traveled back to an alternate timeline, so he didn't change our history. Nothing in WOD changes our history. However, all timelines connect to the same twisting Nether, so Archimonde was able to send Gul'dan to our world through the nether.
    Garrosh did change the history of the WoD-verse. This was a sticking point with the elemental spirits when he arrived there.

  18. #18
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    Im just curious if Grom will be coming to our Azeroth.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    The part about creating the Infinite Horde was just Kairoz:
    Originally Posted by Micky Neilson
    The Infinite Dragonflight reappearing. As far as everyone was aware, the Hour of Twilight didn't happen, Nozdormu beat evil Nozdormu, and we thought that storyline had ended. But this apparently means it hasn't? Can you go into that or is this something that is super-duper top secret?
    Well, I can speak to the story side of things. I can't speak to the game design part of it. But I can talk about the fact that with Kairoz, for instance, he's still a believer in what the Infinite Dragonflight was even if it's not around. He still has his own viewpoints—and Christie, you can feel to jump in as well—but it's really about Kairoz's viewpoint more so than the Infinite Dragonflight itself or anything with Nozdormu.

    At the end of War Crimes, Wrathion confronts Anduin and knocks him out, saying "I'm the Black Dragonflight now. Protecting Azeroth is my responsibility." And he seems very obsessed with stopping the Burning Legion even if it means wiping out an entire faction to create a super army that is capable of fighting off the Legion. Is Kairoz abusing the relationship to try to make an Infinite Dragonflight again? Or... How does sending Garrosh to an alternate timeline help Wrathion's goals in our timeline? Or is Wrathion off to the side for this expansion and this is something else?
    They're not connected, but Kairoz does find a way to connect them. And that's something that is explored in the Hellscream short story. It's more at this point—once we start getting into the Hellscream short story and everything else—it's really more about Kairoz and his plan than it is Wrathion at that point. (Source)



    Garrosh did change the history of the WoD-verse. This was a sticking point with the elemental spirits when he arrived there.
    Garrosh changed the way things proceeded in the WoD timeline from the point he arrived onwards, yes, but none of that affects the past of our main timeline which is what I was getting at.

    As for Wrathion I'm not really sure how much he knew about Kairoz's plan, only that he was apparently helping him spring Garrosh in War Crimes.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vazruden View Post
    Im just curious if Grom will be coming to our Azeroth.
    I hope not. It was cringe worthy enough that he didn't get so much as a slap on the wrist for all that he did in WoD, deception from Garrosh or no.

  20. #20
    I really feel most of these questions could have been answered if they just pulled Draenor to our universe. Wouldn't it be cool to see Outland from Draenor and Draenor from Outland?

    Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk

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