1. #16281
    Scarab Lord Frontenac's Avatar
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    I hope people will stop predicting Lady Stoneheart's introduction in the show. I mean, it's been what, three seasons already, that people claimed she would appear on Episode 10? Well, she wont. Stop it. There's no point in introducing Lady Stoneheart now that Walder Frey is dead and the Starks are back in Winterfell.
    "Je vous répondrai par la bouche de mes canons!"

  2. #16282
    There were explanations of Lyanna's "kidnapping" in the show, several times in fact. A careful watcher wouldn't have to read the books to know who Lyanna is, who the kid is and who's the father. There is no reason to discuss this matter. If people didn't watch the show carefully or just don't remember facts from it, it's their own fault.

    That aside, the episode was just great at all fronts. In a few smart moves they managed to tie up every major plotline and explain a few plotholes. I was always going on about Dany's fleet and how impossible it was to carry her whole army across the Narrow Sea. Well... If you watch the last scene closely, you'll see Martell and Tyrell sails on some of the ships. My opinion of D&D's writing improved greatly. They really messed up some of the plotlines, but they did so knowing they only have 14 episodes left after this season. They pretty much had to do this. They didn't have the screentime for intricate Dornish master plans, they didn't have time for Victarion/Euron drama - generally speaking, they didn't have time for plots good on their own, but irrelevant to the great picture in the show.

    So they wrapped up or didn't even bother with smaller plotlines in this season simply to have time for the most important stories in the last 2 seasons. We only have 4 opposing fronts right now. Dany has the support of Martell girls and Olenna (who is all that's left of Tyrells in the show), and they SEVERELY overpower whatever forces Cersei could muster. That is assuming she's not killed by Jaime even before Dany gets to Westeros. I'm afraid Jaime might end up as the commander of Cersei's army in the end, and Dany will go Field of Fire on him. Afterwards Tyrion will be the one killing Cersei. Freys will pretty much consume themselves with infighting after Arya killed the 3 main Walders, so I guess in the end Dany will restore Tully's rule in the Riverlands. This ties up the southern plot.

    The northern plot is all about the Others now. I'm sure the Wall will fall in the opening of the next season. The living side is massively outnumbered. I don't think we will get one big battle in the North, it will be a series of battles, and the northerners will keep getting beaten. It will continue for the whole next season and the majority of the last, until Dany completes the southern plot. As for the final battle... I don't think either Dany or Jon survive.

    Littlefinger is the biggest unknown. What does he do now? He's quite safe, since Dany will soon get to Westeros and Cersei won't be able to move North against them. But Littlefinger isn't the one to care about humanity. He won't want to fight the Others, there's no chance he can become the king by fighting them, especially not when he's just a supporter to Jon and Sansa. I think we might get the "Ghost of Winterfell" scenario next season, but it will be Littlefinger behind this, as opposed to... well, we don't know who it is yet in the books. Littlefinger will be the biggest liability of the northerners in their fight against the Others, I guess. I won't really be surprised if the northerners actually lose because of him.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
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  3. #16283
    Shouldn't Jon Snow have blonde hair if he's Lyanna and Rhaegar's son?
    .

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  4. #16284
    Obnoxious Patriots Fan Darth Belichick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Shouldn't Jon Snow have blonde hair if he's Lyanna and Rhaegar's son?
    Blonde hair is recessive. As long as Lyanna has presumably no blonde gene, Jon would have brown/black hair.

    As for Sansa, I just rewatched the episode. She very clearly is happy for Jon. Her face turns cold when she is staring at LF who she knows is scheming o is holding something back.

  5. #16285
    Damn, I was hoping the writers were just going to ignore Dorne from now on. Maybe have a character mention in passing that it was destroyed in a freak tidal wave.

    They've been written into a corner now where it's beyond believable that anyone would trust or ally with them at this point. Why are all the people there even following her as a new leader? She's never shown any real political or military knowledge, sklls or interest before. It's just embarrassing writing.
    BASIC CAMPFIRE for WARCHIEF UK Prime Minister!

  6. #16286
    LF likely isn't going to give up on Sansa, especially now that Jon accepting KINGINDANORF could be seen as a betrayal of sorts. He had just told her how he thought she should be Lord of WF and then just accepts Lord with no grief about it.

    LF is going to try to play her emotions. In the very least he could arrange a marriage between her and Robyn and oops! Robyn dies. Then they marry. Whether or not that would actually all happen is another thing of course.

    I think that Sansa will be mad but ultimately see the greater good i.e. Family, unity against the WW, etc

  7. #16287
    Quote Originally Posted by Okacz View Post

    The only bad thing was probably the "waste your precious 5 minutes here" segment with Sam and Gilly. Yes, you went to a place with books Sam, nice job. Glad you stole a sword in the previous episode. Could you kindly move, so we can see some more dragons and murder?
    At the very least, Sam is going to places that look interesting. Hornhill looked cool and now this place. The waste your time segment in this episode was surely the scene with Dany and Daario. At least Sam might have a chance at finding critical information to use later on. Daario is just boned.

  8. #16288
    Quote Originally Posted by Okacz View Post
    The only bad thing was probably the "waste your precious 5 minutes here" segment with Sam and Gilly. Yes, you went to a place with books Sam, nice job. Glad you stole a sword in the previous episode. Could you kindly move, so we can see some more dragons and murder?
    LOL Yes. I don't think many people are going to remember this episode for the epic "Sam visits the library" scene.
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  9. #16289
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    I still think that the battles with the undead are going to have to be horribly written and demand a lot of derp-moments out of the characters in order to make any sense at all.

    I mean, there are a lot of them, and they're durable fuckers, but they have no response to dragons at all and even the people in the North right now have a lot of time to prepare suitable defenses. (Fire, anti-infantry weapons since they'll just mindlessly run right into shit, etc)
    Yeah, they are durable and there's so many of them. The Others also control ice (and possibly the weather), so it's not like they can't work around the living side's defenses.

    Quote Originally Posted by rogueMatthias View Post
    Damn, I was hoping the writers were just going to ignore Dorne from now on. Maybe have a character mention in passing that it was destroyed in a freak tidal wave.

    They've been written into a corner now where it's beyond believable that anyone would trust or ally with them at this point. Why are all the people there even following her as a new leader? She's never shown any real political or military knowledge, sklls or interest before. It's just embarrassing writing.
    If you've read the books, there's a lot of quotes (especially in Arianne's chapters) implying that Doran has extremely low support in Dorne and that the majority of the Dornish are in favor of war. Ellaria and the Sand Snakes are giving them just that and more - they are giving them revenge for Oberyn, and more importantly - they are allying with Dany. Both in the books and in the show, the Dornish are secretly loyal to Targaryens.

    Despite generally shitty writing concerning Dorne's plotline, despite ignoring the so-called Dornish master plan theory, I don't think it deviates so much from what Martin himself has planned for it. The exception may be that it's Arianne, not Ellaria, ending up as the ruler of Dorne in the books.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  10. #16290
    Scarab Lord Frontenac's Avatar
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    Now that all potential heirs to Highgarden are dead, I wonder who will rule over the Reach? They seem to show that Olenna is ruling, but she is not really a Tyrell, she's a Redwyne. Still, even if her rule is accepted, she has no heir. I believe the Florents have some claim, but apart from Selyse, we haven't met much of them yet. Well, after verification, we have met Melessa Florent, wife of Lord Randyll Tarly... That could make Dickon a potential heir to Highgarden.

    Anyway, there's a potential for some strife over succession in the Reach.
    "Je vous répondrai par la bouche de mes canons!"

  11. #16291
    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Shouldn't Jon Snow have blonde hair if he's Lyanna and Rhaegar's son?
    Do you mean white? And... no, why would they?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Belichick View Post
    Blonde hair is recessive. As long as Lyanna has presumably no blonde gene, Jon would have brown/black hair.
    No, this is a common misconception about both eye color and hair color. In reality, neither are attributed to a single gene. Two blonde parents can have darker haired children, for example. It's still not 100% understood what genes are involved and how it works, so using genes as anything more than a rule of thumb is pointless.

  12. #16292
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Belichick View Post
    She very clearly is happy for Jon. Her face turns cold when she is staring at LF who she knows is scheming o is holding something back.
    When Lady Mormont (Hallowed be Her name) said "Ned Stark's blood runs through his veins" as her support for Jon Snow, I immediately thought "is Littlefinger going to use the L+R = he's not Ned's son as a way to dispute Jon's claim?"

  13. #16293
    Scarab Lord Frontenac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Mankrik View Post
    When Lady Mormont (Hallowed be Her name) said "Ned Stark's blood runs through his veins" as her support for Jon Snow, I immediately thought "is Littlefinger going to use the L+R = he's not Ned's son as a way to dispute Jon's claim?"
    I doubt anyone outside Ned and Howland Reed knows the truth. Speaking of Howland Reed, I half expected to see him in Winterfell this episode.
    "Je vous répondrai par la bouche de mes canons!"

  14. #16294
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    Quote Originally Posted by rogueMatthias View Post
    LOL Yes. I don't think many people are going to remember this episode for the epic "Sam visits the library" scene.
    I allways will. But Im also a Bookworm

  15. #16295
    Just realized how the Red Keep will blow up. Cersei uses it as a final ace up her sleeve to take out Daenerys but it ends up having no effect since she's immune to fire.

  16. #16296
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Yeah, when the show does something like, "Oh no, it's a blizzard! The dragons can't fly, they have to land! Oh no, they turned one of the dragons somehow since they had to land, now the dragons have to fight that other dragon and oh no, they mortally wounded each other and blah blah blah." it's gonna piss me off.
    I doubt it's going to come to that, I rather meant that whatever defenses the northerners could muster (mostly revolving around fire, since there really isn't any other reliable defense against the Others - they don't have access to a thousand valyrian swords and infinite supply of obsidian arrows), the Others could probably counter. I doubt they have any counter against dragons, though. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontenac View Post
    Now that all potential heirs to Highgarden are dead, I wonder who will rule over the Reach? They seem to show that Olenna is ruling, but she is not really a Tyrell, she's a Redwyne. Still, even if her rule is accepted, she has no heir. I believe the Florents have some claim, but apart from Selyse, we haven't met much of them yet. Well, after verification, we have met Melessa Florent, wife of Lord Randyll Tarly... That could make Dickon a potential heir to Highgarden.

    Anyway, there's a potential for some strife over succession in the Reach.
    Olenna teamed up with Dany, and it's pretty obvious Dany doesn't care about lines of succession. I could easily see Sam as the new lord of Highgarden. I don't think Olenna would mind that much, she is a great judge of characters and Sam is much more than he looks. There would be strife since Randyll Tarly wouldn't like Sam being his new overlord, but I can easily see Randyll trying to seize power in the Reach for himself and Dany punishing him for it. Dickon Tarly didn't seem like he doesn't like Sam, so I doubt he'd have problem with being his vassal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  17. #16297
    Quote Originally Posted by ArgonaZe View Post
    Still a happy ending, which isn't really what Martin goes for. And I really hope he doesn't.
    Dany wouldn't even survive the WW if it was up to me, and I admit I will be guted if she has a happy ending.
    Well someone has to win the war eventually

    He can pull off a card and have an opportunist kill her and the others or some shit.
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  18. #16298
    Herald of the Titans Lotus Victoria's Avatar
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    I'm still laughing about that window scene. It was funny as hell!


  19. #16299
    Scarab Lord Frontenac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    I doubt it's going to come to that, I rather meant that whatever defenses the northerners could muster (mostly revolving around fire, since there really isn't any other reliable defense against the Others - they don't have access to a thousand valyrian swords and infinite supply of obsidian arrows), the Others could probably counter. I doubt they have any counter against dragons, though. :P



    Olenna teamed up with Dany, and it's pretty obvious Dany doesn't care about lines of succession. I could easily see Sam as the new lord of Highgarden. I don't think Olenna would mind that much, she is a great judge of characters and Sam is much more than he looks. There would be strife since Randyll Tarly wouldn't like Sam being his new overlord, but I can easily see Randyll trying to seize power in the Reach for himself and Dany punishing him for it. Dickon Tarly didn't seem like he doesn't like Sam, so I doubt he'd have problem with being his vassal.
    Sam is fine, but he renounced any claims to succession when he took the black. Now that he is to become a maester, you can double the renouncement. That's why I mentionned Dickon.
    "Je vous répondrai par la bouche de mes canons!"

  20. #16300
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    Shes certainly not doing a bad job. And I wont go on about it. But I don't understand why so many people think shes awesome. Its so staged and set up.
    Really a TV show about incest, dragons, and zombies is staged and set up? ok, thx.
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