[Legion] Shadow Priest Discussion

[Dyra]

What if they gave shadow just a direct copy of Holy Nova, but called it Shadow Nova...is that too simple a solution to the aoe problem?

The amount of QQ from the Arcane Mages would be astronomical. And we all know whose side Blizzard would take in the matter.

Having a Void Nova would be cool though. Being a Black Hole would be better.

[davesignal]

Man, it's not even the end of beta yet and I just get so fucking tired looking at my shadow priest. In the context of playing a game, the shit is fucking exhausting and the upside you get from playing it well is nowhere near commensurate with the effort you're putting in compared to other specs.

There's this vast gulf between stuff like Shadow and every other ranged DPS spec, all of which seem to be completely fucking braindead, yet Shadow seems to be at best on par and at worse vastly inferior to them in a variety of areas.

I'm just so tired of this.

[Fleckens]

Man, it's not even the end of beta yet and I just get so fucking tired looking at my shadow priest. In the context of playing a game, the shit is fucking exhausting and the upside you get from playing it well is nowhere near commensurate with the effort you're putting in compared to other specs.

There's this vast gulf between stuff like Shadow and every other ranged DPS spec, all of which seem to be completely fucking braindead, yet Shadow seems to be at best on par and at worse vastly inferior to them in a variety of areas.

I'm just so tired of this.

I dunno, I tried the lfr as shadow and affliction and had pretty comparable dps(shadow slightly higher) on dragon, and way better as shadow on the second(part of the reason for this is that soul effigy was bugged inside and couldn't be targeted, but outside shadow was way stronger as well). Third boss was fairly close, although winning out again due to being better on adds as shadow.

Now perhaps affliction is just garbage as well, but I don't think shadow is too bad off, at least not compared to other ranged specs. Obviously lfr is hardly the best example of how good a spec is, but i've done 5 runs of it now and i've only been beaten by enh shamans, warriors, rogues and hunters.

[davesignal]

That all sounds a bit like the usual variance from boss to boss, but let me ask you: how much effort do you think the afflock, or enhance shaman, or non-assassin rogues have to put in on that stuff? Most of those are pretty brainless. Aff having to multidot is probably the most work out of them all, and half of that is just hitting Seed of Corruption.

[BradySafety]

Maybe it's not the spec for you then?

[Fleckens]

That all sounds a bit like the usual variance from boss to boss, but let me ask you: how much effort do you think the afflock, or enhance shaman, or non-assassin rogues have to put in on that stuff? Most of those are pretty brainless. Aff having to multidot is probably the most work out of them all, and half of that is just hitting Seed of Corruption.

So your issue is not whether we perform as good as them but that we have to put in more effort? I'm sorry to say but Blizzard already stated that they are okay with specs requiring different amount of effort for the same gain. Personally I'm fine with it as well, it's not like you can make bm hunters or frost dk's do 50% of your damage just because they are a lot easier to play. As long as we can perform well assuming we play right I'm pretty happy. I'm even okay with us having little to no aoe as long as we get to be one of the better classes for single target and multi-target fights.

[davesignal]

Maybe it's not the spec for you then?

Maybe not, but it was the spec for me for the last four expansions so I think it's understandable that I'm annoyed.

[Yvaelle]

Guys! They made me an NPC in Val'sharah! I AM SO EXCITE.





Edit: There is also a night elven priestess in the Temple of Elune named Sister Yselle

[Knifttar]

The amount of QQ from the Arcane Mages would be astronomical. And we all know whose side Blizzard would take in the matter.

Having a Void Nova would be cool though. Being a Black Hole would be better.

The black hole spell would even jive with what they have been doing so far, borrowing ideas from Diablo 3.

[l33t]

I love how blizzard apologizers turn to "the class is not for you then" option when they lack what to say. Yeah sure dude, the class is not for us, we enjoyed it for years, and now when we slowly return to mop2.0, the class is suddenly not for us.

@Yvaelle: really? congratulations!

[BradySafety]

I mean he sounds pretty disturbed just by looking at his priest. If he is actually having these hardships in a video game why continue doing that to your self? Some people can't handle change and that's okay. Classes have to evolve and Blizzard can't tailor the spec to everyone's preferences. And no, that's not being a "Blizzard apologizer." That's just fact.

[Alanar]

Guys! They made me an NPC in Val'sharah! I AM SO EXCITE.





Edit: There is also a night elven priestess in the Temple of Elune named Sister Yselle

Well hard time getting your name right then

[Isentropy]

They named a boss after me guys! http://www.wowhead.com/npc=25840/entropius

[Biomega]

So your issue is not whether we perform as good as them but that we have to put in more effort? I'm sorry to say but Blizzard already stated that they are okay with specs requiring different amount of effort for the same gain.

If that was what's happening, we'd be fine with it. Unfortunately, we don't get the same gain, we get less. Doing more and getting less - it's not surprising people are frustrated at that prospect.

[BobAwesome]

They named a PvP season after me huehuehue

[l33t]

I mean he sounds pretty disturbed just by looking at his priest. If he is actually having these hardships in a video game why continue doing that to your self? Some people can't handle change and that's okay. Classes have to evolve and Blizzard can't tailor the spec to everyone's preferences. And no, that's not being a "Blizzard apologizer." That's just fact.

Well, for me when a developer changes his product so much that his old, veteran users have to choose alternatives, that clearly means that a developer fucked up.

A little anecdotal story, just for your amusement, about Bioware and Mass effect games. I've used to absolutely love ME games. I've bought every DLC they sold for every game. I played other Bioware games as well. Then, developers decided to not only end ME3 in a very autistic way, but to also defend their idiotic decision, basically telling everyone who disliked it to go and fuck themselves. Well, artistic vision or not, being able to handle changes or not, but for me it was a last Bioware game I've bought. And I know quite a bunch of likeminded people, quite a lot, actually. So, morale is easy: as a developer, you either earn money, or you spit in faces of your fans. I'm not telling that everything should be feedback-dictated, but making very controversial decisions which are like 50/50 love/hate for your fans, never grant you profits in a long term.

[Deleted]

Lamest excuses ever " The class is simply not for you" " Blizzard has to evolve their classes"

The problem is that all the Shadow problems in WOD where not fixed in Legion:

> No Burst, new changes add more ramp up time ( at least in WOD you had some sort of direct damage with CoP )
> No decent AoE

but just added more problems:

> less selfhealing
> less mobility
> less survivability
> worst questing experience.
> "IMO" weaker multidot as you are capped to 3 targets in a raid fight, 4 dummies.


Although I like the change to sinlge target, but only for longer fights.

But I will probably (90%sure) that I'll reroll, as I just don't have the mental strength to go another expansion with a spec that simply doesn't perform to the same level in every thing as other specs, and yet requires a lot more effort.

Questing is the most painful I've ever had in this game.
I feel useless in dungeons, except for bosses or very high HP mobs, and the highter gear of people, the more useless I'd feel.

I loved this spec since I discovered this game back on very shittie private server in 2005 and I've played it ever since, never had the slightest thought of playing something else.


BTW the only reason why Shadow Priests this time around are being turned into a VOID Priest, is so blizzard can use the Shadow theme for sub rogue.


Thank you guys, good luck and have fun

[Dontrike]

I mean he sounds pretty disturbed just by looking at his priest. If he is actually having these hardships in a video game why continue doing that to your self? Some people can't handle change and that's okay. Classes have to evolve and Blizzard can't tailor the spec to everyone's preferences. And no, that's not being a "Blizzard apologizer." That's just fact.

Difference is that they seem to be catering to far less people than they should be with shadow right now. Shadow has to be in the worst spot I've seen it in since Vanilla, and that was when we had a buff that increased our attack poewr. It takes quite a while to kill even one mob, and taking on three is almost like I was killing an elite way back when. I didn't like CoP personally, but even I know that offered something the class didn't have.

I have to use a bodyguard just to get by on Beta, and this is just ilvl 805 or so. I shouldn't be having that much trouble compared to every other class. I shouldn't struggle with 3 mobs while other classes tear down those same 3 in far less time and can take on more mobs. I shouldn't need to bring a bodyguard just so I can take down mobs in a decent amount of time.

Yes, it may not be for some people, but it does feel weird to alienate those that have been playing shadow for years. I've been doing it since 1.3 and some of these changes do more than figuratively hurt me. Why bring down SW: P's duration? Why is our self healing, which was one of the highest, suddenly one of the lowest, even VE doesn't work while we level, at least it hasn't worked when I used it. Our ramp up time is even longer than it was before, there isn't a reason why we do less dps outside of Voidform while other classes get various cooldowns. Our AoE is somehow worse than it has ever been, even more so than WoD.

Honestly I don't get why they feel we couldn't be top DPS for once, but instead nerf after nerf and even nerfing our worst areas.

[Fleckens]

If that was what's happening, we'd be fine with it. Unfortunately, we don't get the same gain, we get less. Doing more and getting less - it's not surprising people are frustrated at that prospect.

Do we though? As I stated lfr is far from the perfect way of testing things but it's still something, compared to you doomsayers who just complain without actually having anything to back up your arguments. If things are as bad as you say, please do show me how it is. On every boss i was able to stay in top 3 on damage and even looking over a lot of logs it doesn't seem like It would have been any different in other groups either. And it's not like my priest is well optimised either, i only just barely hit 110 on it, only got 11 traits in my weapon.

[l33t]

Do we though? As I stated lfr is far from the perfect way of testing things but it's still something, compared to you doomsayers who just complain without actually having anything to back up your arguments. If things are as bad as you say, please do show me how it is. On every boss i was able to stay in top 3 on damage and even looking over a lot of logs it doesn't seem like It would have been any different in other groups either. And it's not like my priest is well optimised either, i only just barely hit 110 on it, only got 11 traits in my weapon.

Define top 3, because situation like:

Mage [|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||] 40% total damage done
Warrior [||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||] 37% total damage done
Shadow priest [|||] 7% total damage done

is us being top 3 as well.

Also, while raid damage and stuff is unknown, questing felt awful even for my awesome, geared copied from live 740+ priest. For 680 premade character it was a fucking disaster. I killed one mob while everyone else killed five or more on 680 premade. I was killing one mob while everyone killed three on my 740+ priest. And this fucking selfhealing pauses are simply the worst. Killed a mob? Stand and cast 2x shadowmend. Killed a mob? Stand and cast 2x shadowmend. Arrgh.