Legion's long wait

[Grosbill]

They encounter issues they didn't plan having for the fourth expansion in a row. For WoD it was "the team is so big, we are spending half of our time training the newcomers" (BS)

As a software project manager, it happens all the time. There are thousands of things that can seriously delay a project. Remember that Legion was already in development when WoD launched. Look at Overwatch, despite the hige turmoil, the problems, the delays, the retooling and co, they still managed to release something widely successfull.

Hiting roadbumps that delay your initial planning is extremely common in software development and it affects every single dev.

As the great Miyamoto once said, a delayed game can eventually be good, a rushed out broken game is bad forever.

[Fabinas]

When you consider that virtually all of Wrath's release raid content consisted of a recycled Naxxramas, no, it doesn't.

Wrath had a strange content cycle. Started with Rehashed Naxxramas (and smaller Malygos/Sartharion content), but followed with one of the best raids evr (imho), Ulduar. Then they gave us the Argent Tournament Coliseum (which was just 6 encounters in 2 different settings, Coliseum and Anub'arak cave, deffo lazy job) and after that 3 awsome instances and ICC, a very good raid. They were probably working on the better parts when they gave us lazy content and vice versa.

Oh i forgot Ruby Sanctum as well, another lazy job before Cata :-P

[Grosbill]

Wrath had a strange content cycle. Started with Rehashed Naxxramas (and smaller Malygos/Sartharion content), but followed with one of the best raids evr (imho), Ulduar. Then they gave us the Argent Tournament Coliseum (which was just 6 encounters in 2 different settings, Coliseum and Anub'arak cave, deffo lazy job) and after that 3 awsome instances and ICC, a very good raid. They were probably working on the better parts when they gave us lazy content and vice versa.

The 3 instances and the ICC raid were late and the ADT was a stopgap raid done to achieve two goals :

1 - Give people some content to tie them over till the rest was ready
2 - Calm down the Anub'Arak fanboys who were outraged he was merely a 5 man endboss (strangely enough they didn't mind those people for Ner'Zhul).

[Hexxidecimal]

Wrath had a strange content cycle. Started with Rehashed Naxxramas (and smaller Malygos/Sartharion content), but followed with one of the best raids evr (imho), Ulduar. Then they gave us the Argent Tournament Coliseum (which was just 6 encounters in 2 different settings, Coliseum and Anub'arak cave, deffo lazy job) and after that 3 awsome instances and ICC, a very good raid. They were probably working on the better parts when they gave us lazy content and vice versa.

Oh i forgot Ruby Sanctum as well, another lazy job before Cata :-P

But even lazy content is content. Wrath was packed full of goodness. Sure it had some lazy stuff in there but it wasn't all together bad. I enjoyed the Argent Tournament. There was just a TON to do in wrath. I think we ran Ulduar throughout the entire thing too cause it was damn fun and the challenge modes, even in ICC gear were still pretty challenging.

[Grosbill]

But even lazy content is content. Wrath was packed full of goodness. Sure it had some lazy stuff in there but it wasn't all together bad. I enjoyed the Argent Tournament. There was just a TON to do in wrath. I think we ran Ulduar throughout the entire thing too cause it was damn fun and the challenge modes, even in ICC gear were still pretty challenging.

You probably ran it for more maces

And the mounts which were 100% drop till the expansion patch hit

[Hexxidecimal]

You probably ran it for more maces

And the mounts which were 100% drop till the expansion patch hit

Mounts and achievements for mounts mostly. But it was always fun. I really like Ulduar.

[In Ogres We Trust]

I get that you don't want yearly expansions, but that isn't the point of this thread. It is about Blizzard's explanation for this long Legion wait.

Blizzard's explanation for the long Legion wait is that they thought they could deliver on yearly expansions, but it failed miserably.

Blizzard had just come out of a 26 month expansion with MoP. Why would they even think that a yearly expansion would be achievable at that point? It took them 26 months of MoP to deliver WoD, and they thought that all of a sudden it would only take 12 months to make expansions?

I'm very sceptical of this explanation. I find it hard to believe that they would not have known that they were unable to deliver an expansion 14 months quicker and in less than half the time than the one they just did. I feel like there is another explanation for Legion's very long wait that they are just not sharing with us. Possibly internal chaos.

They've already stated that the yearly expansion concept is not applicable, i.e. they were being pushed by upper management to do yearly expansions. As a result, what's the point of this thread?

[SoulSoBreezy]

They've already stated that the yearly expansion concept is not applicable, i.e. they were being pushed by upper management to do yearly expansions. As a result, what's the point of this thread?

There're a lot of folks who seek out a "truth" that validates their feelings, as opposed to taking official responses at face value. It feels good to feel right.

[Deathquoi]

I wish people would stop talking about how "Legion looks to be magnificent and full of content!". This is exactly what people said about WoD and then after 2 months, you were done. Tell me how amazing Legion is 6 months into it going live and then we'll talk.

Also, the devs they got added to the team weren't really "new", per sé. They were just from other teams so used to working with whatever systems Blizzard use (ofc they will be somewhat different from game to game). The training time for them was for WoD. They should be fully up to speed now and creating content for Legion. And, if they have sense, they'll not just front-load the expansion to make it look amazing and will instead spread the content out.

I never said WoD looked full of content. It became very apparent as release approached that they were slashing content like crazy. I've seen nothing of the kind with Legion. But the idea that nobody can be excited about Legion is asinine.

I think Legion looks awesome. What I've seen of the new systems leads me to believe I won't get bored quickly with Legion like I did with WoD where they replaced all the actual content aside from raids with Garrison missions.

[Deathquoi]

Where was I talking about you specifically? I said "people" rather than "everyone" for a reason. I also never said people couldn't be excited about Legion. Never even insinuated the thought. I simply pointed out how people said WoD looked amazing based on beta and it turned out pretty badly.

You said people shouldn't say "Legion looks magnificent"...

[l33t]

While Blizzard has never been nearly as irresponsible as Molyneux, they've long been guilty of a degree of the same type of thing. They talk about their EXPECTATIONS, or "hopes", for what their expansions will be in order to provide a focus for gamer hype (and increased subscriptions), and in order for the development team to have a goal to work toward.

Well I am sorry but for some reason such way of selling things have a very exact name - scamming - everywhere, except for gaming industry. Why does not it considered scamming in game industry as well? Because we let it happen. We repeat same mistake of buying not the product which was advertised to us, but something that remotely looks like the product which was advertised to us. You know, in Molyneux case, you were advertised a Tesla car, and instead get a wooden horse. In Blizzard's case you were advertised a Tesla car, and instead get a Volkswagen van. But in both cases you didn't get a Tesla car, which was advertised to you, and info you get in that advertisement was a decisionmaker in you buying the product or not. So, basically, you're being scammed.

[Deathquoi]

No. I said:

And followed it up with more context about WoD.

I didn't just say people should have no excitement for Legion.

Ok then, but Legion objectively looks to have FAR more content than WoD so I'm not sure how one affects the other.

[Bosen]

Blizzard doesn't answer to us,every step of the way.
I'd prefer their old,famous line:"When it's ready."
I'd just go back to that and fuck your release date. I'd talk about it when everything was within sight,but I'm an idealist asshole.

It doesn't matter why or if you believe the why that was given. It's not even our business. If you hold stock in Blizzard,then I apologize.

[styil]

They've already stated that the yearly expansion concept is not applicable, i.e. they were being pushed by upper management to do yearly expansions. As a result, what's the point of this thread?

Yeah, after the fact (or so they say). Why did they not realise that yearly expansions were not going to happen during the 26 month MoP expansion? Why did they make us suffer through 22 months of WoD? The Alpha + Beta alone is almost a year. They know this. It just doesn't make any sense that they truly believed that Legion would be out in a year knowing what they know about expansion cycles.

- - - Updated - - -

There're a lot of folks who seek out a "truth" that validates their feelings, as opposed to taking official responses at face value. It feels good to feel right.

They just come off of a 26 month expansion. Do you really think that the devs were all sitting around after that and going "ok guys this expansion will be 12 months long", then 12 months later going "ok dangit I really thought we could do this. Looks like we need another 10 months afterall"? How could you be that off base with your timeline after 10 years of making expansions? Just the Alpha + Beta alone is almost a year, then add in patch content and actually developing the expansion, we're at the 2 year mark. I really cannot imagine any scenario where they genuinely believed that a yearly expansion was realistic and achievable after 26 months of MoP.

[SoulSoBreezy]

They just come off of a 26 month expansion. Do you really think that the devs were all sitting around after that and going "ok guys this expansion will be 12 months long", then 12 months later going "ok dangit I really thought we could do this. Looks like we need another 10 months afterall"? How could you be that off base with your timeline after 10 years of making expansions? Just the Alpha + Beta alone is almost a year, then add in patch content and actually developing the expansion, we're at the 2 year mark. I really cannot imagine any scenario where they genuinely believed that a yearly expansion was realistic and achievable after 26 months of MoP.

IMO it's a waste of my time to speculate such a topic, as well as try to make excuses for them. There're certain things I understand about development though, but why argue my perspective versus someone's opinion?

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

Sure, the explanation isn't good or even probably credible but who cares? The wait ends in 8 weeks.
Its not like the expansion is shit either.

[Pull My Finger]

I feel like there is another explanation for Legion's very long wait that they are just not sharing with us. Possibly internal chaos.

And if it is so, it's none of your business and most certainly nothing they would or should have to share with you.

Also: content drought whine at this point, now that the xpac is around the corner? Please.

[styil]

IMO it's a waste of my time to speculate such a topic, as well as try to make excuses for them. There're certain things I understand about development though, but why argue my perspective versus someone's opinion?

I don't think it is a waste of time. Unless we know exactly why it took 14+ months to release this expansion, and the measures they have taken to ensure that it won't happen again, then it's more than possible that it will keep happening (perhaps even moreso).

Sure, the explanation isn't good or even probably credible but who cares? The wait ends in 8 weeks.
Its not like the expansion is shit either.

I would guess that anyone who cares about waiting 14+ months for an expansion cares about their explanation. Their flimsy explanation has done nothing to ease my concerns about the current 14+ month content drought, let alone anything to ease my concerns about future content droughts. In fact I am even more concerned after this flimsy explanation.

And if it is so, it's none of your business and most certainly nothing they would or should have to share with you.

Also: content drought whine at this point, now that the xpac is around the corner? Please.

I think the extreme delay of Legion is most certainly my business. And Blizzard agrees, as they've attempted to justify this very long wait for Legion (albeit with a very flimsy justification). Hence the point of this thread.

[RedGamer030]

Legion took longer than expect to release and Warlords of Draenor was originally planned to last a single year. Blizzard has stated this multiple times now, but who I am to think random internet trolls on the forums actually go in search of information to educate themselves before spewing hate and lies all over the internet because their touchy feelings got hurt?

[Sentynel]

I am more surprised at you people still making threads and acting surprised at content droughts and long x-pacs when that is what you have been getting since...well...at least TBC. And you got it in every x-pac. Yes. TBC had 9 months of BT.

Yeah but in TBC there were 6 (Kara, Maggy, Gruul, SSC, TK, Hyjal) other raids that players can progress/farm, comparing to WoD's 3 raids where people just rush through the tier in a matter of weeks.

Times change. Players consume content faster than ever before.